Baltimore Knife and Sword Tactical Gladius arrived! Pics and first impressions

[crimsonfalcon07]

Well, I finally got in my Baltimore Knife and Sword Tactical Gladius. Matt had contacted me nearly a year ago when I mentioned I wished I could have something like the Gage, but at a less expensive price point. I ended up paying 420 USD shipped for this, which is much less expensive than the Gage, for sure. They could have made up a leather sheath, but I'd prefer kydex for this, and I can make my own leather sheath if I want. I really like this sword, and will certainly bring it by the BKS booth at the Colorado Renaissance Festival, just in case I get to meet the master behind it. Here's some of the base stats:

Overall Length = 29"
Blade Length = 22"
Point of balance = 3.25" from the cross guard
Fuller Length 17.5"

I took a length comparison with the 18" short gladius I made myself a while back too:

Amusingly enough, they weigh almost the same amount, since the stock appears to be between 1/8" and 3/16". It's certainly not as beefy as the Gage, with the 1/4" stock on that sword. But, it's light and fast, which is all to the good for a short sword like this.

BKS goodness:

Overall, I definitely like this sword, and it's well done. There's a few flaws here and there that indicate that this is a handmade piece, not just something ground out on the machine. For instance, the grinds on the tip aren't perfectly even:

Overall, the finish on this is really nice. What scratch pattern there is, is vertical, which really looks nice. The plunge lines aren't perfectly even, but have a pretty nice swept appearance. Really, the only flaws I could find in the finish are around the guard, where there are a few grind marks and what appears to be epoxy. If you can see it, good for you. They're very minor flaws.

On a piece this big, that's good work. Maybe not $1000 custom good, but it's those little things that tell you this is a hand-made creation. It has that smell I associate with an oiled sword also, which is nice. I'm pretty sure this is the first piece of this type that Matt's made, and I sure hope that more people go for one like this, because it's a really cool sword.

On first handling, there's really only 1 thing that I don't like about this sword, and that's the handle. Three issues here. First, while the pommel is somewhat flared, it's largely just straight. Adding in a more significant pommel would have lowered the point of balance, which would probably be good, although it's pretty darn close to perfect, and also helps the wielder keep a grip on the sword. Handle shape is pretty much the most important thing with regards to retaining the blade, and this is just a little too basic to get the job done ideally. Matt was originally planning on doing a drawing for me to approve, but somehow that didn't really happen, and he had the whole sword made up. That's really one of the few things I'd change about this blade though, because it just feels so NICE. Sharpening job was good; not shaving sharp or anything, but about what I'd call battle sharp. You don't really want a combat or heavy use blade to be much sharper than this one.

There are a couple other things that bother me about the handle. First, it's a 2 pin design, which isn't the most durable. But the pins are nicely finished, and it's certainly quite secure. I may end up rehandling it anyways, so I'm not exactly worried here. The other thing, and this is my least favorite part about this sword, is that the handle is very blocky, and the scales aren't rounded at all by the guard. It's quite uncomfortable, in fact.

I'm a stickler for comfortable handles, but there's a lot out there that just aren't. I got a carved HI katana, which had probably the most uncomfortable handle I've ever felt:

Also, I got a Badger Blades waki last year, and the guard on it was too small for the sharp edges it had on it, and that cut into my knuckles. Fortunately, all of those were easy fixes, and I'm pretty okay at fixing issues like that. Here's the HI katana now:

I'm going to round out the scales on this and see what I can do to make them a bit more comfortable. Failing that, I'll just boil them off and rehandle it, probably in G10 or micarta.

Now, I don't want to give the impression that I don't like this sword, or that I think Matt did a bad job, especially given how little communication we had. I definitely love this sword. It's very fine work, and I'm proud to own it. I did want to present a balanced perspective, so I spent a bit of time on the really minor negative things. So let's talk about what I love about this sword.

For starters, it's just so light and whippy that I can barely believe it. It's a pretty wide blade, being a gladius-type weapon, after all. And it's a 22" blade. But with the perfectly done fuller on each side, it's nice and light and fast, which is really important to the way I fight. Now, this one's a sharp. It's battle-ready. So I'm not gonna be sparring with it, like I could with most of Matt's blades, which are designed for stage combat. But by the same token, I know that this one should be a nice durable blade.

There's a few little details I haven't gotten from Matt yet. I don't know what kind of steel it is, although I suspect it's 5160, since it's pretty springy. Maybe he'll answer that one for me. I also don't know what kind of wood got used on the slabs. It's got a lot of character to it, and has nice grain. I'm looking forward to working with it a bit when I refine the handle shape.

I also like the tip profile. It's a bit thinner and pointier than the Gage, but not by a whole lot, and looks like it will have good penetration (important for a gladius), but still looks to have enough behind the tip that I'm not too worried about it breaking. And, after experimenting with finishes myself, I'm very impressed with how clean this one looks. I'm very excited to see what it can do. Thanks very much for a fine sword from Baltimore Knife and Sword!

