Maintenance ? on certain steels.

Thanks everyone for their suggestions and comments. Now I understand what you were saying HeavyHanded and I can check them out to see what they are. I have the 5 stone Lansky sharpener and they have a 30, 25, 20, and a 17 but not sure if I could sharpen anything that low (17) but I would try. The other two are easy to do. What would you folks suggest with the angles that I have?
I cannot believe it but I got the order today. I ordered them on Monday. Her birthday is not until the 1st so I have to time to get what will be suggested, in time for her day.
Thanks again folks.
Regards
Tar :)
 
I'd go ahead and set them all to 30° inclusive or just under and finish at 30° with a microbevel or light stropping. You might go a touch more acute but see how they do at 30 first.

The Chef's knife would be as fine an edge as you care to make it. Being a chopper primarily, any reduction in drag will be welcome.
The bread knife I'd leave alone, the carving and utility knife a medium edge finish and a coarse finish on the paring knife.

Depending on the majority of food prep, the Chef's knife will see the lion's share of maintenance, the rest maybe need to be touched up half as often. The paring knife half as often yet again.
 
I opened the box today and took the paring knife out and the edge did feel sharp so I tried it to slice some paper and it did a very nice job. They do appear to be sharp. I did the marker pen trick and tried them very lightly on my SM 40degree side and it took the marker ink off from the edge up, to I think the end of the bevel, which to me would be 40 degrees. You mentioned to go to the 30 degrees or so with the chef's being a sharp as I can get it. Does that mean I should go to like 25 degrees?
Sorry but I have one more question from above. I am not sure what you mean by a "course finish" and a "medium edge finish".
I have only handled the paring knife but it sure does feel nice in the hand.
Thanks again for all of the help.
Regards
Tar :)
 
I'd let them get dull before doing anything to them if they came sharp.

A coarse finish might be anything from a 120 grit to about 400.
Medium finish 600-1000 or so
a fine or bright finish 1200 and up, these being ANSI numbers.

Japanese waterstone numbers would be the same for the coarse, 800-2k for a medium, and 3 or 4k and up being a fine.

If they are good at 30 degrees I'd leave them right there and see how they do.
 
HeavyHanded, the Lansky he has is 30 PER SIDE, not inclusive. Tar18, you want to set them to the 17 setting on your Lansky. That's 34 inclusive instead of 30. Ok though. Will work just fine.
 
HeavyHanded, the Lansky he has is 30 PER SIDE, not inclusive. Tar18, you want to set them to the 17 setting on your Lansky. That's 34 inclusive instead of 30. Ok though. Will work just fine.

Thanks for the head's up.

That's crazy. Is it a consequence/limitation of the clamping system?
 
Now I am a bit confused. Easy to do lol :) I was under the impression that the 30 on the Lansky meant 15 per side, like my SM being 15 a side, but am I wrong? OK folks now I need some explaining.
As I stated above I think that they may be around the 40 degree angle.
Sorry folks but I want to understand this because I am really enjoying this new hobby.
Regards
Tar :)
 
Now I am a bit confused. Easy to do lol :) I was under the impression that the 30 on the Lansky meant 15 per side, like my SM being 15 a side, but am I wrong? OK folks now I need some explaining.
As I stated above I think that they may be around the 40 degree angle.
Sorry folks but I want to understand this because I am really enjoying this new hobby.
Regards
Tar :)

The angle markings on the Lansky are "per side"... so the 30° setting is 60° total. (The setting also assumes the edge is .5" from the edge of the clamp... so the actual angle may vary depending on blade width).
 
Now I am a bit confused. Easy to do lol :) I was under the impression that the 30 on the Lansky meant 15 per side, like my SM being 15 a side, but am I wrong? OK folks now I need some explaining.
As I stated above I think that they may be around the 40 degree angle.
Sorry folks but I want to understand this because I am really enjoying this new hobby.
Regards
Tar :)

As mentioned, the angles marked are 'per side'. Additionally, rather wide blades, like large chef's knives, will put the cutting edge much further away from the clamp's front edge, which effectively lowers the sharpening angle by quite a lot. My own two Lansky sets established the marked angle as referenced at the front edge of the clamp (I measured it). As a point of reference, a Victorinox Swiss Army Knife's blade, at about 1/2" to 5/8" width, sharpened up in my clamp to around 14-15° per side, when using the '17' marked setting. So basically, any blade with the cutting edge at some distance away from the front edge will sharpen up at a somewhat lower angle than what's marked. Very wide blades can sharpen up at much, much lower angles, maybe down to 10° per side or even lower.


