A serious discussion about hand-file lubrication?

javand

javand

Joined
Oct 17, 2010
Messages
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First off, let me state that I know as well as anybody, that the concept goes against "the accepted" wisdom. All the old literature, and all the casually repeated information by everyone that's ever heard a "thing or two" about file work says its a no no.

I love using files, and find them faster than the various grinders for a lot of work. I'm slowly amassing a large collection of hand files, including a couple sets of Vallorbe Valtitan needle files, and a handful of Valtitan hand files, and whichever other Vallorbe Grobet/Habilis, American old stock Nicholsons, and Germans I can find.

I reject the idea that files are short life consumables, and I believe they can give years of heavy service with proper care. I've always wished I could lube my files to help prevent rust, since I'm in a really humid environment, but I started using a desiccant in storage which has removed that concern. Still, I've often questioned the proliferated wisdom of not lubing files, and I've met some old machinists that disagree with that notion entirely. We lube all other cutting tools to extend life, why shouldnt we offer our files the same treatment?

I know the idea is that it will promote clogging and pinning, but that really doesn't add up. Recently I've become aware that many jewelers regularly lube their files with a product called Bur-Life, which RioGrande promotes.

I can see how lubing your files would cause you problems with "chalking" but to be honest, I've never found chalking to be useful, and frankly, I have very little issue with clogging or pinning on *properly* broken in precison files anyway. Admittedly I use seperate files for steel vs soft metals. I've also met old timers with serious experience that swore chalking was predominately urban legend also.


So, sorry for the long winded post, but i'd like to hear from those that *know*, with years of hand file experience, what your thoughts, or well reasoned beliefs are on this topic. I'd prefer we refrain from the "so and so said it so it must be true", especially in regards to literature being printed by companies (that make files) who have a vested interest in products being repurchased as often as possible. I'd really like to hear from Europeans that were traditionally taught if there are any floating around, since there are a lot of cultural differences in files and their use between the different hemispheres.

FWIW I spent the last couple of days doing some heavy filing skeletonizing tangs with a new (Brazil) Nicholson file that I broke in well, and kept lubed. Its a courser round file, no apparant deterioration of functionity, and honestly, much better than I was expecting from the source.
 
When I thought about it, the logic behind chalking doesn't really make sense- to my thinking, it would just encourage gouging by forcing filings to the top of the file rather than letting them push into the recesses. I never tried it, so I can only guess at it's effects. I've tried WD-40 and light oils as lubricants when filing, and while I can't really attest to any benefits, it did have a tendency to trap filings on the surface of the steel, causing gouges, though it did prevent any instances of the file sticking.
 
I guess that is a concern, lubricants could keep filings attached to the file versus casting them. I didn't notice much of that with the courser file, but I always smack the handle down and wipe the file with a cloth every handful of strokes regardless.

I could see how sticky filings could be more of an issue with finer cuts and needle files. Which is why I haven't tried it with any. Seeing info about jewelers using lubricants on needle files however, is what made me really want tto revisit this. Are they just misinformed? Is Rio Grande promoting a product at the expense of their customer's best interest or is there something I'm missing?
 
I forgot to mention, the only time it really presented itself was on wide, flat areas, i.e. bevels. Going straight over the cross section always gave me clean cuts. I imagine this wouldn't be a problem with jewelers given the much more intricate, and as a result small nature of their work.
 
I use files regularly, so this topic interests me a great deal.

I'm not familiar with "breaking in" files; what do you mean by that?
 
I have used 100's of files, maybe near 1000. I'm sure over 100 of them are still in my shops. Small ones break, and large ones wear, but they last a long time if used right.

A file is a consumable, just like any abrasive tool. Proper technique will lengthen its life, but it will wear and dull. The primary cause is bad technique. Drill bits, milling bits, and screwdriver tips are the same. Lubrication for mills and drills is to keep the friction down and extend the life, files don't build the same amount of heat up. Yes, friction is the agent of file life expectancy, but lubing doesn't seem to be the answer. Smooth strokes with just the right pressure,and never sawing back and forth will make a file last a lot longer. Regular carding and picking the stuck bits ( use a bronze point) will keep the file from getting clogged and galling the surface being filed.

