Automotive sandpaper or woodworking sandpaper?

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Feb 12, 2006
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Which do you guys use to sharpen your knives? What grit 'spectrum' do you use?
Also when you sharpen like this do you always pull the edge along the paper or do you push it like you would on traditional stones (I've never used sandpaper to sharpen so I apologize if I sound oblivious). I've watched a few videos on sharpening convex edges and they all drag the blade (or pull it) along the paper, j/w if that was convex only or for all edges.
 
Wet/dry sandpaper (from 3M or Norton, as in the automotive type).

I use some or all in the range of 220 thru 2000. 220/320 to remove metal fast, 400/600/800 for varying degrees of 'satin' finish, and 1000+ for polishing. Most of my maintenance is done with just 1000/2000 grit, then stropping.

Most often, sandpaper is used on softish backing (like leather or a mousepad), with an edge-trailing stroke. That will produce a convex edge. With practice, as you develop some feel for it, you can use the sandpaper on hard backing (wood, glass) with an edge-leading stroke, which will produce a V-bevel (if just slightly convexed, when done without a jig/guide). Woodworkers often do it this way, to sharpen their chisels & plane blades.
 
What exactly do u mean when you say wet/dry sandpaper? Also is it necessary to strop after using the paper or is it just for polishing/removing burrs... and do u strop loaded or unloaded?
btw thanks for the info I'll probably stop by lowe's after work:)
 
Lowe's has wet/dry sandpaper. It's used for dry or wet sanding. Other dry sandpapers will loose the grit when whet, the sand just falls off.
 
What exactly do u mean when you say wet/dry sandpaper? Also is it necessary to strop after using the paper or is it just for polishing/removing burrs... and do u strop loaded or unloaded?
btw thanks for the info I'll probably stop by lowe's after work:)

As foxx pointed out, the wet/dry sandpaper is made to be used either with or without water. I use it dry, although it's water-resistant character makes cleaning it up very easy (can be rinsed off). Lowe's and Home Depot have some, usually in the 180/220 thru 600 grit range. Woodcraft stores (and online) carry the Norton brand, in grits all the way up to 2000. Automotive finishing supply stores will have at least some of the finer grits too.

Stropping isn't necessary but, as with all sharpening options, it's about preference. However, if the proper work is done in sharpening, stropping will take the edge to another level. I use both loaded and unloaded strops, in that order. What you load it with is again about preference (I've been using Simichrome polishing paste a lot lately), but options include diamond paste/spray, green compound or other materials.
 
Thanks guys!
I assume this method is like others as in it just takes lots of practice to become proficient... and to start out on my cheaper blades first huh?
 
Which do you guys use to sharpen your knives? What grit 'spectrum' do you use?
Also when you sharpen like this do you always pull the edge along the paper or do you push it like you would on traditional stones (I've never used sandpaper to sharpen so I apologize if I sound oblivious). I've watched a few videos on sharpening convex edges and they all drag the blade (or pull it) along the paper, j/w if that was convex only or for all edges.



I use the wet/dry as well. It's usually silicone carbide as the abrasive where the woodworking sandpaper is usually aluminum oxide. The silicone carbide is just a bit harder and since it fractures with use it stays pretty sharp even as the particles break down in size. One of the better tips I can give you is to keep handy one of the rubber blocks used for refreshing belt sanders. When you sharpen with SiC you'll see the paper getting loaded up with metal and abrasive dust. Keeping it clean helps it out quite a bit. Generally (as the others have mentioned) I use an edge trailing motion when convexing, unless I'm converting a knife over for the first time. When using the coarser grits I'll adopt a back and forth stroke till I get well under way, and sometimes use a back and forth for the first dozen passes or so when changing to a finer grit. Best place to get the wet/dry is an automotive store. Lowe's will have it, but not a great selection.

Stropping is matter of preference, but I find it's not possible for me to match the quality of the edge I get when finishing with a loose grit on a strop. Nothing else can totally remove the last little bit of burr and really clean up the apex. When used for maintenance it also removes a lot less metal than putting the knife back on a fixed abrasive (stone, sandpaper, etc). I keep strops on hand for everything from 120 grit right up to the green CrO at 1/2 micron. They all get used.

HH
 
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cant argue with a guy whose name is "obsessed with edges". id add to just go slow and easy as if every pass were the last thing you were ever going to do ;)
 
Get them at your Home Depot, local hardware store, or automotive shop.

I would recommend that you start with 320-grit or 400 grit, get some 600, 800, and 1000 grit for finish & polishing/stropping. 320-grit is plenty for sharpening most knives and can get your knife to hair-popping sharp.

I would not recommend anything less than 320 grit for knife sharpening. The 120 and 220 grit are just too rough and are only meant for removing a lot of steel or wood. If you hit your slightly dull knife on these low-grit papers, you will discover that you have just scratched-up the whole edge.
 
Thanks guys... I'll be hitting up an automotive store this weekend...
Hey pete, that folder in your avatar, what is it?
 
