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The BladeForums.com 2024 Traditional Knife is ready to order! See this thread for details: https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/bladeforums-2024-traditional-knife.2003187/
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Awesome- Crawford Survival Staff
- Thread starter mercop
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Esav Benyamin
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I hiked a lot with my Crawford staff, and later used the cane. Instead of the t-handle, I used the push pick for a cane handle.
You can also screw the dagger into the spike tip base. Now walking with the cane, you can unscrew that base, have a dagger in one hand and the cane in the other -- or with the t-handle, a war hammer.
You can also screw the dagger into the spike tip base. Now walking with the cane, you can unscrew that base, have a dagger in one hand and the cane in the other -- or with the t-handle, a war hammer.
I just don't see much point. In an urban environment, I'm not going to be screwing/unscrewing the pieces to arrange it into my weapon of choice for the bad guys around the corner. If I felt the need to arm myself, I'd get a gun, staff, cane, or knife, any of which would be cheaper than this staff. If training with a stick, I'd train with my cane or staff, bought or built customized to my liking, and not be switching between them before mastering both.
In the wilderness, same thing. 99% of the time, I'd opt for telescopic trekking poles. Cheaper and lighter. I'm a hiker, so of course I'm biased, but if you put me at a trailhead with 5,000 vertical feet in front me, I'd be thankful to take a light, telescopic trekking pole or two, but would almost certainly ditch any staff half a mile after the terrain gets steep.
It wouldn't suit my needs as a balancing aid, but it does offer other features. It's heavy and stiff - I could beat people or animals with it, whereas I would not try this with a trekking pole. In my time outside, I've needed to be mobile and agile (hands/pack free of heavy staff) more frequently than I've needed a weapon. It's definitely legitimate to want a stout weapon though, so suppose you're one of those people. What makes this staff superior to a wooden one or a home-made metal one made for $15 (95% off this staff's MSRP)?
Well, I suppose it's the additional features:
It has a knife. OK, knives are cool and useful, we all like them here. That's why I already carry a belt knife and a multi-tool. I think everyone here carries at least one dedicated blade. So when are you going to unscrew this knife? When you're taking a break and need to slice your lunch? Probably not, you'd probably use one of the purpose-built knives with comfortable handles and that uses steel and grinds built exactly to your liking, because you've spent so much time learning about them and investing in them. OK, so it's a backup blade.
I'm stranded in the woods and lost my primary knife - it could happen. I personally will have a backup (multi-tool blade at the least) that would serve woodcraft tasks better than the Crawford's longer (more awkward without proper profiling) blade and less of a handle than a SAK or LM. It looks like the blade has a very thin, round handle, which I imagine would be a PITA to use in the bush. It would strain the fingers and the small, cold metal would likely suck to have to keep a strong grip on in cold weather (with or without gloves, just imagine using a 5" blade with a metal pencil for a handle). Furthermore, I'd argue that the pliers, can opener, tweezers or whatever your MT has in it would probably be more useful than the rest of the features of the staff. So if I'm not using this backup blade as a backup blade because I have a better one, what do I use it for?
AS A SPEAR!!!! What's cooler than putting a big blade on a stick and stabbing things?! Not much, but then again what are the chances of this being useful to me in a survival situation? Not much. I like spears as much as the next guy and if in a TEOTWAWKI scenario, using my knife to sharpen a stick would probably be one of the first things I'd do after getting settled down a bit and meeting more basic requirements of water and shelter. But really, are you going to hunt with it? Creep up on animals and stab them? It's possible, and maybe Crawford Staff users are more skilled at this sort of thing than I am, but personally, and for most laymen, the time would probably be much better spent with traps, snares, and more conventional hunting methods. I would prefer sticks and stones for hunting small game than spearing them. Large game or medium game? I'm not going to take on a moose with a staff and thin stainless blade even if I'd managed to sneak up on them. For trapped animals, I'd club them with a stick, not try to skewer them.
OK, so for hunting the spear doesn't do much for me, but I can use it to defend myself, can't I? Well, yes, but it is it worth it? I would be more likely to cut myself walking around with the blade on top than I would be to have some wild animals attack me and need to use it to defend myself. Keep the blade stored inside? OK, sure, but is that cougar going to say "hi I'm going to eat you soon" so that you can get it out and ready yourself to kick to some feline ass? Unlikely. Two-legged predators... a spear would definitely add some security if I know that they're about and presenting a significantly larger threat than usual. However, in this case, I'd prefer to be armed with a real gun of some sort. If there were bad guys out to get me or whom I might run into and I knew this (because otherwise the spear is useless because it's being stored inside the tube), I'd probably be investing my time in escape and evasion (light and mobile = sans staff) or in arming myself appropriately. A spear is effective but not as effective as a gun. Furthermore, is it more effective than a staff? Probably in trained hands, but in untrained hands, I wouldn't be surprised if a solid wooden staff is more effective (more instinctive to use, less chance of freezing up and having your opponent close the gap while you try to align the blade) and presents less chance of getting yourself cut. MERCOP would know more about this than me, but I'm certainly skeptical of the utility of a spear being worth the investment.
