Bad Buying Experience with S & R Knives

[razorburn]

I'm posting this to let fellow Bladeforum members know about my first time buying from S & R Knives(www.srknives.com) of Ontario,Canada,about almost 3 months ago.

I purchased five items:
-A Titanium Boker Subcom
-A Boker Plus Besh Wedge Neck Knife
-A Boker Plus RBB Drop Point Knife
-A Wilson Tactical Monkey Fist Olive with GITD Threads
-A Spyderco Ladybug Salt Hawkbill

After completing my online order,I got an email confirming the order and another,a day later saying everything was shipped but a tracking number was not supplied.So I get back to them asking if I they can supply me with one and to inquire about a few other items not on their website,I don't get a reply and leave it at that.But the package arrives a week later on the west coast.So I go and pick it up, open the package up to confirm the contents.Then find the following problems and get back to them by email immediately to inform them of a problem with the order but don't get a repsponse.So I wait a few more days before sending another and this time get a response.


Below is a copy of the email sent.The underlined is their respose.

Hi Sean

I got my order the other day and have a few problems with the order, that I would like to bring to your attention.


1) BOKER 01BO048 BOKER PLUS RBB DROP FOLDING KNIFE - The knife that I got is basically broken This button works when the knife is in close position. Will not lock the blade in the open position.

First thing:I noticed was the blade had a clip in the edge,second, the safety does not lock the blade open and does not make a clicking sound when the switch is moved forward and backwards and third, the button lock is faulty and doesn't keep the blade open. (I have a another one of these knives and the one I got from you guys does not work properly)

This button works when the knife is in close position. Will not lock the blade in the open position.


2) BOKER BO582 CLB SUBCOM TITAN KNIFE .CHAD LOS BANOS - Arrived with an extremely uncentered blade which is about to touch the non frame locking side of the titanium scales.They are all the same, pretty hard to find a exact centered blade. Try loosening the pivot screw as this might help a bit.

They are all the same, pretty hard to find a exact centered blade. Try loosening the pivot screw as this might help a bit.



3) WILSON TACTICAL MONKEY FIST OLIVE/GLOW - I ordered an olive paracord monkey fist with glow in the dark threading but was instead sent a solid black one. Other one was not available.

Other one was not available.


Hope to hear from you soon.


If you are still not satisfied with the knives and the rest of the order, you could always send it back for refund.

Thanks

In response,I send the following email.Again the underlined is their response

Please return all with an accompanying letter with reference to the original order number for full credit.

Hi Guys

I wanted to explain my situation so far and how, being a first timer customer of your business that it feels like I'm the one left holding the bag.Because of the lack of communication:1)an email was sent to you after I got a message my order was shipped as to whether I could get a tracking number and to inquire about additional items for a future order 2)I sent an email detailing my concerns a day after receiving the items and again no response.Until my third attempt,after that, if I didn't get a response I was going to phone your store. To top that off you're website states that you don't take any returns period and that any issues be brought up with the manufacture.

To be clear, I do not wish to return the items but to have the items instead exchanged.

My present concerns

The Boker Plus RBB Knife with a Drop Point Blade is clearly broken - as I said before I am an owner of the same knife but with a recurve blade and am positively sure that the safety is broken;the blade was received with a chip in the blade and there is a wear mark on the lock cutout in the blade for the button lock. The safety does not lock the blade open or closed.
I'm not sure if this was a store demo or a previously returned item or what but I was hoping to get an exchange.

The Boker Plus Titanium Subcom - I am surprised that all the knives in stock have uncentered blades and I did try your suggestion of loosening the pivot screw but that just brings it closer to the non frame locking side. I was hoping to exchange this but I wish to return it instead.

Wilson Tactical Monkey Fist Olive with GITD Thread - When the order arrived ,I was really surprised a black was sent instead and to be honest,I have not ever experienced this was any other online retailer in Canada or the US without them first checking with the customer as to whether it's OK. I 'm going to keep it ,don't mind the black but I'm a little disappointed.

Let me know if this is possible

So I promptly sent everything back, including a copy of the email and online receipt for a refund with tracking #. Later confirming that it got there.But here where it get bad again,I don't check as to whether they have given me a refund and let it side for a few weeks.Happens,this is when I discover that they not only have the items but have not given me a refund yet, after 3 weeks.Talk about treating the customer right and also having an absolute lack of customer service.So I again send them another email stating this,again no response,the next day another,still no response.So I do what fellow members say is most effect in situations like this,I go ahead a contact them by phone.I explain my situation being as kindly as possible,leaving my name and order number, and their response was, "I'll get to it went I have some time...OK". After being spoken to like this I was seriously considering filing a complaint with my Credit Card Company for a charge back being I still haven't paid my bill.

