All choked up : Folders with large finger choils .

DocJD

DocJD

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I recently received a Cold Steel American Lawman . Newest model s35vn steel . Very smooth opening and closing right from the box . Bank vault lock up . Nice low profile , EDC design .

Most outstanding aspect , compared to my many other CS folders is that very generous finger choil . Really helps in precise blade control .

Quite a few Spyderco folders have this kind of setup as a prominent feature . PM2 , Shaman , etc .

I think it's a pretty cool design feature , if you ever need to do any finely controlled /fussy cutting .
 
True, it helps to hsve twin finger choils as a prominant feature.
Let's take for instace the mini tuff light of which its handling would have turned out different without its signature twin finger cut outs.
 
I prefer a nice choil like on the Lawman over a large portion of unused handle like on the Recon-1. Personally, I would prefer a very narrow guard and an edge close to the hand in a standard grip over all of the above. I don't really see the point in having 3/4" of an inch of your knife's length not used for anything.
 
I think a well designed knife doesn't need a finger choil. I don't like taking away cutting edge but still have a full size handle. I mean if a 4-6 oz knife is unwieldy, then I have to wonder why you chose that knife . I guess I'm not much for "detail work".
 
What's really going on is the increased leverage you get from having that bit of handle between your index and middle fingers. We're not wired from the factory to pay attention to what our hands are doing at a granular level, but that bit of stickout allows you to "steer" the knife with much, much, more precision than you would have, otherwise.

Although bachman is correct, with some context:

Large ricassos do nothing for the "easy use" quotient of a knife. Ideally, the blade should have no ricasso at all. Extending the edge all the way to the handle eliminates the need for "choking up", because.... you're already there.

Like this:

tssbusf.jpg


Handle profile is another aspect of this that very few people think about, even though it's very important. A wide, flat handle makes it easier to "feel" (for lack of a better word) how the knife is positioned in your hand.

So, you don't really need the choil, if you pay attention to design.

But. Commercial knife design takes a lot of cues from "tactical knives". Which have large choils, sub-hilts, and other such high-speed, low-drag features. So, it's less of a case of form following function, than it is an example of form being accidentally functional.....
 
DocJD said:
I recently received a Cold Steel American Lawman . Newest model s35vn steel . Very smooth opening and closing right from the box . Bank vault lock up . Nice low profile , EDC design .

Most outstanding aspect , compared to my many other CS folders is that very generous finger choil . Really helps in precise blade control .

Quite a few Spyderco folders have this kind of setup as a prominent feature . PM2 , Shaman , etc .

I think it's a pretty cool design feature , if you ever need to do any finely controlled /fussy cutting .
Click to expand...
It sounds like this is your first experience with the Lawman. Th AL is a knife with some great aspects. Strong, light, thin, able to be used for detail work and hard work. As an edc, it ranks right at the top of my preference list along with the PM2.
 
Shorttime said:
What's really going on is the increased leverage you get from having that bit of handle between your index and middle fingers. We're not wired from the factory to pay attention to what our hands are doing at a granular level, but that bit of stickout allows you to "steer" the knife with much, much, more precision than you would have, otherwise.

Although bachman is correct, with some context:

Large ricassos do nothing for the "easy use" quotient of a knife. Ideally, the blade should have no ricasso at all. Extending the edge all the way to the handle eliminates the need for "choking up", because.... you're already there.

Like this:

tssbusf.jpg


Handle profile is another aspect of this that very few people think about, even though it's very important. A wide, flat handle makes it easier to "feel" (for lack of a better word) how the knife is positioned in your hand.

So, you don't really need the choil, if you pay attention to design.

But. Commercial knife design takes a lot of cues from "tactical knives". Which have large choils, sub-hilts, and other such high-speed, low-drag features. So, it's less of a case of form following function, than it is an example of form being accidentally functional.....
Click to expand...

Kitchen knives are like that.

The problem is that the design works for tall blades only or otherwise the handle will be too narrow.
 
Shorttime said:
Large ricassos do nothing for the "easy use" quotient of a knife. Ideally, the blade should have no ricasso at all. Extending the edge all the way to the handle eliminates the need for "choking up", because.... you're already there.
Click to expand...
Precisely, if the blade is so long that it needs to be choked, then eliminate the choil and the extra length that it creates.
 
In my opinion, they are largely a gimmick and one that Spyderco has quite effectively cashed-in on. The grip you take when using the choil is rarely used in normal cutting. Sure, it feels great in the hand when you're sitting around admiring your knife but when you go to cut something, really pay attention to how often you need that choil.

I remember seeing a Cedric and Ada video about the Native 5 and he's just lavishing the knife with praise for it's amazing ergonomics. Specifically talking about the choil and how it locks into your hand all that. Then he immediately goes into a rope-cutting-edge-test sequence wherein he did not use the choil at all.
 
I edc a native 5 at work (factory setting, cut various vinyls, tapes, plastics, cardboard, etc). I use the choil just about every time I cut with the knife EXCEPT when I have to do a long-reach draw cut on cardboard; then I'm essentially holding the handle with my fingertips.

I love finger choils.
 
I do like a good finger choil on a knife, folder or fixed. It's not make or break either way but I get why some dislike them.

On cold steel folders, some of them anyway, my main problem is the large distance between the blade and where the forefinger is placed on the handle. The recon1 is a prime example. I really wanted to love that knife. Even owned two examples. Just couldn't get over it.

I've sort of moved away from CS for various reasons. I'm content with what I have mostly. I do still consider another recon1 every once and a while, I'm not quite sure why as I already know why I haven't kept the previous two. An American lawman is tempting especially because it alleviates the handle problem on the recon1 with the choil.
 
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