A radical theory, and leaving the world of expensive modern knives behind

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You may be familiar with this one.
91bravo 91bravo
Screenshot_20181125-215503_Gallery.jpg
CPM 3V
0.224 thick. Full convex grind.
About 20 thousandths behind the edge
It cuts excellent. And is very well balanced for its size.

Yes a kitchen knife will cut better. But the lean grind will allow it to cut nice. But to be fair this was designed as a chopper.

But this knife is not a chopper. 0.116
Z-Wear at 62 HRC.
10 thousands behind the edge and about 15-17 degrees per side. And easily one of the sharpest knives I have made. A serious cutter. Will smoke those old steels.Screenshot_20180811-162927_Gallery.jpg
 
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Man, you're really poking the hornet's nest here. I can see what you're saying, but I'm not sure what you're trying to accomplish here.

That said, before this gets locked down I would be interested in what you mean by having "processed a tree with a pocket knife". Quarter-saw a mature oak, or just cut down a sapling?
 
Chopaholic said:
I believe the increasing popularity of "survival" and edged-weapon martial arts is what has shaped the knife industry in recent decades. You now have hundreds of thousands of morons smacking knives with mallets and stabbing helmets with them, and obviously if a knife ever breaks, then it must have been "low quality/one star". Just look at the Amazon reviews for literally any knife from today's major manufacturers; the retardation is nauseating. "I tried sharpening this knife but it's still dull. One star." "Knife snapped in half just from one afternoon of batoning. One star." "Knife rusted in just one week. One star." This is what the manufacturers are contending with, and that is why knives suck now.
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I think the if the internet was around 100 years ago you would hear similar things. People often get the impression something was better with antiques simply because only the best examples survived, and I think that's especially true with cutlery. All the broken and defective knives from 100 years ago are now long gone and forgotten.

broken-old-knife-with-wooden-handle-white-background_78820-209.jpg


vintage-wade-butcher-british-army_1_a2f61a2f64cb00b1bcfe9ed186b95bc5.jpg


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Now I love all knives and I love vintage carbon steel, but honestly if it was the apocalypse I'd be reaching for a modern knife not an antique one where it's hard to tell how intact the steel still is.
 
ShannonSteelLabs said:
You may be familiar with this one.
91bravo 91bravo
View attachment 1086630
CPM 3V
0.224 thick. Full convex grind.
About 20 thousandths behind the edge
It cuts excellent. And is very well balanced for its size.

Yes a kitchen knife will cut better. But the lean grind will allow it to cut nice. But to be fair this was designed as a chopper.

But this knife is not a chopper. 0.116
Z-Wear at 62 HRC.
10 thousands behind the edge and about 15-17 degrees per side. And easily one of the sharpest knives I have made. A serious cutter. Will smoke those old steels.View attachment 1086632
Click to expand...

How could I forget that one? It was a beast!

Yall can read more about it here...;):

https://bladeforums.com/threads/shannon-steel-labs-camp-kaiju.1634446/

https://bladeforums.com/threads/shannon-steel-labs-camp-kaiju-passaround.1645092/
 
The guy's too domestic. Here's a better example: combat knives in the last 50 years suddenly sprouted all kinds of handle features, blade serrations, wire cutters, beer bottle openers, etc., etc. Nearly 2,000 years before that, it was the simple, symmetrical, double-edged, cross-guarded, pommeled, dagger.
 
hank_rearden said:
The guy's too domestic. Here's a better example: combat knives in the last 50 years suddenly sprouted all kinds of handle features, blade serrations, wire cutters, beer bottle openers, etc., etc. Nearly 2,000 years before that, it was the simple, symmetrical, double-edged, cross-guarded, pommeled, dagger.
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That's true.

If I was to design a combat knife it would be pretty simple. Modern ergonomic handle, single edge or double edge. No nonsense. Likely some form or guard to keep you hands from sliding forward.
No frills!
 