Perhaps you've disagreed with me already and if so, go for one! If you're still with me, we have to look at the rest of things it offers before making a decision. That is to say, its blowgun.
I think the blowgun is pretty cool. For those of you who have not used one before, they are very easy to learn and could take small game with less skill than is necessary for throwing stones but more than using a gun. I would have to examine this particular one before making a decision about it, but from the site, the blowgun section appears to be 38" long. In the world of blowguns, volume is everything, and three feet is certainly on the short end. A five foot blowgun would give significantly more penetration power and six or seven feet would be ideal. If you look at people who actually USE blowguns to hunt, you find that they tend to be 5 to 8'. I'm not saying 3' is impotent, but that it's not going to be as effective as blowguns you read about. The darts look positively tiny. I've made blowguns and used them. 8" of coat hanger wire with or without a little razor-blade broadhead in a full-size blowgun is POWERFUL. I'm afraid that these tiny darts (3" max looking at the picture) shot out of 3' of tubing would bounce off thick skin at longer ranges or simply stick into the sides of closer game while they run off to live or die somewhere far away from where that's useful to you; time you've spent dying rather than surviving. This is speculation, if anyone has a penetration test for this blowgun, I'm curious to see it. I suspect it uncomfortably straddles the line between being a toy and being a weapon.
Looking at it some more, it appears as though there's a single foam tube cover for the hand. In the summer, this doesn't matter much, but in the winter, it becomes critical. In cold weather, conduction will rob your hands of heat very rapidly. If the handle can be slid to whatever position you need it to be at and stay there, this isn't a problem - you wouldn't lose heat faster than with any other staff. If it isn't programmable or doesn't stay where you put it, however, and you end up frequently holding the metal, that could be a recipe for frostbite. As someone who has been cold, I can tell you it's F'ing Scary. Not being able to fix a lace on your shoe or pack because your fingers aren't working properly is a bad situation getting worse. I don't know whether this is a problem with the staff or not: I'd have to try it out, but if it is, I'd end up wrapping it in spare fabric or else ditching it in some cold-weather survival situations. For $300, I don't think I should have to be making modifications like that.
From what I see on the website, The Crawfords look like decent people making a high-quality product that people are willing to buy. It's novel, it's probably a lot of fun to own and play with, but at the end of the day, I suspect it wouldn't get out of the closet much.
If you're looking at the staff and think it's the coolest thing you've ever seen, you'd probably be happy with your purchase. If you have a budget and plan on actually using it, I'd strongly consider what you're buying and look at alternative options.
In the wilderness, same thing. 99% of the time, I'd opt for telescopic trekking poles. Cheaper and lighter. I'm a hiker, so of course I'm biased, but if you put me at a trailhead with 5,000 vertical feet in front me, I'd be thankful to take a light, telescopic trekking pole or two, but would almost certainly ditch any staff half a mile after the terrain gets steep.
It wouldn't suit my needs as a balancing aid, but it does offer other features. It's heavy and stiff - I could beat people or animals with it, whereas I would not try this with a trekking pole. In my time outside, I've needed to be mobile and agile (hands/pack free of heavy staff) more frequently than I've needed a weapon. It's definitely legitimate to want a stout weapon though, so suppose you're one of those people. What makes this staff superior to a wooden one or a home-made metal one made for $15 (95% off this staff's MSRP)?
Well, I suppose it's the additional features:
It has a knife. OK, knives are cool and useful, we all like them here. That's why I already carry a belt knife and a multi-tool. I think everyone here carries at least one dedicated blade. So when are you going to unscrew this knife? When you're taking a break and need to slice your lunch? Probably not, you'd probably use one of the purpose-built knives with comfortable handles and that uses steel and grinds built exactly to your liking, because you've spent so much time learning about them and investing in them. OK, so it's a backup blade.