I have never lubed a jewelers file, nor know any jeweler who does. I never lubed any other file either. I have chalked bastard files from time to time, mainly when working brass and copper. I know a few old timers who chalk their files, but most don't seem to do it.
Burr-Lube is for saw blades, drills, and burrs in my shop.
I have known many old school European and South American jewelers ( where they apprentice for up to 10 years, often doing nothing but filing for a year), and none have ever mentioned lubing a file. Add to that the dozens of jewelry instructional books I have read, which don't mention it either.

I have never heard of "breaking In" a new file. What is that procedure?

If you think steel is a pain to file, try platinum. It sticks like it was welded to the file. Copper is similar in gumminess.

Valtitan files are great, but if misused by applying too much pressure they will break easily.
 
I like to use a dry film tool spray lubricant. It's sorta like tuf-glide aerosol, not your typical white teflon film dry lubricant. I don't remember the brand name right now but it keeps the rust off the files when they're stored out in the shed and doesn't leave a visible film. Other than that I haven't used chalk or anything, nor do I lube during filing, just brush out any debris with a brass cleaning brush.
 
I was taught to rub charcoal into a new file to keep silver from sticking to it, then at some point I got new files and didn't have a charcoal block. not sure I really noticed any difference. I did at one point try rubbing bur-life into a file and it made all of the swarf stick to the file. That file was ruined in a matter of hours.

Aluminum is miserable stuff to try to file, if I'm ever stupid enough to be in a position where I have to file aluminum again I may try tap magic to keep the swarf from clogging the file (it works wonders for keeping aluminum chips from welding to milling cutters) but usually I am able to plan to avoid filing aluminum in the first place

-Page
 
I've used this (or other brands similar) daily for 35 years...

998_021_.jpg


http://www.cooksongold.com/Jewellery-Tools/Burr-Life-Lubricant-prcode-998-021

files for aluminum are quite different cuts than those for steel...

http://www.pferdusa.com/products/201a/201a01/201a0102P.html
 
I still use files for the majority of my bevel refining. I have tried 3in1, WD-40, Mobil, chalk, charcoal and silicone lube... Nothing was better than applying good technique. I do make one exception and that is using soapy water as coolant when doing any heavy draw filing. The work piece gets hot to the touch and there is no doubt in my mind that the teeth are subject to unwanted tempering.

I agree with Stacy. Files are a consumable. Thinking that a file is going to remain sharp with use is no different than thinking your knife will cut forever. That said, proper technique and care can extend the life of your files. I have a "hoggin" file that has been in service for the last 3 yrs.
 
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Never thought about using lube on hand files. I just use them and when they no longer perform toss them and use fresh ones instead of getting tired out and doing less accurate work with dull ones.
 
For those that aren't aware, there are a couple of outfits that can sharpen worn files very effectively. Bogg's Tool specializes in, and is very effective at it. I was skeptical, but I sent in a batch of older second hand files and most came back good as new. A couple were apparently beyond repair due to pits.

Stacy; Ok, I know you're well plugged into the jeweler scene, so I guess the Bur-Life promotion of lubing files is just shameless oon their part. I did read a few "blogs" that mentioned lubing their needle files with it, but they did seem novice.


As to file break in, much of the old literature, and even the Nicholson file guides I've read recommend it, and just like bandsaw blades, it not only increases the life of your files, but also the effectiveness of them.

The method is pretty simple, like most blade break-in:

Carefully and with light pressure begin using new files on a flat piece of brass or copper. I'll do 20 or 30 strokes per cutting edge, but I've met old pros that would use new files for brass/copper only the first year claiming those made the best files for steel later. The idea, just like bandsaw blades, is that the files come dead hard with tiny sharp peaks on the teeth that will easily break off during initial use, taking however much of the rest of the cutting edge with it, leaving a blunt or non uniform edge. By using the files on material that is much softer you allow the tips of the peaks to wear down, and maintain uniformity of the cutting surface. It can be very obvious with certain cuts of files, especially double cut or round files. Try it once on a new quality file, and I promise you'll be sold. It really helps pinning and clogging also, since I think any irregular geometries between the teeth attract clog.

