Avoiding mile wide bevels from 17° sharpening angle? Pros & Cons of sharpening at 20-22°?

B

breadteam

Joined
Nov 14, 2009
Messages
4
Hey folks - I just started sharpening with a 1x30" belt grinder. It has an angle guide. I have an electronic angle finder. I'm not a pro, just a guy who sharpens my own knives and those of friends.

I noticed online that Curry Custom Cutlery and some other professional sharpening folks on YouTube are using this machine to sharpen edge leading at ~16.5-17° angles.

When I do that, I end up with very "wide" bevels. I remember doing this with my Tormek years ago and I would sometimes run into a situation where blades chipped from such an acute angle! It was horrifying.

How do you folks feel about less acute angles on kitchen knives? Like 20-22°?

I see that many commercial knives come out of the box with less wide bevels like this. Zwilling knives, for example, have a barely visible bevel.

Can you tell me the pros and cons to sharpening kitchen knives (and paring knives) at 17° vs 20-22°?

Thanks!
 
It all depends what the steel and its heat treat can take. I routinely sharpen kitchen knives to 12 degrees per side, but those are Japanese knives with very good steel. For good German knives, 15-17 degrees is good. For steel that is not at those levels, who knows.

I sharpen Chinese cleavers to 25 degrees, because they take a lot more impact.

Wide bevels are nice for pure slicing, but maybe not so fun to sharpen. If you add a microbevel at a higher angle, you will increase the strength of the edge against chipping, while not really compromising the slicing ability. It's a really nice combination.
 
UncleBoots said:
It all depends what the steel and its heat treat can take. I routinely sharpen kitchen knives to 12 degrees per side, but those are Japanese knives with very good steel. For good German knives, 15-17 degrees is good. For steel that is not at those levels, who knows.

I sharpen Chinese cleavers to 25 degrees, because they take a lot more impact.

Wide bevels are nice for pure slicing, but maybe not so fun to sharpen. If you add a microbevel at a higher angle, you will increase the strength of the edge against chipping, while not really compromising the slicing ability. It's a really nice combination.
Click to expand...
Thanks for replying!

I suppose it's all the same to me in terms of ease of sharpening on the belt grinder, but aesthetically I find the less acute angles to be more pleasing to look at. And I guess I'm still horrified at the look of my friend's knife with chips all up and down the edge when I sharpened it at what may have been a 15-17° angle back in the day.

But hey, Curry Custom Cutlery sharpens like hundreds of knives a week at just under 17° and he seems to be doing fine.

I still hope to get more opinions on this topic!
 
Start your bevel at a lower angle and the use a micro bevel at the very edge to keep the knife slicey but still durable. Anytime you go very thin on the edge you will get a wide bevel, it depends on the thickness behind the edge from the get go. If the knife is ground very thin behind the edge it will be vulnerable to abuse & hard use but it will have a less wide bevel later after repeat sharpening.
 
It really depends on who is using the knife too. I like 15 dps but sharpen them at 21+ for my wife and friends, which is often still too acute.
 
I have mid-level German steel kitchen knives. They are advertised at 16 degrees per side. I keep 'em there and have never had issues with chipping and the like. With moderate use and not hard use. I prefer this to 20 degrees or thereabouts. Slicey-ness is a good quality.
 
When I sharpen cheap knives for friends I run higher angles than I normally due. That is for 2 reasons, number one being junk steel and number 2 being the end user. I sharpen friends cheap folding and or fixed blades at 20 degrees, and kitchen knives in the 18-20 degree range. Even at those angles it's common for them to still get jacked up.

Most of my folding knives in quality steel get taken down to 15 degrees, my Japanese kitchen knives are in the 10-15 degree range with most being 10-12 degrees. The kitchen knives are ground extremely thin behind the edge so even at 10 degrees they have smaller bevels than say my PM2 at 15 degrees.
 
Having looked at edges with a microscope I've seen more micro chipping than I wanted. I'm in the 18-20 degree camp for pretty much everything at this point.
 
Strauss95 said:
When I sharpen cheap knives for friends I run higher angles than I normally due. That is for 2 reasons, number one being junk steel and number 2 being the end user. I sharpen friends cheap folding and or fixed blades at 20 degrees, and kitchen knives in the 18-20 degree range. Even at those angles it's common for them to still get jacked up.

Most of my folding knives in quality steel get taken down to 15 degrees, my Japanese kitchen knives are in the 10-15 degree range with most being 10-12 degrees. The kitchen knives are ground extremely thin behind the edge so even at 10 degrees they have smaller bevels than say my PM2 at 15 degrees.
Click to expand...
Can you give me more detail about what mean by "behind the edge"? I've seen that phrase used and I'm not exactly sure I know what it means.
 
breadteam said:
Can you give me more detail about what mean by "behind the edge"? I've seen that phrase used and I'm not exactly sure I know what it means.
Click to expand...
It's literally the amount of metal Right behind the sharpest part of the knife blade.
Measured in thickness.

a Very Sharp edc might be 0.008 -.012" bte (thin knife)

but a Busse chopper might be .070" bte (Thick edge)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top