I'm stranded in the woods and lost my primary knife - it could happen. I personally will have a backup (multi-tool blade at the least) that would serve woodcraft tasks better than the Crawford's longer (more awkward without proper profiling) blade and less of a handle than a SAK or LM. It looks like the blade has a very thin, round handle, which I imagine would be a PITA to use in the bush. It would strain the fingers and the small, cold metal would likely suck to have to keep a strong grip on in cold weather (with or without gloves, just imagine using a 5" blade with a metal pencil for a handle). Furthermore, I'd argue that the pliers, can opener, tweezers or whatever your MT has in it would probably be more useful than the rest of the features of the staff. So if I'm not using this backup blade as a backup blade because I have a better one, what do I use it for?
AS A SPEAR!!!! What's cooler than putting a big blade on a stick and stabbing things?! Not much, but then again what are the chances of this being useful to me in a survival situation? Not much. I like spears as much as the next guy and if in a TEOTWAWKI scenario, using my knife to sharpen a stick would probably be one of the first things I'd do after getting settled down a bit and meeting more basic requirements of water and shelter. But really, are you going to hunt with it? Creep up on animals and stab them? It's possible, and maybe Crawford Staff users are more skilled at this sort of thing than I am, but personally, and for most laymen, the time would probably be much better spent with traps, snares, and more conventional hunting methods. I would prefer sticks and stones for hunting small game than spearing them. Large game or medium game? I'm not going to take on a moose with a staff and thin stainless blade even if I'd managed to sneak up on them. For trapped animals, I'd club them with a stick, not try to skewer them.
OK, so for hunting the spear doesn't do much for me, but I can use it to defend myself, can't I? Well, yes, but it is it worth it? I would be more likely to cut myself walking around with the blade on top than I would be to have some wild animals attack me and need to use it to defend myself. Keep the blade stored inside? OK, sure, but is that cougar going to say "hi I'm going to eat you soon" so that you can get it out and ready yourself to kick to some feline ass? Unlikely. Two-legged predators... a spear would definitely add some security if I know that they're about and presenting a significantly larger threat than usual. However, in this case, I'd prefer to be armed with a real gun of some sort. If there were bad guys out to get me or whom I might run into and I knew this (because otherwise the spear is useless because it's being stored inside the tube), I'd probably be investing my time in escape and evasion (light and mobile = sans staff) or in arming myself appropriately. A spear is effective but not as effective as a gun. Furthermore, is it more effective than a staff? Probably in trained hands, but in untrained hands, I wouldn't be surprised if a solid wooden staff is more effective (more instinctive to use, less chance of freezing up and having your opponent close the gap while you try to align the blade) and presents less chance of getting yourself cut. MERCOP would know more about this than me, but I'm certainly skeptical of the utility of a spear being worth the investment.
Perhaps you've disagreed with me already and if so, go for one! If you're still with me, we have to look at the rest of things it offers before making a decision. That is to say, its blowgun.
I think the blowgun is pretty cool. For those of you who have not used one before, they are very easy to learn and could take small game with less skill than is necessary for throwing stones but more than using a gun. I would have to examine this particular one before making a decision about it, but from the site, the blowgun section appears to be 38" long. In the world of blowguns, volume is everything, and three feet is certainly on the short end. A five foot blowgun would give significantly more penetration power and six or seven feet would be ideal. If you look at people who actually USE blowguns to hunt, you find that they tend to be 5 to 8'. I'm not saying 3' is impotent, but that it's not going to be as effective as blowguns you read about. The darts look positively tiny. I've made blowguns and used them. 8" of coat hanger wire with or without a little razor-blade broadhead in a full-size blowgun is POWERFUL. I'm afraid that these tiny darts (3" max looking at the picture) shot out of 3' of tubing would bounce off thick skin at longer ranges or simply stick into the sides of closer game while they run off to live or die somewhere far away from where that's useful to you; time you've spent dying rather than surviving. This is speculation, if anyone has a penetration test for this blowgun, I'm curious to see it. I suspect it uncomfortably straddles the line between being a toy and being a weapon.
Looking at it some more, it appears as though there's a single foam tube cover for the hand. In the summer, this doesn't matter much, but in the winter, it becomes critical. In cold weather, conduction will rob your hands of heat very rapidly. If the handle can be slid to whatever position you need it to be at and stay there, this isn't a problem - you wouldn't lose heat faster than with any other staff. If it isn't programmable or doesn't stay where you put it, however, and you end up frequently holding the metal, that could be a recipe for frostbite. As someone who has been cold, I can tell you it's F'ing Scary. Not being able to fix a lace on your shoe or pack because your fingers aren't working properly is a bad situation getting worse. I don't know whether this is a problem with the staff or not: I'd have to try it out, but if it is, I'd end up wrapping it in spare fabric or else ditching it in some cold-weather survival situations. For $300, I don't think I should have to be making modifications like that.