The next morning,I send them a follow up email

Going to put it through today as soon as we have a minute.

Hi, I was wondering what's going on with the items that I returned weeks ago.I have yet to get a refund.

The items returned:

1 BOKER 01BO048 BOKER PLUS RBB DROP FOLDING KNIFE @$56.00
1 BOKER BO582 CLB SUBCOM TITAN KNIFE .CHAD LOS BANOS @$35.72

The next day,I finally get a response that my refund has been processed so I immediately check to see whether it really went through,not yet.Thinking it will probably take a day or two for it to process.I give it a couple more days and another before checking, still no refund.Then proceeding everyday checking on it, until a week passed and it finally showed a credit on my CC.The amount is correct.Talk about slow but it still get more interesting,When I get my statement and confirm the amount charged I found it weird that I was charged $0.30 more than what their online store receipt.

For the record
I've know of them for some time now but didn't feel like doing business with them and have browsed their site numerous times over the years. I finally thought I'd throw them some of my business because their prices are comparable to buying from the US without border hassles. What a mistake it was dealing with these guys.An order totaling to around just under $200 including shipping and tax means nothing at all.

 

[razorburn]

Updated with some pics.

Boker Plus RBB Drop Point


Sent with a Chipped Blade

Sent with a wear marks on blade tang

Boker Titanium Subcom - Uncentered Blade

 

[gregery s]

Hi Razorburn,
For what it's worth, most of the 40+ knives in my collection were purchased from S & R Knives.
In my experience, they have been fair and honest and have provided exchanges without hesitation in the few
instances when I requested it. (Note: All of my purchases were concluded at their store, so I was able to inspect the merchandise prior to purchase).

Like most collectors, I have also ordered knives and other products on-line, and I can well imagine your disappointment when you open the package and discover defective merchandise.

Regards,
Greg

 

[HayabusaP226]

I don't have experience with this specific retailer , who indeed sounds like a real POS from your description , but I can still give you 2 excellent tips for the future -

1) Stop giving your business to Canadian knife\gear dealers , period .
Not only they are pulling some serious price gouging (especially with the strong CAD$) , they got crap attitude and much inferior service comparing the US dealers .
Customs hassles are minimal , provided you are dealing with good reputable dealer who know how to ship and handle the custom form properly to avoid any BS delays .
There are US retailers out there , such as New Graham , who treat international customers with respect and provide top notch service .
This is the kind of people you should give your business to .

2) Next time you send goods back for a refund , wait 3 weeks and the retailer reply with disrespectful , ridicules answer such as "I'll get to it went I have some time...OK" like you claimed you received , just stop wasting your time , call your credit card issuer and nail him with nice chargeback .
He WILL learn a good lesson for sure .

 

[razorburn]

Hi Razorburn,
For what it's worth, most of the 40+ knives in my collection were purchased from S & R Knives.
In my experience, they have been fair and honest and have provided exchanges without hesitation in the few
instances when I requested it. (Note: All of my purchases were concluded at their store, so I was able to inspect the merchandise prior to purchase).

Like most collectors, I have also ordered knives and other products on-line, and I can well imagine your disappointment when you open the package and discover defective merchandise.

Regards,
Greg

It wasn't just defective mechandise but also broken and substituted.

 

[HJK]

I am one of the few that doesn't deal with S & R, online or otherwise, because of some less than satisfactory experiences years ago. I had heard that they had improved and some people are quite happy with them but the experience described here is completely unacceptable. Defective and substandard merchandise should never be sent out and corrections should be processed much more quickly and transparently obviously.

However, i take exception to the suggestion that you shouldn't deal with Canadian retailers or makers. That's unfair and, with respect, ignorant.
Canada has some wonderful sellers whose prices are very good, whose selection and products are excellent and whose honesty is above reproach. True North Knives, for example, comes to mind immediately.
More than that, there are many superb Canadian knifemakers whose work is first rate and who are completely first rate as people and business people. Brian Tighe, Greg Lightfoot, Wally Hayes, Brian Lyttle, Kirby lambert, Steve Vanderkoff, Thomas Haslinger, and many many more are fabulous knifemakers and great people and you are highly unlikely to have such problems with any of them.
As far as price is concerned, their prices are generally competitive and the high Canuckian dollar is dropping for the moment: but for years our dollar was artificially low. If you want to blame someone, blame Obama and your dysfunctional Congress for the low US dollar, not Canadian knifemakers and dealers

Nobody should have to put up with bad service and slow credits from anybody, Canadian or American. Thanks for letting us know. Maybe S & R will heed your complaints and improve their service. All good companies have some bad days. It's how they respond and improve that counts.