I want to learn to sharpen my blades freehand (tired of kits and depending on others who sharpen my knives) and my guess is that sandpaper + leather storp would be a good first way to learn, cause it's cheap, it requires manual skills (which is always stimulating and rewarding) and since I am not that "obsessed with edges" myself (at least not yet) my goal (for the moment) is not perfection...just a good clean edge that fits my needs (even tho I assume there's no really better system, just better operators).
Don't want to add too many threads on this forum, so I'm posting here and I'm sure u will be able to give me a big help and useful answers.
Do u think I should start with edge trailing or edge leading? and why? is it better to start with sandpaper on "smoothest" surfaces (leather, mousepads, etc) or on wood? why? and most of all, how do I manage the angle when sharpening on sandpaper? do u use any "help" or just use ur eye and hands?
I have read the very clear and useful thread about stropping on this forum, so I will take that as a guide for stropping...but I need to pass through sandpaper before
:cool:
 
I want to learn to sharpen my blades freehand (tired of kits and depending on others who sharpen my knives) and my guess is that sandpaper + leather storp would be a good first way to learn, cause it's cheap, it requires manual skills (which is always stimulating and rewarding) and since I am not that "obsessed with edges" myself (at least not yet) my goal (for the moment) is not perfection...just a good clean edge that fits my needs (even tho I assume there's no really better system, just better operators).
Don't want to add too many threads on this forum, so I'm posting here and I'm sure u will be able to give me a big help and useful answers.

It's an affliction that strikes without warning. You'll never see it coming, then you'll wake up, one day, and it's too late. You're hooked. ;)

Do u think I should start with edge trailing or edge leading? and why?

Definitely edge-trailing, when starting out with sandpaper on a soft backing (leather, mousepad, etc.). And at least while you're developing the 'feel' for it, I'd recommend edge-trailing with the hard backing, too (such as on wood or glass). When you've gained a feel for maintaining proper angle and pressure, I think it'll feel more comfortable to you to try edge-leading on hard backing too.

is it better to start with sandpaper on "smoothest" surfaces (leather, mousepads, etc) or on wood? why?

As I mentioned above, I believe edge-trailing to be very easy to learn, when starting out. For this reason, it's all-the-more appropriate to start with soft backing. It's a little more forgiving to inconsistency in angle & pressure so, if your technique is a little bit off, it won't do as much damage as quickly, as will be the case if using poor technique on a hard backing.

and most of all, how do I manage the angle when sharpening on sandpaper? do u use any "help" or just use ur eye and hands?

Start out very conservative. Keep the angle as low as possible, and pressure light. It helps, when learning it for the first time, to mark the bevel with a black marker (like a Sharpie), and inspect closely, with a magnifier, where the ink is being removed as you work. If you see the ink coming off at the shoulder of the bevel, but not the edge, your angle is too low (shallow). If, on the other hand, you see ink coming off only at the VERY edge, but not at the shoulder of the bevel, your angle is a little too high. Make a few passes on the sandpaper (maybe 3 to 5), then inspect. Keep working this way, and you'll soon get a feel for the correct angle.

As for pressure, always keep it light. I think a reasonable amount would be similar to wiping some peanut butter from the edge of your knife, as if there were a paper towel on your backing, instead of the sandpaper. That's a good starting point. As you work, you'll begin to get the feel for it. If your hands are getting sore/fatigued, you're using too much pressure. It should be smooth & comfortable. If you feel like you need to bear down on it, to remove metal effectively, that's your cue that you probably need to select a coarser grit. Let the grit do the 'grunt' work.

At the coarsest grit stage, it's important to make sure you've completely apexed the edge, before moving to the next grit. This usually is indicated by forming a burr/wire edge. You should use good magnification, under bright light, to help you see the burr. Experience, over time, will allow you to 'feel' for the burr as it forms. But, when starting out, I truly believe it's best to actually SEE it. Once it's formed, the following stages are all about reducing the burr and refining the edge (making the scratch pattern finer). As the edge becomes more refined, and you progress through the higher (finer) grits, reduce the pressure even more. By the time you've reached the finest grit, pressure should be feather-light, as if using the edge to gently brush some some dust off the sandpaper.

I'd also recommend starting with a very fine grit (maybe 1000/2000). Especially for general maintenance & touch-ups (if stropping doesn't quite do it), this will do fine, most of the time. And, starting at a finer grit will obviously do less damage, if you're still trying to figure out the correct angle and pressure. The coarser grits (400 and below) are for relatively heavy metal removal. If your edge is already in pretty good shape before you start, they'd be overkill, most of the time (UNLESS you intend to completely reshape the bevel anyway).

I have read the very clear and useful thread about stropping on this forum, so I will take that as a guide for stropping...but I need to pass through sandpaper before
:cool:

This may sound a bit strange, but I actually 'trained' my hands for the sandpaper method (edge-trailing), by learning to strop properly beforehand. I didn't plan it that way, but was OBSESSIVE about learning to strop. One day, out of the blue, it just seemed natural to put a piece of sandpaper on my strop block, and go for it. My hands were ready for it. It's exactly the same motion/technique as stropping, but at a coarser grit.
 
I have this feeling that u are right on this...I won't see the obsession coming till it's too late....
I will let u know about my first trials and possible mistakes or doubts.
Meanwhile, just one word.
THANKS.
:cool:
 
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