8Cr13MoV

AUS-8 in particular is extremely fine grained. Personally I would like to get one in AUS-8W for that reason. Spyderco once made a knife in AUS-8W but unfortunately I missed out on picking it up. All in all, I can only repeat, 8Cr13MoV is a strong performer. I don't know about corrosion. I have tried and find some information on it, but haven't really been able to. For me it has held up very well and even in Boston we get quite a few days in the summer with close to 100% humidity. But in general, I have seen very little corrosion on my SS knives, so I am likely not the best person to judge corrosion resistance.
 
HoB said:
AUS-8 in particular is extremely fine grained. Personally I would like to get one in AUS-8W for that reason. Spyderco once made a knife in AUS-8W but unfortunately I missed out on picking it up. All in all, I can only repeat, 8Cr13MoV is a strong performer. I don't know about corrosion. I have tried and find some information on it, but haven't really been able to. For me it has held up very well and even in Boston we get quite a few days in the summer with close to 100% humidity. But in general, I have seen very little corrosion on my SS knives, so I am likely not the best person to judge corrosion resistance.
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I've made statements in the past about finding the corrosion resistance of 8Cr13MoV low mainly due to finding small rust spots after the knife was exposed to sweat for a few hours. It happened another time cutting up an apple in the woods and not washing the blade off very well. These are fairly rare situations for one of my EDC's to go through and the spots came off easily with high grit sandpaper, but it remains that the steel has corroded more easily for me than AUS8, 440C, S30V etc. It's never been bad enough to concern me, unless I'm going to be doing something to make me sweat for hours like hiking in the summer. My Tenacious and Byrd Flight have both remained spot free after lots of food prep.
 
Thanks a lot Mastiff! I assume you know the story behind it?
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Yessir Hob. It took me a few years to find one too. Like you I wanted to try out this variant of Aus 8A with Tungsten.I read about it in a post Sal wrote one time talking about how sharp he was able to get it.

I found it at that store by accident as I was just looking around after putting in an order for a Barminski skinner in Vascowear. I was dumbfounded at what they had in stock . They are like a local store here. This brick and mortar sells everything at MSRP, no less. Some items stick around for a long time like that and end up at less than collectors e-bay prices years later.

They are very nice people to deal with too BTW.

If you ever get a chance look through for oldies you never thought you'd see again. There are more surprises. Joe
 
brownshoe said:
I own and use spydercos and give them as presents.

When it comes to steel, spyderco's biggest achievement, IMHO, is bringing VG10 to the US market. A great contribution to knife technology
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Dear Mr. Brownshoe,

thanx much for your interest and support.

sal
 
His shoe is brown because he's always steppin in the s*** thats flowing from his mouth. :foot:

p.s. hows that for a first post?
 
HoB, One steel I've always wanted to try was VG10(W). A tungsten variant of VG10 has some interesting possibilities.It is listed in the catalog of the maker. Don't think I'm complaining though. IMO, VG10 is one of the best all around steels on the market used in cutlery applications.

The "V" series , and SG series steels here: http://www.e-tokko.com/eng_original_list.htm

Sal G. once stated that the special steels like VG10W are special order items that are only made when orders come in. That would leave one having to buy a whole melt if one wanted to try , for instance, a sprint run ( or mule team run).

Still, VG10 with tungsten! It gets me almost as excited as thinking of a Vascowear mule or better yet sprint run in a heavy duty folder. Joe
 
I carried my Byrd crossbill jogging for 2 days and it already had some spot stains from the sweat.
I usually carry my VG10 endura and this has never come up.

I expected a mirror finish would be better for sweat but it still stained. Seams like VG10 is better for corrosion resistance. At least in my experience.
 
It might be true. SAK is mirror finished. The sanrenmu I mentioned looks like brushed finished.

I acquired another one which is satin finished and the rust resistance is better. I only need to wash it and dry it properly. No spots.
 
I've used a 8Cr13MoV Byrd Raven, ATS-55 Dyad, VG-10 Endura, 420 HC Buck 110, chinese 440 Gerber Armor, and an H-1 Atlantic Salt commercial fishing in the Atlantic. The bait we used was heavily salted (approximately 110 lbs of salt per 500 lbs of herring) and the resulting brine was of a very high salinity. The Raven and Armor exhibited the most corrosion even though both had a black finish on the blade. The Raven's edge retention was very good for a 20 dollar knife. It was superior to the edge retention on the Gerber and the Buck when used to cut heavy duty commercial fishing rope (sinking, floating, and neutral buoyancy). The Dyad and Endura were about equal in edge retention, the VG-10 was only slightly more corrosion resistant than the ATS-55 when exposed to the herring brine. The H-1 edge retention was about equal to the VG-10 after repeated usage and sharpening and the corrosion resistance was (obviously) vastly superior. The 420 HC of the Buck was second only to the H-1 in corrosion resistance, and by this, tan discoloration appeared in spots where the knife was left exposed to seawater and brine for extended periods of time. These discolorations were removed easily with a wipe down and no pitting was present afterwards, as was in the ATS-55, Chinese 440 and 8Cr13MoV in the Byrd.