 

[tendy]

I don't have experience with this specific retailer , who indeed sounds like a real POS from your description , but I can still give you 2 excellent tips for the future -

1) Stop giving your business to Canadian knife\gear dealers , period .
Not only they are pulling some serious price gouging (especially with the strong CAD$) , they got crap attitude and much inferior service comparing the US dealers .
Customs hassles are minimal , provided you are dealing with good reputable dealer who know how to ship and handle the custom form properly to avoid any BS delays .
There are US retailers out there , such as New Graham , who treat international customers with respect and provide top notch service .
This is the kind of people you should give your business to .

2) Next time you send goods back for a refund , wait 3 weeks and the retailer reply with disrespectful , ridicules answer such as "I'll get to it went I have some time...OK" like you claimed you received , just stop wasting your time , call your credit card issuer and nail him with nice chargeback .
He WILL learn a good lesson for sure .

What is that?? As a proud Canadian I take your remarks seriously and almost bordering as trolling, trying to instigate a them vs. us attitude. I can hardly put into words especially civil words, a response to your over the top isolationist remarks. How many years have Canadians lived with the strong US dollar???? Man you steam me on so many levels. I have dealt with S&R and their Ebay name "Wholesale Knives" with total satisfaction. I will not speak for all, and I truly hope all works out for the OP, S&R needs to make it right, which I think they will. As for HayabusaP226 and his/her ignorant remarks get some help, inform yourself, and maybe think before you write inflamatory garbage in this thread.

 

[HayabusaP226]

What is that?? As a proud Canadian I take your remarks seriously and almost bordering as trolling, trying to instigate a them vs. us attitude. I can hardly put into words especially civil words, a response to your over the top isolationist remarks. How many years have Canadians lived with the strong US dollar???? Man you steam me on so many levels. I have dealt with S&R and their Ebay name "Wholesale Knives" with total satisfaction. I will not speak for all, and I truly hope all works out for the OP, S&R needs to make it right, which I think they will. As for HayabusaP226 and his/her ignorant remarks get some help, inform yourself, and maybe think before you write inflamatory garbage in this thread.

Damn , I don't even need to add the U MAD crap , because you are obviously mad

This ain't trolling or garbage (which is exactly what you are doing) , it's just calling it like it is
The US dealers blow the Canadian ones out of the water , regardless if the CAD is at 70c or 106c .
This is a fact , whether you like it or not .

 

[frontline29]

I don't have experience with this specific retailer , who indeed sounds like a real POS from your description , but I can still give you 2 excellent tips for the future -

1) Stop giving your business to Canadian knife\gear dealers , period .
Not only they are pulling some serious price gouging (especially with the strong CAD$) , they got crap attitude and much inferior service comparing the US dealers .
Customs hassles are minimal , provided you are dealing with good reputable dealer who know how to ship and handle the custom form properly to avoid any BS delays .
There are US retailers out there , such as New Graham , who treat international customers with respect and provide top notch service .
This is the kind of people you should give your business to .

LOL



I have never had a problem with S&R knives. The few times I've ordered from their Ebay store Shawn and Rodney have always treated me with 100% first class service. Now I just go to their store in person to hand pick my knives. Plus they always hook me up with a freebee so it's worth the drive. :thumbup:

Sounds like better quality control from the manufacture, and S&R properly inspecting the knives before they leave the store would have prevented this.

Anyways, Sorry to hear about your situation, I hope you get this sorted out.

 

[HJK]

Damn , I don't even need to add the U MAD crap , because you are obviously mad

This ain't trolling or garbage (which is exactly what you are doing) , it's just calling it like it is
The US dealers blow the Canadian ones out of the water , regardless if the CAD is at 70c or 106c .
This is a fact , whether you like it or not .

There's nothing wrong with calling a spade a spade or comparison shopping. An overly broad statement about an entire country is slightly different.
Anyway, let's not get upset; no harm intended on either side I'm sure.
I guess Hayabusa isn't getting the friends of Canada discount
More for the rest of us, I guess

 

[JW Knives]

being only and hour from my home, S+R is my go to knife shop. I have bought all of my blades there (in person). Sean and Rodney have always been great, usually giving me a great deal that is less than the website price, no tax, etc. I always look at the blade in the store and have even had them go in the back and get another blade because the centering is off or whatever.