David
 
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Thanks for the head's up.

That's crazy. Is it a consequence/limitation of the clamping system?


Just the design of the more inexpensive systems. While the guided sharpener I built, like the Edge Pro, Hapstone, Wicked Edge, uses a pivot joint which is adjusted along a shaft & can be "locked" onto almost ANY angle, the Lansky uses a plate 90 degrees perpendicular to the clamp with several holes at preset locations. The the stones are inserted via a steel rod in each subsequent hole, which correlates to an angle and cannot be adjusted independently.

Yes Tar18, once again..... The Lansky is marked PER SIDE! Otherwise the 17 would mean 8.5 degrees on each side. And that's just silly!
 
You can't go by the angle markings on the lansky, period.
To know exactly what angle you're at, you'll have to measure.
Angle can be adjusted by several degrees in each hole. This is done by how far the blade edge is from the clamp, and how deep the rod is in the stone.
22776432206_8e15209a3e_c.jpg
 
Yes Tar18, once again..... The Lansky is marked PER SIDE! Otherwise the 17 would mean 8.5 degrees on each side. And that's just silly!
Hi,
This is from the lansky instructions, it indeed says degrees per side (there is a picture)
  • LANSKY SHARPENING ANGLES
  • 17° ANGLE. A severe angle only recommended for razor
    blades, X-Acto® blades or similar tools. Provides an extremely
    sharp but highly delicate edge.
  • 20° ANGLE. A commonly used angle for higher grade, quality
    blades. Provides an excellent edge for these types of knives.
    Ideal for kitchen knives.
  • 25° ANGLE. The recommended angle for most knives that
    need a durable, sharp edge. Ideal for hunting and outdoor
    knives.
  • 30° ANGLE. An outstanding angle for knives that see the
    heavy use of cutting cardboard, wire or carpets. Only for
    heavy duty use.
But pretty much the whole list of numbers is silly.
razors blade angles are 7 to 8 degrees per side ( 14 to 16 degrees inclusive)
17 degrees per side is axe angle for felling hardwoods
25 dps and 30dps (50-60 inclusive) are cold chisel angles for metal cutting

Also, consider this mind exploding material Extreme Regrind , ~6DPS no damage in 50 slices into pine, hardwood flooring and plywood the edge eventually gets damaged while cutting metal (steel food can)

jpm2 makes a great point, clamping point affects the actual number of the angle :)
 
Am really glad I freehand.


Yes, it's a wonderful skill to have. Unfortunately, not everyone can. I enjoyed being able to. But then my left arm/hand was paralyzed. That lost me the ability to affectively freehand sharpen. Might want to think about something like that next time you feel like making a "better than thou" comment.;) LOL!

Also remember people like me who build their own sharpeners and could have a wet noodle of a blade popping hair. :D
 
Thanks folks for the comments and knowledge. Boy I guess I still have lots to learn and was totally wrong about my Lansky. Now I know, but wondering if my SM is the same. I thought it was 15 a side with 30 being the total. I now know that I will have to get some sort of angle gauge like shown in the pic above. Now I am upset for not knowing about the Lansky (maybe me) and have sharpened up a few knives at the 30 setting thinking that was right. Now regarding the new set of knives for my sister, what should or how should I check and sharpen them up. I have checked the paring knife and it sliced paper very well but have not checked the other ones. It was suggested that I leave them for now and let her use them and then sharpen them up.
Here I thought I was learning and going in the right direction but it seems that I was wrong.
Now having done a few knives at 30 on the Lansky, i guess that would really screw things up, but how would they cut. When I did them they cut paper very easy and well. Did I really goof?
Thanks again for all of the help.
Regards
Tar :)
 
Thanks folks for the comments and knowledge. Boy I guess I still have lots to learn and was totally wrong about my Lansky. Now I know, but wondering if my SM is the same. I thought it was 15 a side with 30 being the total. I now know that I will have to get some sort of angle gauge like shown in the pic above. Now I am upset for not knowing about the Lansky (maybe me) and have sharpened up a few knives at the 30 setting thinking that was right. Now regarding the new set of knives for my sister, what should or how should I check and sharpen them up. I have checked the paring knife and it sliced paper very well but have not checked the other ones. It was suggested that I leave them for now and let her use them and then sharpen them up.
Here I thought I was learning and going in the right direction but it seems that I was wrong.
Now having done a few knives at 30 on the Lansky, i guess that would really screw things up, but how would they cut. When I did them they cut paper very easy and well. Did I really goof?
Thanks again for all of the help.
Regards
Tar :)

You are correct about the Sharpmaker... it is 15 deg./side... 30 deg. total.