The more I think about it, the more the bandsaw blade anology seems appropriate to files. The correlations between teeth engagement, and the way both tools cut seems very similar. Try using a 12" coarse round or hand file on a thin cross section of steel and teeth will go flying.
 
Obviously when breaking in files on brass (the best) or copper, clean the chips every few strokes as usual to avoid clogging. This is the hardest time to remove anything that gets stuck, since you'll be more prone to damaging the file imho. I don't recommend using aluminum for break in, or with normal cut files at all. As someone mentioned there are some file cuts specifically designed for aluminum.
 
Aye Duffy, the new version of simmonds and nicholson's guides don't mention it, and have you noticed how nearly identical they are? I believe this is a case of corporate best interest versus customer best interest. Many saw blade companies won't mention blade break in either, but its well known amongst professionals, and if you ask the company or supplier they will recommend a regime.

I have seen some old versions of file guides that do mention break in however. Also, the war dept's info packet circa ww ii says specifically not to coat files with any sort of rust preventative. So I'm feeling like lubricating file is a justified no-no in most cases after discussing it here. I am happy that we took the time to discuss it however, since I don't like taking things on "faith"' and prefer to come to my own conclusions based on reasoning a question out.
 
Just want to add, that I'm not an expert on files or their use by any means.

File break in is something that made immediate sense to *me* when it was explained to me, but don't take my word for it. Try it for yourself, it can't hurt either way. At the very worst you're taking a few strokes of the useful life out of a file on a material it should be useful against for thousands of strokes.

I can say that I've been breaking in all my new files for the past year and haven't had to replace any that I didn't break, and theyre still cutting hard. Admittedly, my technique has improved a lot in that time also, as I've become much more dependant on files, and focused more on their use.
 
There are special cuts for soft metals like aluminum , lead , and they do make a big difference.
I wonder if some of the solid lubes would be useful .Graphite , hexagonal boron , teflon , but I've never tried.
 
OK, I'm understand the break in ,now. It makes sense. I usually just go easy with a new file. Makes sense to micro-round the teeth to smooth out the edges.

File re-sharpening services use a strong acid to etch the steel, thus creating a rough surface where it was made smooth by use. This isn't quite a new sharp edge, but gives the file a little more life. The charge is usually only a couple bucks per file.
 
I used to use graphite to lube weapons in Afghanistan and in the winter , I can't see why it would be detrimental . I think the wire edge on new files depends on the quality , some people say to chalk others not to chalk same with breaking in with brass . Is the breaking in more to save from rough initial cuts or from breaking off teeth?

I stole this from home machinist board:

http://www.rodder.com/roddingnews/articles/george/Tools2.pdf "When you get your new file it must be broken in. You break in a file by using it first on brass, bronze, or smooth iron." (bottom of page 2)

http://compass.seacadets.org/pdf/nrtc/tools/14256_ch28.pdf
"A new file should be broken in by using it first on brass, bronze, or smooth iron." (page 5)

Still can't find the one I saw originally though. May have been a smithing site.

Also lots of sites that advise breaking in a file by light cutting while it's new.
http://yarchive.net/metal/files.html
"New files benefit from a gentle break in period, during which fragile burrs are
worn off, rather than snapped off..taking a chunk of tooth with them. At the
same time the gullets become polished and less likely to pin up. I have found
that this process can be speeded up by gentle brushing on a soft wire brush on
the grinder. Naturally you always work in the direction of the tooth gullets.

A file that has not had this break in process, but is pushed hard, straight out
of the box, will have a short but nasty, lifetime tendency to pin badly!!"
 
Stacy, according to a post I read over on practical machinist forum, by one of the Boggs, they use a pressurized micro abrasive method to sharpen files. Or some such. I don't remember the exact details, but they claim to have developed a special and much more effective method that offers more consistent results than acid sharpening.

Of course, every business makes such claims. However, every one I've heard from that's used boggs has been thrilled with the results.


YMMV of course.


bladsmth said:
OK, I'm understand the break in ,now. It makes sense. I usually just go easy with a new file. Makes sense to micro-round the teeth to smooth out the edges.

File re-sharpening services use a strong acid to etch the steel, thus creating a rough surface where it was made smooth by use. This isn't quite a new sharp edge, but gives the file a little more life. The charge is usually only a couple bucks per file.
Click to expand...
 
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