From what I see on the website, The Crawfords look like decent people making a high-quality product that people are willing to buy. It's novel, it's probably a lot of fun to own and play with, but at the end of the day, I suspect it wouldn't get out of the closet much.
If you're looking at the staff and think it's the coolest thing you've ever seen, you'd probably be happy with your purchase. If you have a budget and plan on actually using it, I'd strongly consider what you're buying and look at alternative options.
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Would not a large metal cane have the potential to act as a lightning conductor during a storm? 
So this has gotten me thinking. Survival staffs are inherently cool and having a powerful blowgun at all times might be a valuable survival asset. So why not get rid of some "modularity" to deliver a more survival-minded instrument at a more affordable price.
Would people want a practical, single-piece aluminum staff 5' to 6' long for under $200? If so, I might be able to enter the market. Here's what I'm thinking:
-Single aluminum tube, 1/2" I.D. with about 1/8" wall thickness. Either anodized or made of a highly corrosion resistant alloy.
-A 1" high threaded cap on top with double o-rings and knurling to get some grip for screwing/unscrewing.
-Half a dozen heavy wire 8" long darts that are a bright flourescent color with mini-broadheads (think exacto blades).
-Paracord handle. KISS. Keep it simple, stupid. 3' of paracord from top to mid-staff would do a few things:
~Secure comfortable grip at all points on uppper section
~Make it possible to put two hands on staff
~Provide insulation
~Store 20 to 40' of paracord for an emergency situation.
-The inside could store some rolled-up heavy plastic bags for water storage, some first aid gear, and a fire-starting kit.
-Bottom end has a tapered, threaded cap with a carbide bit at the base for excellent biting-power and wear-resistance.
Such a staff could be sturdy enough to whack the things you might want to whack, provide a powerful blowgun, and store some survival gear. The tapered bottom cap and carbide tip would be pretty effective for jabbing at someone/something in defense without the danger of walking around with a 5" blade in difficult terrain at neck height.
It's simple and not so tacti-cool, but I'd argue such a design would be more practical for people looking for this kind of thing, and I may even want to carry one myself.
Different markets, to be sure. Not for the type who wants a war hammer in one hand and a dagger in the other, but maybe some people would like them.
If anyone wants to replicate this idea, a poor-man's solution is to go to your local hardware store and pick up 10' of steel 5/8" electrical conduit for $2, cut it to length, give it a wrapping, and put some caps on.
Would people want a practical, single-piece aluminum staff 5' to 6' long for under $200? If so, I might be able to enter the market. Here's what I'm thinking:
-Single aluminum tube, 1/2" I.D. with about 1/8" wall thickness. Either anodized or made of a highly corrosion resistant alloy.
-A 1" high threaded cap on top with double o-rings and knurling to get some grip for screwing/unscrewing.
-Half a dozen heavy wire 8" long darts that are a bright flourescent color with mini-broadheads (think exacto blades).
-Paracord handle. KISS. Keep it simple, stupid. 3' of paracord from top to mid-staff would do a few things:
~Secure comfortable grip at all points on uppper section
~Make it possible to put two hands on staff
~Provide insulation
~Store 20 to 40' of paracord for an emergency situation.
-The inside could store some rolled-up heavy plastic bags for water storage, some first aid gear, and a fire-starting kit.
-Bottom end has a tapered, threaded cap with a carbide bit at the base for excellent biting-power and wear-resistance.
Such a staff could be sturdy enough to whack the things you might want to whack, provide a powerful blowgun, and store some survival gear. The tapered bottom cap and carbide tip would be pretty effective for jabbing at someone/something in defense without the danger of walking around with a 5" blade in difficult terrain at neck height.
It's simple and not so tacti-cool, but I'd argue such a design would be more practical for people looking for this kind of thing, and I may even want to carry one myself.
Different markets, to be sure. Not for the type who wants a war hammer in one hand and a dagger in the other, but maybe some people would like them.
If anyone wants to replicate this idea, a poor-man's solution is to go to your local hardware store and pick up 10' of steel 5/8" electrical conduit for $2, cut it to length, give it a wrapping, and put some caps on.
Would not a large metal cane have the potential to act as a lightning conductor during a storm?
Yes, but I'm not sure how much this would increase your chances of being struck. It certainly wouldn't help your odds, but we're dealing with pretty substantial voltages here. That means that you're probably about as good of a conductor to the lightning as your staff is. I know of someone who was struck while wearing a metal baby carrier, so it definitely makes you think. There might be some good data out there on this.