I work on towboats on the Illinois river now and have been using the Armor, and while the edge retention is decent enough for what I use it for, and the knife is subject to far more abuse, I plan to replace it with a serrated Tenacious when I have some disposable funds for knives. Corrosion is not as much a factor in the freshwater of the inland waterways as it was in the Atlantic, and edge retention and lock strength are far more important to me now.

This information is solely what I have observed using these different knives with different blade steels for hard cutting chores in harsh environments. YMMV

pete
 
Brownshoe: CEO of Haterade Inc.:D
Geez, maybe he should point us all in the direction of the knife company run by God that he keeps alluding too by implications; I mean, there MUST be one, seeing as he is SO concerned with some minor mistakes along the way.
You'd alomost think Spyderco was run by HUMANS!:eek:
 
8Cr13MoV is a decent blade steel. But at the same time we have to look at what we are using it for. Is it an EDC in which we use it for opening envelopes, cutting ropes or thread, or opening feed bags or are we using it for hard everyday use? We can become obsessive on the quality of steel if we don't consider what it is being used for. If I am looking for a knife that is tough for everyday use, that is very often being put to the test and you want it to keep an edge without having to resharpen it often, then we need to look at a more quality steel. If it is for everyday occassional use then even 420j2 will suffice. Consideringwhat the knife will be used for is imperative or else we are just spending money for prides sake. As far as self-defense EDC, I don't think a street thug cares what is cutting him.
 
I've found that with hard use, the higher end steels hold their edges only slightly longer than the more premium steels. I've found that using a spyderco in VG-10 and a spyderco in H-1 on commercial fishing boats that the edge retention is only slightly better in the VG-10 than in the H-1. It's my opinion that 8Cr13MoV is a fine steel to use hard. It takes a nice toothy edge and holds it for as long as can be expected under "hard" use.

I have found in my hard use knives that a steel that doesn't hold an edge AS long but is easier to resharpen, especially in the field where I can't break out the sharpmaker is preferential.

"Hard use" encompasses a broad spectrum of chores. The steels with better edge retention are also more prone to chipping or tip breakage than some of the so called cheaper steels. Selecting a knife is an exercise in compromise. When I select a knife for hard use, whether on the towboats, or commercial fishing boats, price, ease of resharpening, and corrosion resistance were always more of a concern for me than edge retention. I don't want a knife I can not affordably replace if it is lost at work, one that I can't put a working edge back on with a few passes of a diamond rod in the field, or one that will rust up solid with long term exposure to the elements. Sometimes you can't stop what you are doing and resharpen your knife to a hair popping edge, and sometimes you can't stop and clean your knife, or rinse it etc.

I've used a plain edge Byrd in 8Cr13MoV, hopefully I can get ahold of a serrated Tenacious in the same and use it on my next hitch on the river. If I get ahold of one before I leave I'll post a detailed review of how it held up.
 
Sal Glesser said:
Hi TJROJAY,

There is very litle to go on. Spyderco began listing 8Cr13MoV on the blades of its byrd brand models a couple of years ago. Perhaps Spyderco was the first company to actually do a chemical analysis on the steel. Before that, all companies making knives in China just listed "440" on their blades or nothing at all. Now there are many that are beginning to list the actual steels being used in the blades.

In CATRA lab tests at Spyderco, 8Cr13MoV edge retention was in the area of AUS-8. The steel held thin edge angles quite well and would perform at a fairly hard Rc. Corrosion resistance was not as good as AUS-8. AUS-8 will get sharper as the steel has a very homogenous grain structure and the foundry, Aichi in Japan, does a very good job at refinining.

Thanx for the defense Joe, Brownshoe is just being Brownshoe. He wouldn't take Spyderco's word for much of anything. He's quite bright and has much knowledge, but his dislike for Spyderco is great. We just agree to disagree.
sal
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Handled like a true gentleman:cool:




I'm not worthy to be on the same forum of such greatness:eek:



....ok,enough butt kissing:D


Seriously though,you're the best Sal.Please don't ever stop doing what you're doing:thumbup::thumbup:
 
Sal Glesser said:
In CATRA lab tests at Spyderco, 8Cr13MoV edge retention was in the area of AUS-8. The steel held thin edge angles quite well and would perform at a fairly hard Rc. Corrosion resistance was not as good as AUS-8. AUS-8 will get sharper as the steel has a very homogenous grain structure and the foundry, Aichi in Japan, does a very good job at refinining.
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I've found this as well. I took the back bevel of my raven down on a coarse diamond stone and the edge to 30 degrees inclusive and noticed an improvement in overall performance.

I also agree that corrosion resistance was inferior to AUS-8. My girlfriend used an integral clip delica for a summer on a charter fishing boat and NEVER cleaned it. My Raven showed rust spots even with the black blade coating. They were frequently appearing on the edge of the knife. There was no pitting though, it seemed more like surface rust.

on a side note, AUS-8 is one of my favorite steels, especially in a knife like the Dragonfly with a flat ground blade. It gets extremely sharp. My waved one is a pocket razor!

Again, if I can get a serrated Tenacious by Tuesday I'll take it as my knife on the towboat. If I can't I'll dig out my plain edged Raven and take that instead. It is missing a screw in the handle but that happened fairly early on and the knife really hasn't suffered because of it.

Pete
 
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