Anyone else hate waterproofs ?

pitdog

pitdog

Joined
Apr 13, 2007
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That is modern materials such as Gore-Tex etc.

I wear water ' resistant ' soft shells such as those made by Buffalo and Paramo everytime over the so called breathable sweat bags !!!

I even prefer wearing wool layers and getting a little wet while staying warm rather than wearing a water proof and sweating like a pig and rustling with every step.

If Ventile clothing was cheaper I'd definitely give that a go.

What's your thoughts, how do you layer up for wet winter weather ?
 
I love eVent and I like Gore-Tex. They're not perfect, but I would much prefer them to plastic clothing or trash bags in the rain. Well tailored garments actually have ventilation zips etc to help as well. eVent seems even better to me, it's even cheaper. Just keep it clean to keep it working at optimum efficiency.
 
I prefer wool undergarments and regular canvas or oilcloth canvas as an outer. I do have a very nice sweat bag that I wear once in awhile and yes it does sweat a lot. I've found myself going with the more traditional but heavier stuff and find I am a lot more comfortable in winter.
 
I like "waterproofs".

How much sense they make depends on your activity. If I'm doing a hard hike, then "waterproofs" may not be the best choice, but if I'm standing around for hours in the rain, photographing wildlife, then waterproofs are great. I don't build up that much perspiration when I'm just standing around in them.

And the ventilation systems on "Waterproofs" can work pretty well, even if not perfectly.
 
Ibex Merino next to my skin, fleece midlayer if needed for insulation, Mountain Hardwear Exposure II shell w/ pit zips. I adjust layers and zippers to not sweat too much.
 
I love my waterproof clothing. But that is probably because I have to sit in rain for 8-10 hours sometimes when I am hunting. I guess if I was just going for a hike it may be a bit much.
 
Iboschi said:
I love eVent and I like Gore-Tex. They're not perfect, but I would much prefer them to plastic clothing or trash bags in the rain. Well tailored garments actually have ventilation zips etc to help as well. eVent seems even better to me, it's even cheaper. Just keep it clean to keep it working at optimum efficiency.
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When the military finally got professionals involved in uniform design, they did scientific tests of WP-breathable fabrics. eVent breaths 600% as well as the best Gore material. eVent, being German, was politically out of the question.

The most used outer garment in the new military outdoor uniform is water-repellant, backed up by a poncho. Politics limited the choice of fabric for the water-repellant garment to inferior materials, but it still breaths far better than a waterproof-breathable.

All water-proof breathables have the problem of the cute little holes freeezing shut if it's too far below freezing. Then you do have a plastic bag - less any vents provided.
 
I like eVent material, plus Marmot's MemBrain, and whatever Eddie Bauer's 365 Weatheredge shells use.

There's lots of different types of Gore-Tex. The old school stuff we tested in the ECWCS system was bulky, and didn't breathe well. Some of the newer fabrics are a lot better.
Much nicer to live in than the stuff I grew up with. Beyond old Gore-Tex, polypros, and some other long underwear, I only just started actively trying(and exercising in) "high tech" clothing in the last year-particularly last winter. Never been so comfortable.

Not waterproof, but that Polartec PowerStretch stuff is so awesome...I wore it last winter at work under a Carharrt canvas shirt jac with flannel lining, and was good into the teens while busy and moving(very nice combo of old and new tech, IMO). Trying out a Carharrt softshell, now, but have only used it a couple of weeks, and only into the upper 30s.
The only merino wool I have is socks, but it sounds great for baselayers-next on the list!
 
I hate soft shells. The ones I've tried(not a lot) feel and sound like a plastic bag and have about the same measure of durability.
 
in the winter (no rain) my only goregarment is in my overmitts

when moving base layer of light merino or capilene, midlayer (if needed) R1 pullover- a power Power Dry variant and a windshirt (if needed) that has a good DWR finish- good enough to shed snow

when stopped a down jacket comes out

safe winter backcountry travel dependsa lot on not getting wet- which really equates to not sweating- gore doesn't do such a good job of preventing sweat if your moving, e vent is better but you'll still sweat
 
Yes..! I love all my "Gore-tex" gear. Lets face it... nothing is perfect..! Now that being said if you go out setting yourself up for failure then fail is what you will have. When it's 40 deg F and raining while chopping wood or hiking up a killer grade you will get hot, you will need less layers than someone siting at camp carving a spoon. The simple fix is to take a layer off and open up your pit vents. If it's below freezing enough to "freeze" up the cute little holes in your "Gore-tex" coat then the same thing will happen to any coat. Fyi, this has never happened to my coat... only the bottom half of my pants.