A fine example of revisionist history to suit an individuals agenda/opinion.
Using kephart as an example is strange as he was involved in early writing and media and would probably in the present day just be an equivalent of Ray mears, selling us overpriced wares
 
OP,

Many, many people on the forums have long discussed the fact that thin blades cut better than thick, prybar-type knife blades. And that knives need not necessarily be expensive or have the latest-greatest steel to have excellent cutting performance.

There are also a number of modern knives with outstanding blade/edge geometry and cutting performance.

Chopaholic said:
I melted down? That's funny. I'm sensing really bad emotional maturity all around here. That's the trouble with this hobby. Just like with firearms and martial arts, it attracts a certain... type.
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I know what you mean, especially in martial arts. LOTS of martial arts types claim their method is the best and they know more than everyone else. Those types also make all kinds of big claims they have no intention of backing up.

Oh, wait...

Jim
 
NUFF SAID:
DROP the MIC
rambo-first-blood-forest-knife.jpg


There use to be redwoods at the North Poll. But after Rambo camped up there with his Rambo knife, well, lets just say that climate change can be blamed on Rambo. Never even had to sharpen it and ran it at 4 dps.
 
There is something to say about a good thin carbon steel blade, they just work, and work, and work, and are grabbed by people in the kitchen because they are sharp, easier to sharpen and use. I have tried to find more of these blades, but they are not always easy to find, indicating they were used and sharpened lot that and were finally thrown out or relegated or thrown in the tool box, workbench or shed with other worn tools.
 
OP, you're wrong.

In every way you're wrong.

Not really but you're mostly wrong.

The advancements in materials and engineering that have occurred throughout the past century are innumerable. It would be ridiculous to ignore the significance of this.

I mean, steel is better, materials are better, manufacturing is better, edge geometry and sharpness are better, I could just go on. I can't imagine an area in which a quality modern piece wouldn't be superior save for nostalgic purposes.

I mean, we can pick exceptional examples and poor examples of each and unfairly weigh them out, but that's dishonest.

In reality, a high performance quality knife today is measurably better than one made 100 years ago.
 
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check for lead paint ... another thread that makes you go ... o_O

I love my old hickory knives ... love my specialty knives made for butchering and processing meat ...

but they wouldn't last long on a long hunting trip or a long primative camping trip ... and they are easier to sharpen ... but if you have the skill to sharpen those ... then you have the skill to sharpen any steel type ... you may need different sharpening equipment ...

now I won't bring up everytime you've back tracked or contradicted yourself ... I'm sure others have or will (saves me the trouble) ...

but just NO ... that is all ...
 
marcinek said:
Not rust resistance.

Theory disproven.
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Well, theory challenged. ;)

And a little maintenance goes a long way, brother. I won't argue about superiority, because we don't have a common and authoritative metric, but my preference (based on what I own) is non-stainless/ carbon steel. I've got lots of patina going on, but no orange rust... and the knives range from a Becker BK11 to a Dave Beck TD6 SERE, so the cost/value aspect of the original 'superiority' argument is problematic too I guess.
 
James Y said:
OP,

Many, many people on the forums have long discussed the fact that thin blades cut better than thick, prybar-type knife blades. And that knives need not necessarily be expensive or have the latest-greatest steel to have excellent cutting performance.

There are also a number of modern knives with outstanding blade/edge geometry and cutting performance.



I know what you mean, especially in martial arts. LOTS of martial arts types claim their method is the best and they know more than everyone else. Those types also make all kinds of big claims they have no intention of backing up.

Oh, wait...

Jim
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This is where I feel the obligatory requirement to point out Bruce Lee, and how he basically called out all martial arts as too rigid and too reliant on forms or specific rehearsed sequences...

(I love that he put his money where his mouth was and showed why in real fights, he had a point, and jeet kune do is really an excellent revolution of the martial arts in that context ; )

 
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