One of the easier ways of determining what angle to sharpen at... is by marking the edge with a Sharpie, take a swipe with a fine stone, and see where you're removing metal. Matching what is on the blade is a good way to start... as you gain experience you'll learn about reprofiling... etc.

Doing the knives at 30 deg. isn't totally "wrong"... they're just not as sharp as they could be. Over time you can lower the angle and they'll cut better. Problem is, the Lansky (or Sharpmaker for that matter), isn't really the best tool to reprofile a blade. I started with the Lansky... and took it to my sister's house... where I was met with some of the worst knives I'd ever seen. Doing them at the highest angle setting was the only way I could get the knives done in any reasonable amount of time.... but at least they were better than what I started with. (And led me to finding a better sharpener, in that case, the Edge Pro).
 
Yes, it's a wonderful skill to have. Unfortunately, not everyone can. I enjoyed being able to. But then my left arm/hand was paralyzed. That lost me the ability to affectively freehand sharpen. Might want to think about something like that next time you feel like making a "better than thou" comment.;) LOL!

Also remember people like me who build their own sharpeners and could have a wet noodle of a blade popping hair. :D

I didn't say "better than thou" or anything of the sort, just making an observation that that system seems confusing and somewhat limiting.

With the number of times you've told people looking to buy guided sharpeners that they should build their own, I don't recall any of them accusing you of being elitist when they explain they don't have the skills or tools to do so, and you respond that anybody can build one.

Another thought, plenty of people only use one hand to hold the tool and one to hold the stone - which might as easily be resting on a holder. Just as anyone with the inclination to build a guided sharpener according to your design might do so, you could certainly retrain yourself to freehand sharpen with one hand if you were so inclined. At most it might take a weighted magnet attached near the tip for added pressure.
 
Thanks folks for the comments and knowledge. Boy I guess I still have lots to learn and was totally wrong about my Lansky. Now I know, but wondering if my SM is the same. I thought it was 15 a side with 30 being the total. I now know that I will have to get some sort of angle gauge like shown in the pic above. Now I am upset for not knowing about the Lansky (maybe me) and have sharpened up a few knives at the 30 setting thinking that was right. Now regarding the new set of knives for my sister, what should or how should I check and sharpen them up. I have checked the paring knife and it sliced paper very well but have not checked the other ones. It was suggested that I leave them for now and let her use them and then sharpen them up.
Here I thought I was learning and going in the right direction but it seems that I was wrong.
Now having done a few knives at 30 on the Lansky, i guess that would really screw things up, but how would they cut. When I did them they cut paper very easy and well. Did I really goof?
Thanks again for all of the help.
Regards
Tar :)
The sharpmaker is a different animal than the lansky.
The stones (rods) should be very close to the stated angles in reference to the base.
With the base on a level surface, and holding the blade 90 degrees to it (straight up/down), the contact angle between the blade and stone should be what it says it is.
If you have a smart phone, there's plenty of free clinometer apps to measure angle.
 
Thanks again folks for the info and guidance. Unfortunately I do not have a smart phone (old guy) but I will get a gauge that will tell me the correct angle. I have thinking about what has been said and wondered when I would indeed use the Lansky. I do not mean anything wrong with it but now not sure. I had been using the SM and after a bit understood what it was about. I did all right for just starting out. I got the diamond rods because getting some very dull knives sharp was a long road. I figured the Lansky would be better that way with the 5 different stones.
I am not sure if I should ask here or not but here goes. I am a senior and on a budget but what would folks suggest for a guided system with the right angles?
So would everyone suggest that I leave my sister's new kitchen set the way it came, which are pretty sharp as its but I think (being picky) they could be sharper.
Thanks again for all of the help.
Regards
Tar :)
 