Either way, wear what you've got and when given the chance try newer gear. :thumbup:

Ski

Layers...
Feet - merino wool socks and "Gore-tex" boots
legs - regular boxers, light weight Polar Tech power dry long undies, some kind of synthetic pant (maybe 50/50)
body - heavy weight Polar Tech power dry long undies, 1/4 zip fleece pullover or full zip heavy fleece jacket, my old Army "Gore-tex" coat
head - ball cap or fleece beanie
hands - thin leather gloves up to insulated "Gore-tex" gloves (carhart)
 
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pitdog said:
I even prefer wearing wool layers and getting a little wet while staying warm rather than wearing a water proof and sweating like a pig and rustling with every step.
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Same here. Unless it is persisting down then I'm in a merino wool t-shirt and maybe a Windstopper vest to protect my core.
I tramp hot (t-shirt and sweating when others are in fleece) so being cold is not an issue. Of course, as soon as I stop walking, I put warm and waterproof clothing on at once.
And a big AOL-style "me too" to the rustling of nylong and Gretex. Arrggghh!
 
Not my favourite wear, but a necessary evil here in the wet UK.

If conditions are cold and damp, my preference is a water resistant soft shell. When it is raining, my current jacket is Gore Tex Pro Shell based. It is much improved over older Gore Tex fabrics, especially condensation control, but it is not perfect. Its just something you learn to put up with.
 
ECWCS gore tex for me, that thin new stuff rips way too easy. I have taken my issued stuff to hell and back and its still going strong.
 
I just accept that I'm going to get soaked from sweat or water, so use a PU coated nylon coat for wet weather. It's cheap, so I'm not concerned if it gets ripped up when offtrack. The main thing is that it keeps me warm when in a cold rain.
 
I don't wear a hardshell unless it's pouring or I'm not moving and it's raining. And it is not a breathable, but a dedicated Helly Hansen Impertech. If I'm backpacking, I'll be warm in almost all temps and I'll change clothes when cooling off and stopping to camp.

Other than that, it's wool on wool, and then packable down over top in the cold, if necessary.
 
I like eVent for breathability and light weight, and GoreTex for heavy wet and durability. I find both to be much more comfortable than natural materials most of the time.
 
ohski said:
Yes..! I love all my "Gore-tex" gear. Lets face it... nothing is perfect..! Now that being said if you go out setting yourself up for failure then fail is what you will have. When it's 40 deg F and raining while chopping wood or hiking up a killer grade you will get hot, you will need less layers than someone siting at camp carving a spoon. The simple fix is to take a layer off and open up your pit vents. If it's below freezing enough to "freeze" up the cute little holes in your "Gore-tex" coat then the same thing will happen to any coat. Fyi, this has never happened to my coat... only the bottom half of my pants.

Either way, wear what you've got and when given the chance try newer gear. :thumbup:

Ski

Layers...
Feet - merino wool socks and "Gore-tex" boots
legs - regular boxers, light weight Polar Tech power dry long undies, some kind of synthetic pant (maybe 50/50)
body - heavy weight Polar Tech power dry long undies, 1/4 zip fleece pullover or full zip heavy fleece jacket, my old Army "Gore-tex" coat
head - ball cap or fleece beanie
hands - thin leather gloves up to insulated "Gore-tex" gloves (carhart)
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I sure agree nothing is perfect, and surely the problem is when you are active. And proper temp management surely is smart.

But, Ski, the holes in non-waterpoof garments are simply too large to have the same problem. Anyone here ever have a water-repellent garment turn into a plastic sack?

I you never experienced the problem in water-proof breathable garments, it has been duplicated in Army labs. I experienced it with Gore-Tex at 25F and below. You have apparently experienced it with your pants. well below freezing, waterproof garments seem quite unnecessary.

It's the 40 and raining that you describe that is a PITA.
 
I grew up in England with wool and canvas.
When you are in the mountains in driving rain, then you have no alternative but to wear waterproofs.
I had a long cagoule and chaps, and it was a sweat bag.
But you would strip down to a string vest and perhaps a woolen shirt under the cagoule

Getting to the US, I discovered ponchos, which were good for walking in forests but not for gale force mountain tops.
When I returned to England, I again used my Hele Hansen Cagoule.

I often use a stout windproof umbrella as a walking stick, and is great for anything less than wind driven rain
 
skab8541 said:
ECWCS gore tex for me, that thin new stuff rips way too easy. I have taken my issued stuff to hell and back and its still going strong.
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ECWCS Gen I was judged a disaster and replaced by Gen II that at least had vents. when that was unsatisfactory, real professional were hired and the novel concept of large-scale testing of prototypes as used to verify and improve decisions. The current issue has an insulated, water-repellent outer layer for real cold and water-repellent soft shell plus poncho for most other applications. Standing guard in heavy rain? Get out the heavy, hard-to-stuff, sorta breathable Gore-tex hard shell.
 
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