MVF
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One is a Sig paddle-style, the other is a Safariland belt mount with a thumb release. I haven't gotten to play with them yet because I go tomorrow to get my pistol out of "jail"- yay!
Advice on full-size 9mm pistols please
- Thread starter MVF
- Start date
One is a Sig paddle-style, the other is a Safariland belt mount with a thumb release. I haven't gotten to play with them yet because I go tomorrow to get my pistol out of "jail"- yay!
- Joined
- Oct 3, 2000
- Messages
- 977
I was going to recommend either the 226 or an H&K USP. Enjoy!
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Alright folks, time to get this thread back on the front page where people can see it.
For a number of years, one pistol I've wanted to own is the Beretta 92FS. Not for any particular reason, beyond the fact that I like its styling, and it fits my hand well enough. But I've read some things about military experience with the M9 not being positive, like cracked frames and catastrophic failures with early models and such. Some sources say the design was bad and needed improvements, some blamed it on soft steel, some say it wasn't designed to manage constant use of the higher pressure 9mm load the military uses. Whatever the reason, it's hard to separate fact from chatter. So I'm asking folks I can go to directly for their own experience with the design, to see what they have to say on the matter.
For a number of years, one pistol I've wanted to own is the Beretta 92FS. Not for any particular reason, beyond the fact that I like its styling, and it fits my hand well enough. But I've read some things about military experience with the M9 not being positive, like cracked frames and catastrophic failures with early models and such. Some sources say the design was bad and needed improvements, some blamed it on soft steel, some say it wasn't designed to manage constant use of the higher pressure 9mm load the military uses. Whatever the reason, it's hard to separate fact from chatter. So I'm asking folks I can go to directly for their own experience with the design, to see what they have to say on the matter.
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It is none of those things.... the only reason you hear bad things about the pistol and its military use is because those M9's have tens of thousands of rounds through them and are beat to shit. They constantly reuse parts and keep throwing together guns with spare parts when something breaks. They're just so heavily used. Springs are worn to shit, frames have had insane round counts, etc. The pistol itself is perfectly fine when in good condition.
Ask two RKI's or people in general what the best <insert firearm type here> is and you will get at least 3 answers, probably more. It's almost like asking what the best 'shoes' are and what brand you prefer.
A good shooter will perform well with almost any firearm. A better firearm makes it easier for less skilled people to shoot acceptably "good enough". Almost any modern design firearm with a reasonably good manufacture quality is 'good enough' for nightstand duty. It's not like you are going to run ~2K rounds through them in a 4 day training class. If you shoot them that much, you probably aren't asking this question in the first place.
Regarding the "CZ shooting rough", it is a RANGE GUN! Is the recoil sping worn out? When was the last time it was serivced? Range guns are a nice step forward but, realize many of them are very poor examples of the model in question unless it is fairly new. Many range pistols have seen an enormous number of rounds through them with so little service you could argue they aren't being maintained at all.
The new S&W MP 2.0 with "Core" trigger is a very nice option at a <$500 pricepoint for most people. I personally find the CZ 75 models very attractive, especially in the upper end models like the "Orange" and other premium variants. While I am a Glock'aholic, I have no issue with modern variants from the well known Europen manufacturers. Ruger and Remington pistols are pretty bad IMHO while most of the other well recognized 'good' brands also make good pistols for nightstand duty and limited sporting uses.
Then you have the high end pistols like a the new SIG P-210, Wilson Combat, Nighthawk, STI, etc. which set a pretty high standard with a pricepoint to match.
It's a bit like buying a knife. Do I buy a PUMA SGB, IP, or a no kidding 4 or 5 Star fresh out of Germany? The vast majority of people will never notice nor appreciate the differences in spending more for an IP or no kidding all German Puma. I must admit too, that the PUMA SGB models I routinely use very good for how and what I use them for. Sometimes it is nice to use a ~$20 knife that performs well so you don't have to worry if it gets dropped off the ATV in the pasture or "lost" in a barn or tackle box for weeks at a time.
Best Regards,
Sid
A good shooter will perform well with almost any firearm. A better firearm makes it easier for less skilled people to shoot acceptably "good enough". Almost any modern design firearm with a reasonably good manufacture quality is 'good enough' for nightstand duty. It's not like you are going to run ~2K rounds through them in a 4 day training class. If you shoot them that much, you probably aren't asking this question in the first place.
Regarding the "CZ shooting rough", it is a RANGE GUN! Is the recoil sping worn out? When was the last time it was serivced? Range guns are a nice step forward but, realize many of them are very poor examples of the model in question unless it is fairly new. Many range pistols have seen an enormous number of rounds through them with so little service you could argue they aren't being maintained at all.
The new S&W MP 2.0 with "Core" trigger is a very nice option at a <$500 pricepoint for most people. I personally find the CZ 75 models very attractive, especially in the upper end models like the "Orange" and other premium variants. While I am a Glock'aholic, I have no issue with modern variants from the well known Europen manufacturers. Ruger and Remington pistols are pretty bad IMHO while most of the other well recognized 'good' brands also make good pistols for nightstand duty and limited sporting uses.