It sucks to hear that you had a bad experience with them.

 

[Esav Benyamin]

Can I get a friends of Canada discount?
I've even shipped to Canada on a sale and on a trade and on a giveaway!

 

[HayabusaP226]

I am one of the few that doesn't deal with S & R, online or otherwise, because of some less than satisfactory experiences years ago. I had heard that they had improved and some people are quite happy with them but the experience described here is completely unacceptable. Defective and substandard merchandise should never be sent out and corrections should be processed much more quickly and transparently obviously.

However, i take exception to the suggestion that you shouldn't deal with Canadian retailers or makers. That's unfair and, with respect, ignorant.
Canada has some wonderful sellers whose prices are very good, whose selection and products are excellent and whose honesty is above reproach. True North Knives, for example, comes to mind immediately.
More than that, there are many superb Canadian knifemakers whose work is first rate and who are completely first rate as people and business people. Brian Tighe, Greg Lightfoot, Wally Hayes, Brian Lyttle, Kirby lambert, Steve Vanderkoff, Thomas Haslinger, and many many more are fabulous knifemakers and great people and you are highly unlikely to have such problems with any of them.
As far as price is concerned, their prices are generally competitive and the high Canuckian dollar is dropping for the moment: but for years our dollar was artificially low. If you want to blame someone, blame Obama and your dysfunctional Congress for the low US dollar, not Canadian knifemakers and dealers

Nobody should have to put up with bad service and slow credits from anybody, Canadian or American. Thanks for letting us know. Maybe S & R will heed your complaints and improve their service. All good companies have some bad days. It's how they respond and improve that counts.

Sorry , with all due respect , but you may want to improve your reading comprehension
I talked about retailers , only retailers , not makers
Second , I'm not an American
I'm from this extremely rare breed of Canadians who actually know and give a shit about being a smart , educated consumer
Enjoy "supporting" the Canadian economy while getting raped on literally every thing you purchase
The Canadians retailers are sure laughing at you with the Apple-like profit margin they are doing

And finally , the CAD (same as the AUD and other major currencies which were dropped momentarily against the USD last week) , will be up to (a new) record high against US , very soon
The strong CAD ain't going no where

 

[HJK]

Sorry , with all due respect , but you may want to improve your reading comprehension
I talked about retailers , only retailers , not makers
Second , I'm not an American
I'm from this extremely rare breed of Canadians who actually know and give a shit about being a smart , educated consumer
Enjoy "supporting" the Canadian economy while getting raped on literally every thing you purchase
The Canadians retailers are sure laughing at you with the Apple-like profit margin they are doing

And finally , the CAD (same as the AUD and other major currencies which were dropped momentarily against the USD last week) , will be up to (a new) record high against US , very soon
The strong CAD ain't going no where

There's nothing wrong with my reading comprehension. And don't mistake my politeness to you as agreement with your rude, overly broad and rather ignorant statements.

Many custom knifemakers sell directly. That makes them retailers. QED
And there are Canadian retailers . like True North, and like S & R when they are on their game, who do beat the price and sometimes the quality of American retailers. I buy from both America and Canada, and elsewhere.. Once you establish a relationship with a maker, or a dealer, or other collectors, in Canada too, you will be able to buy better knives and better prices. It's dealer by dealer and person by person, in my experience. But people's experiences can differ, no doubt.
Nonetheless, a fair person shouldn't over-generalize, and when advised that an overgeneralization is offensive to someone, this being a public forum, a polite person tries not offend, unless there is no other reasonable way to make the point. I don't think that standard has been met here, so let's try a little harder.

May I suggest this. Pick some knives that interest you and check what is available online and give an honest assessment of whether things really are more expensive or of lower quality or give worse service, whatever criteria you wish, in Canada vs the States. But if you want to continue along that line, please start another thread. And I think it's a great topic, eh? But this thread really was about something else.

 

[HayabusaP226]

There's nothing wrong with my reading comprehension. And don't mistake my politeness to you as agreement with your rude, overly broad and rather ignorant statements.