Hi,
You did not goof :)
Thanks folks for the comments and knowledge. Boy I guess I still have lots to learn and was totally wrong about my Lansky. Now I know, but wondering if my SM is the same. I thought it was 15 a side with 30 being the total. I now know that I will have to get some sort of angle gauge like shown in the pic above. Now I am upset for not knowing about the Lansky (maybe me) and have sharpened up a few knives at the 30 setting thinking that was right. Now regarding the new set of knives for my sister, what should or how should I check and sharpen them up. I have checked the paring knife and it sliced paper very well but have not checked the other ones. It was suggested that I leave them for now and let her use them and then sharpen them up.
Here I thought I was learning and going in the right direction but it seems that I was wrong.
Now having done a few knives at 30 on the Lansky, i guess that would really screw things up, but how would they cut. When I did them they cut paper very easy and well. Did I really goof?
Thanks again for all of the help.
Regards
Tar :)
You did not goof.
I didn't mean to make you doubt by advancing the topic, I goofed there,

Lansky, like spyderco,
understand people like simple machines,
simple instructions,
that most people can make work and be happy with
because most people don't even sharpen knives,
just by owning sharpening equipment you're ahead of the curve,
and even more ahead by using the equipment with success.

Its just some people go one just a little beyond that, like second semester, sharpening 102

30 setting is better than a dull knife,
30 setting is faster than the other settings

Now whether the 30 degree setting produced 30 degrees per side
or 25 or 20 or 17 depending on the knife width and clamping point
its not that important sharp beats dull everytime,
and lansky understand people like simple not math/geometry/trigonometry

Lower angles are like an "advanced" topic,
since most knives bought/sold come with high angles,
you use high angles to sharpen them in a reasonable time
like 5min or up to 15 minutes.


Next knife you sharpen
try a lower angle setting,
or a lower clamping point,
use the permanent/magic/sharpie marker trick
to see if you can lower the angle a tiny little bit,
like half or one degree,
something thats not too much work,
keep it in the fun zone

If you can notice the difference in using the knife,
or if you just like it,
you might lower a little more next time,
or go back to the higher angle,
they will all cut better than butter/steak knives :)




Thanks again folks for the info and guidance. Unfortunately I do not have a smart phone (old guy) but I will get a gauge that will tell me the correct angle. I have thinking about what has been said and wondered when I would indeed use the Lansky. I do not mean anything wrong with it but now not sure. I had been using the SM and after a bit understood what it was about. I did all right for just starting out. I got the diamond rods because getting some very dull knives sharp was a long road. I figured the Lansky would be better that way with the 5 different stones.
I am not sure if I should ask here or not but here goes. I am a senior and on a budget but what would folks suggest for a guided system with the right angles?
So would everyone suggest that I leave my sister's new kitchen set the way it came, which are pretty sharp as its but I think (being picky) they could be sharper.
Thanks again for all of the help.
Regards
Tar :)
Hi,
Lansky its a good system,
you don't have to spend any extra money,
knowing actual angle number is not that important sharp is sharp,
smartphone or angle gauge not required for knowing the actual angle number,
a notebook and a ruler will do it,
simply measure the distance from edge/apex to the back of the clamp,
you can measure the run/length,
you can measure the hypotenuse,
you can measure the height,
then punch in some numbers into triangle-calculator hit the calculate button and you get the actual angle (90 is a known angle)
mark the distance in notebook so you dont have to do triangle-calc next time:)

But its not that important to know the exact angle number, sharp is sharp,
permanent marker trick to find existing angle, ruler to know how to repeat angle,
notebook to remember


For the sister, try and make one knife sharper, if she notices that its sharper, if she appreciates the difference, well then it might be worth doing ... if you're having fun :)


If you're crafty and have the time,
you don't have to spend any extra money,
you've already got lasky/sharpmaker abrasives ,
check out your local craigslist.org "free" section,
get some free wood,
and maybe try to enhance your lansky setup,
its just triangles :)

I bookmarked this video because I like the spinny/planetary gear here
DIY $5 Knife Sharpening System like APEX or Lansky from rubbish / Точилка для ножей из мусора - Vitalii Tereshchuk
There are many variations they dont need metal
midrange knife sharpening jig
FDKV30NHO7XOARN.MEDIUM.jpg


there are many more variations on this theme here, there, everywhere :)
 
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