Then you have the high end pistols like a the new SIG P-210, Wilson Combat, Nighthawk, STI, etc. which set a pretty high standard with a pricepoint to match.
It's a bit like buying a knife. Do I buy a PUMA SGB, IP, or a no kidding 4 or 5 Star fresh out of Germany? The vast majority of people will never notice nor appreciate the differences in spending more for an IP or no kidding all German Puma. I must admit too, that the PUMA SGB models I routinely use very good for how and what I use them for. Sometimes it is nice to use a ~$20 knife that performs well so you don't have to worry if it gets dropped off the ATV in the pasture or "lost" in a barn or tackle box for weeks at a time.
Best Regards,
Sid
Win Heger
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If I was going to buy a full size 9mm, I'd be picking up a Sig P226, MK25 variant. I'm not a 9 guy and really don't want another ammo in the mix but I handled a MK25 and it's really nice! Besides it being a very nice gun, the added history is neat. Of course, I already have a P239, P229 and P220, so a P226 would feel right at home.
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So what differentiates the MK25 from the standard P226?
Win Heger
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Not 100% sure, I really had no interest, just curious. The trigger was nice on the one I handled. Of course, it is the same gun the Navy purchases and is marked accordingly. My Sig P220 is a W. German one and has been flawless over the years, My original P229 had a crappy trigger and I sold it, my newer P229 has a much better trigger, shoots very good. I think the MK25 has some other improvements, I did read a review that was good. My LGS had the MK25 for $899.00, a very tempting price!
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Got a CZ. Sights were way off - 6" at 25 yds with a Ransom Rest.. Had to go to the gunsmith. Made me wonder what else was off.
So...
Got a HK VP9. Super trigger pull and reset. Barrel seems just as low as the CZ. More accurate than I am. Goes BANG! every time I pulled the trigger - even with mixed assortments of ammo. http://www.gunsandammo.com/reviews/peoples-pistol-hk-vp9-review/ Guns and Ammo and American Rifleman Pistol of the Year for 2014.
So...
Got a HK VP9. Super trigger pull and reset. Barrel seems just as low as the CZ. More accurate than I am. Goes BANG! every time I pulled the trigger - even with mixed assortments of ammo. http://www.gunsandammo.com/reviews/peoples-pistol-hk-vp9-review/ Guns and Ammo and American Rifleman Pistol of the Year for 2014.
- Joined
- Jun 16, 2003
- Messages
- 20,194
Got a CZ. Sights were way off - 6" at 25 yds with a Ransom Rest.. Had to go to the gunsmith. Made me wonder what else was off.
So...
Got a HK VP9. Super trigger pull and reset. Barrel seems just as low as the CZ. More accurate than I am. Goes BANG! every time I pulled the trigger - even with mixed assortments of ammo. http://www.gunsandammo.com/reviews/peoples-pistol-hk-vp9-review/ Guns and Ammo and American Rifleman Handgun of the Year/Golden Bullseye for 2014.
So...
Got a HK VP9. Super trigger pull and reset. Barrel seems just as low as the CZ. More accurate than I am. Goes BANG! every time I pulled the trigger - even with mixed assortments of ammo. http://www.gunsandammo.com/reviews/peoples-pistol-hk-vp9-review/ Guns and Ammo and American Rifleman Handgun of the Year/Golden Bullseye for 2014.
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- Dec 21, 2016
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I went through the same process a few years back when I was deciding what my first handgun was going to be. I did get a chance to shoot a few but ultimately went with the gun that felt best in hand. That ended up being the Sig p226. I splurged and went for the tacops for the upgraded srt trigger which is AMAZING! Makes worlds of difference. I've since purchased 3 other fine handguns and my Sig is still the best and the one that sits by my nightstand. I have several thousand rounds through it and functions flawlessly. Takedown takes 30 seconds if not less once acquainted. The CZ would be a close second but all others are fine handguns but if you have the money and want one you'll have forever I say go for the P226 in any variation and you won't regret it. SRT trigger upgrade def check out as well.
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I second the VP9!
Fits my hand great, super reliable.
as was said before, more accurate than I am :thumbup:
I'm 56, so my eyes are not the greatest , but with the factory sights I can put 50 shots (5 mags in CT
) inside a 4" circle from 30 ft
with a laser sight, I've frequently been able to put 50 into a 2 inch circle, same distance.
never had a misfire in 2 years
Bill
Fits my hand great, super reliable.
as was said before, more accurate than I am :thumbup:
I'm 56, so my eyes are not the greatest , but with the factory sights I can put 50 shots (5 mags in CT
) inside a 4" circle from 30 ft with a laser sight, I've frequently been able to put 50 into a 2 inch circle, same distance.
never had a misfire in 2 years
Bill