Many custom knifemakers sell directly. That makes them retailers. QED
And there are Canadian retailers . like True North, and like S & R when they are on their game, who do beat the price and sometimes the quality of American retailers. I buy from both America and Canada, and elsewhere.. Once you establish a relationship with a maker, or a dealer, or other collectors, in Canada too, you will be able to buy better knives and better prices. It's dealer by dealer and person by person, in my experience. But people's experiences can differ, no doubt.
Nonetheless, a fair person shouldn't over-generalize, and when advised that an overgeneralization is offensive to someone, this being a public forum, a polite person tries not offend, unless there is no other reasonable way to make the point. I don't think that standard has been met here, so let's try a little harder.

May I suggest this. Pick some knives that interest you and check what is available online and give an honest assessment of whether things really are more expensive or of lower quality or give worse service, whatever criteria you wish, in Canada vs the States. But if you want to continue along that line, please start another thread. And I think it's a great topic, eh? But this thread really was about something else.

Sorry , but I wasn't rude at all , and I didn't make any ignorant statement , only solid ones

In my opinion , being rude is what you did by putting words in my mouth , make it seems like I bashed the entire Canadian knife making community , which is a complete BS , as I only talked about the retailers\dealers

And no , a knifemaker who sells directly definitely doesn't make him a retailer at all
Just like companies like Benchmade , Spyderco , Kershaw who are also selling directly to the public (for anyone who doesn't care to pay full MSRP) aren't 'retailers' either

 

[HJK]

Sorry , but I wasn't rude at all , and I didn't make any ignorant statement , only solid ones

In my opinion , being rude is what you did by putting words in my mouth , make it seems like I bashed the entire Canadian knife making community , which is a complete BS , as I only talked about the retailers\dealers

And no , a knifemaker who sells directly definitely doesn't make him a retailer at all
Just like companies like Benchmade , Spyderco , Kershaw who are also selling directly to the public (for anyone who doesn't care to pay full MSRP) aren't 'retailers' either

Now you’re making a fool of yourself.
1. The Oxford English Dictionary defines a retailer as someone who sells goods “to the public in relatively small quantities for consumption rather than for resale. “Therefore, a custom knifemaker, or a manufacturer, who sells directly to the public is retailing, as well as building or manufacturing knives.
2. I have not "put words in your mouth" and frankly I don’t credit your views enough to be insulted by them. My intervention stems only from the fact that another forumite was offended by your words. The offence and the interpretation were his. He was, understandably, offended by your comments, which means in his view you were rude; and in my view you should be more sensitive and circumspect about offending other forumites.
3. One doesn’t need the Oxford to know that someone who 1. Refuses to admit when he is wrong and 2. doubles down on an insult, is being both ignorant and rude.
Try a little harder to get along.

 

[tendy]

Damn , I don't even need to add the U MAD crap , because you are obviously mad

This ain't trolling or garbage (which is exactly what you are doing) , it's just calling it like it is
The US dealers blow the Canadian ones out of the water , regardless if the CAD is at 70c or 106c .
This is a fact , whether you like it or not .

I wont post again as I feel it takes away from the original Ops concerns. But you sir, are just plain wrong. When you are spewing out "facts" maybe some proof woud be nice!! The ony trolling I ever do is on a boat, while I am fishing, and the only garbage I put out is at the end of my driveway on Garbage day. Seems though you are a bit bitter about something. Too bad, life is too short to spend whining on a soapbox

 

[frontline29]

I wont post again as I feel it takes away from the original Ops concerns. But you sir, are just plain wrong. When you are spewing out "facts" maybe some proof woud be nice!! The ony trolling I ever do is on a boat, while I am fishing, and the only garbage I put out is at the end of my driveway on Garbage day. Seems though you are a bit bitter about something. Too bad, life is too short to spend whining on a soapbox

:thumbup:

 

[jbmonkey]

to the op, did s&r finally make right? the 0.30 cent difference and anything else i missed?

to all the Canadians, whoa...i learned a valuable lesson here. never fight with a determined to win Canadian. actually joking aside...thanks for the insight into how canadian knife retailing works compared to south of the border. good info for the future.

 

[razorburn]

to the op, did s&r finally make right? the 0.30 cent difference and anything else i missed?

I actually didn't discovery the $0.30 difference until after I'd already received the refund,gotten my statement in the mail,and until I checked my emails with them and my S & R Knives online receipt to prepare this review.I really don't know the reason for this but their online store does convert prices to several difference currencies.I was sure that it was the canadian price before I checked out.

Since getting my refund,I have not contacted them about this or any other matter through email or phone.Or at anytime mention that I was a member of BF and that I was going to do a review.For I ,do not want anything to do with them.

Talk about being rubbed the wrong way.