Keep in mind that during a storm, you should be trying to find shelter, that means you will probably only be holding your staff for a couple minutes until you get to somewhere more safe. That said, it's definitely possible to be trapped on a ridge or something. In that case, it might be wise to ditch the staff or even stand it in the ground as a lightning rod and retreat a distance until the storm passes. Theoretically, if lightning strikes are significantly increased by holding metal objects, they should be significantly decreased by having a lightning rod near by.
I think it's cool and have always wanted to add it to my gear, just never had the chance. A hiking staff takes as much as 30% of the stress off your knees when hiking. Having one that will basically last longer than you will and that you can keep bad things at bay with would be a bonus.
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I guess that it depends on quite how "near by" is sufficient, as I've read of someone being killed by a lightning strike that struck their roll up stove pipe on a folding tent stove whilst they were in their tent!
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The #1 reason for me is that I am a stick guy, as mentioned. I walk with a cane pretty often, I can actually look like I need it. The baton will go with me on walks with the wife for people and dogs. The staff for the woods. And the bottom line is that it is just kewl. I have the baton all set up, the cane all set up, to use them as needed, and buy unscrewing two things, and screwing them together have the staff.
Cando, I am interested to see what you come up with.
BTW, a typical lightweight treking pole would not do much for my 6'2, 300 lb frame.- George
Cando, I am interested to see what you come up with.
BTW, a typical lightweight treking pole would not do much for my 6'2, 300 lb frame.- George
Crawford has been making these for a long time. There are similar designs available to work in conjunction w/the Randall 18. Also, those for use with the Randall can be had in SS as well as Aluminum. Personally, I would not use my knife as a spear. I use, and like spears, using several types of CS.
Esav Benyamin
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Hold one. You will not question its strength.
It is not a knife, it is a triangular cross-section stiletto. Screwed on top of the baton, it makes a light assegai. On the cane or staff, it makes a decent spear, very durable materials and geometry. With the gig attachment, would make a good fish spear.
crossada
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I have heard of people bending aluminum ASP batons so i figured this would have the same problems at the joint area but you're right Esav i have not held one to see.
Esav Benyamin
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crossada, I just picked my lazy butt up and got the staff from its corner by the front door.
The tubing is about 1/8" thick, 3/4" diameter. The sections are held together by a double-headed screw 1.5" long. The back of the blade is 1/4" and the bevels are 5/16".
I got this many years ago from the Edge Co. catalog, about $200. I miss the Edge Company, those catalogs were fun!
The tubing is about 1/8" thick, 3/4" diameter. The sections are held together by a double-headed screw 1.5" long. The back of the blade is 1/4" and the bevels are 5/16".
I got this many years ago from the Edge Co. catalog, about $200. I miss the Edge Company, those catalogs were fun!
The post referred to the Randall 18 set-up, or any spear set-up utilizing a knife as a spear. The only reference to the Crawford was that he has been building them for a long time. The reason I know this is that I have dealt with Pat and his son for many years, and have frequently spoken on the phone. I have used a 6-7 ft long, thick sapling, in conjunction with fulcrum to lift a quarter of a car. Utilizing a knife on a similar length shaft subjects it to the same torsional stress.
crossada
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I remember that catalog too! It had that full size Alien Queen from the movies you could buyI got this many years ago from the Edge Co. catalog, about $200. I miss the Edge Company, those catalogs were fun!
(assuming you had a place to put it
)
Esav Benyamin
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I sure wouldn't put it in my bed !!!
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I bent and ASP on a human leg and the reason was that I was trying to be "nice" by hitting large muscle groups. I became task fixated and hit him in the same spot with no effect. Then I went with what I knew would work, a single shot to the ball of the ankle. he folded like a lawn chair.
Unlike many I like a lighter baton over a heavier one. I want it to be responsive and fast. The baton portion of the staff certainly is.
FYI, I tried to take my sister in law down with the fish spear, oh how she howled. One of the tines broke off in her hide and she ran off into some heavy cover. I lost the blood/nicotine trail about 50 yards in. Must have made it to her hole.- George
Unlike many I like a lighter baton over a heavier one. I want it to be responsive and fast. The baton portion of the staff certainly is.
FYI, I tried to take my sister in law down with the fish spear, oh how she howled. One of the tines broke off in her hide and she ran off into some heavy cover. I lost the blood/nicotine trail about 50 yards in. Must have made it to her hole.- George
