15N20 and L6 steel???

Status
Not open for further replies.
C

Cascade_mtn's

Joined
Jan 13, 2011
Messages
341
Have a question for you knife making folks. I'm looking into a knife maker that lives about an hour and a half from me that used 15N20 for blades. I have found some of his knives on the internet, and some of the descriptions say it's made from 15N20, and some say L6. I have a email onto the maker, but I also non biased opinion from you guys If I may. :o

I know just enough about steel (carbon and stainless) as a knife guy to make me sound educated on the subject in front of someone that couldn't pic out steel from aluminum.

My Googlefu is weak I guess. Read a little @ Crucible's web site. As I understand it they both are band saw steels, and very similar. L6 seemingly being the choice according to the few articles I found.

And I'm a little confused as to the descriptions, are some of the retail sellers just confusing 15N20 and L6? I don't know.

Any way the long/short of it is this. Is there a big difference, and what do you find makes a better blade?
 
I am not sure about 15n20, but i know that L6 is incredibly tough steel. a maker on here made it for an arctic team who had broken a lot of production blades, and he has not had any complaints yet. they were chopping frozen meat, wood, ice and such at, i think, 80 below. the knife was just fine. i think that L6 would be great is you are in extreme situations that need really tough steel. the only thing i know about 15n20 is that it is used for Damascus a LOT.
 
thegeek574 said:
I am not sure about 15n20, but i know that L6 is incredibly tough steel. a maker on here made it for an arctic team who had broken a lot of production blades, and he has not had any complaints yet. they were chopping frozen meat, wood, ice and such at, i think, 80 below. the knife was just fine. i think that L6 would be great is you are in extreme situations that need really tough steel. the only thing i know about 15n20 is that it is used for Damascus a LOT.
Click to expand...

I saw that. Most of what I found here on BF was just that. 15N20 being mixed with other steels to make Damascus patterns. I read a steel chart and saw that 15N20 is very similar to L6, however it looks as though L6 has several other "ingredients"..... for lack of a better word. Thanks for the reply :)
 
I am no blade steel expert, But I beleive the original Gerber MkII knives were of L6 steel, So it must be pretty tough. Alot of other things have been made from L6 like lawn mower blades and old saw blades. It's a carbon steel and I like carbon steels!:) The 15N20 is the nickel that Craig Barr uses with 5160 to make his Damascus Hawks.He makes an excellent damascus hawk! I wouldn't think it would be used by itself for a knife blade, Just as the softer layer for damascus blades. Maybe someone will come along and give us the lowdown shortly!
 
The nickel in 15N20 gives it it's toughness. The typical damascus is 15N20/1084 ,a very good mix.
 
I found a little more info in another forum were a maker..... and I quote said "I use L6 steel only, the real L6 not the 15N20 equivalent"! It was an old thread so I didn't bring it back from the grave to ask any ???
 
mete said:
The nickel in 15N20 gives it it's toughness. The typical damascus is 15N20/1084 ,a very good mix.
Click to expand...

Yeah I have been seeing that. Do you know if 15N20 is in any way similar to L6? Seems so from what I have read, but again I know Jack and S@#t when it comes to the elemental differences in steel........ and Jack just went AWOL. ;)
 
Yes, they are VERY similar. L6 has a little Cr(chromium), but not much. Everything else is almost identical. Attached is a chart I made up a while ago. It's frowned upon by the elders of knifemaking, but I find it very useful. It has the most common recipes for the more common steels. The HT info isn't the only way to do it, but it should give you acceptable results if followed. Use at your own risk ;]
 

Attachments

Last edited:
zaph1 said:
Yes, they are VERY similar. L6 has a little Cr(chromium), but not much. Everything else is almost identical. Attached is a chart I made up a while ago. It's frowned upon by the elders of knifemaking, but I find it very useful. It has the most common recipes for the more common steels. The HT info isn't the only way to do it, but it should give you acceptable results if followed. Use at your own risk ;]
Click to expand...

Thank you for that. :) I'm not the one making the knife. I was just curious as the maker in question seems to have the blades he makes labeled as 15N20 on some sites, and L6 on others for the same style knife. On his own web site I have seen both as well. The one I'm looking at is labeled as 15N20.
 
I use both of these extensively, and although I am no "expert" I have done a lot of destructive testing on both steels.
I can attest that both of these are very tough steels. The 15n20 I use is uddeholm .095" steel (from large bandsaws, 12'' wide!). The L6 I use comes from
very large circular saw blades and is quite a bit thicker, up to .175 thick. I use and treat both steels the same it just depends on the application that determines the thickness I need for the knife. Here are a few links to the chemical make up of both steels. they are both basically 1075 w/ .02% ni, L6 just has a few other elements added. Hope this helps!
http://www.suppliersonline.com/propertypages/L6.asp
http://www.uddeholm-strip.com/popup/dlc/?wood_bandsaw_steel.pdf

Ben
 
15n20
c .75%
mn .5%
ni 2%
si .25%
fe bal

L-6
c .75%
mn .70%
si .25%
cr .80%
ni 1.5%
mo .30%
fe bal


15n20 is a shallow hardening steel and L-6 is a deep hardening steel.
Both steels are excellent steel for knives and for mixing in damascus, they are different steels and both have there place and uses.

Del
 
delbert ealy said:
they are different steels and both have there place and uses.
Del
Click to expand...

Sorry, forgot about the Molybdenum. Thanks, Delbert.

I get my L6 free from the steel yard in the form of broken band saw blades and use it for just about everything that needs a piece of steel. I made them a knife and they save all their broken blades for me.
 
zaph1 said:
Sorry, forgot about the Molybdenum. Thanks, Delbert.

I get my L6 free from the steel yard in the form of broken band saw blades and use it for just about everything that needs a piece of steel. I made them a knife and they save all their broken blades for me.
Click to expand...

Thats cool. From what I understand the guy I'm looking to make a knife for me does something very similar. We live in "saw mill" central here in the NW. I guess he used old car springs as well for larger knives. IIRC it's 5160??? Anyway..... thanks to all for the help. It's much appreciated.
 
L6 works well mixed with O1, in damascus; they are both deep hardening and have similar heat treat numbers. Because they contain smaller amounts of mn. 15n20 and the mid range 10 series steels are a good mix.

Fred
 
bandsaw and circular saw blades are vey rarely if ever L-6. Ive seen a ton of them spec'd and most were 15n20 (bandsaw) and the circular saw blades were either 8670 or 1080+2% nickle. I have saw one that spec'd close to L-6.
The Moly in L-6 makes a marked difference. It will air harden to a good degree. We bought a bar of L-6 from Aldo to use as axe bits. Its a 5/16" bar and when you get done with it and lay it somewhere to cool the heated end gets hard enough to skate a file easily.
You never really know unless you have it spec'd. I saw a cicular blade that spec'd carbon content to 0.93% with 0.45 Moly. Crazy stuff.
 
There are also two makers of L-6 and the differences are significant in the HT.Makers should get material from the same source .
 
I received confirmation that the knife will indeed be made from 15N20. Apparently has been using it for years, knows his way around heat treating it very well, and has had very good results from it. I'm good with that. Thanks again to all who helped. :)
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top