 

[crimsonfalcon07]

Okay, spent a little time reworking the handle. I'm pretty fond of scalloped handles, especially if I have concerns about losing the blade, because those do a good job of maintaining grip retention. I've tried swinging a scalloped handle covered in olive oil around without slipping at all. So that's probably a good sign.

This sword is pretty much the perfect length. I also smacked it into a piece of plywood, and it cuts very well. Does well on stabs too. Didn't lose any of it's edge. If it had a bit more of a flared pommel, I think it would be pretty much the perfect sword. Finished the wood to 800 grit, then hand sanded to 2000 grit. Will be doing several coats of tung oil as well.

Still, it fits nicely into my hand, and just feels oh so good.

I think it's pretty comparably priced to the work on their site also. It's not quite as thick as the Maintz gladius, but is fullered (my request), and sharp also, which often costs extra. It's a fine blade, especially for the comparatively dirt cheap price I paid for a lovely custom like this, and now that I've got the handle pretty much to my liking, I'm having a very tough time putting it down.

 

[FortyTwoBlades]

I'll be honest--the futziness of the guard/ricasso bothers me a lot. A fair price for what you get but the first thing I would have slathered with elbo grease would have been that.

 

[crimsonfalcon07]

Certainly not perfect. By futziness, are you referring to the finish flaws?

 

[FortyTwoBlades]

I mean the misshapen guard and ricasso-to-blade transition. Notch in the underside of the left quillion, "shelf" in the left side of the ricasso, and drooping right quillion. You can clean that up real quick with a dremel, but it would bug the crap out of me until it was fixed.

 

[OrdnanceBubbaUSMC]

It looks like they did a poor job in general but if it performs very well and you love it that is all that matters.

 

[leebrewer]

Good job on the handle. I know you were concerned with using it before cosmetics. Oh, and you left the milk out.

 

[horseclover]

At the same price point, there are alternatives. Matt usually does a great job grinding, so I would leave that to his explanation. I know I have seen some pretty comples kris blades that require a good amount of attention while grinding. What seems true of a lot of the BKS blades is that there is often little or no distal taper and the way others also deal with weight issues is going with lighter/thinner stock.

An example of alternative at that price point is the Angus Trim tacticals. Here is a review of the Brutus
http://forum.sword-buyers-guide.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=4226&start=0

I know Gus roughs his blades out on a cnc vs BKS (as I recall) is cutting out blanks and basically grinding bevels for crossection. Gus puts a good amount of distal taper on all of his work and starts at .250 or thicker. There had also been a lot of concerns not just with how slab handles felt but the extra work needed in finishing. No doubt that is some of the BKS cost for such a sword with wood. They come up with some interesting supplies for wood which can add character. Anyway, the ATrim tacticals are reduced to simple paracord as stock and are drilled for slabs if someone wants to go further.

It would have been nice to see all the bare steel edges dressed down a bit (except the cutting edge, of course). Again though the time factor or rushed work or even a trainer/trainee example.

Cheers

GC

 

[crimsonfalcon07]

I have to admit, the level of craftsmanship was definitely lower than what I'd expected having seen some of their production blades. Uneven plunges and the mistakes in the guard being the worst culprits, since I already know I can do as well or better in that kind of detail, and I'm a distinct amateur, and hadn't even started making blades when I was first communicating with Matt about this project. I'm also not particularly happy with the level of communication I got, since it often took weeks to get a response, and as I mentioned, I never did get a sketch, and I still don't know what kind of steel it is, or other basic specs.

But the stuff that was done well was definitely solid. I love the fullers, the heat treat is excellent, and the finish on the blade is way better than I have been able to do. To be honest, I don't think I'll commission another custom blade from them, although that has a lot to do with the fact that I enjoy making them myself.

I do appreciate the link to the Angus Trim, and from the pics, aside from the superior plunges, it doesn't look like it's significantly better than this one, and the areas where it excelled, I think this one does too.

I'd definitely like to find out from Matt why there are mistakes like the nick on the guard, grind marks, and uneven plunges in the ricasso. It's not quite the quality I'd expected from a BKS custom, although it's still an excellent blade, and I'm happy to have it in my collection. I'd be happier still if it had been perfect, but it does feel alive in my hands, and it's the perfect length and weight for my tastes, and performance is excellent. That speaks very highly to me.

 

[FortyTwoBlades]

Like you said, their work is usually pretty crisp, so that surprises me as well. The fuller and bevels look nice and the hilt looks solid at least, if a bit ganked up. I don't mean this as a self-aggrandizement, but while it doesn't have fullers or a primary bevel (but designed to function/balance properly without), my Oberst prototypes have micarta scales and more handle fasteners with a flared pommel. And they're only $120. Just figured I'd throw that out there in terms of a value comparison. The scales on mine aren't fully contoured either, but that's mostly so you can shape it to your own hand and preferred grip with a round file.

 

[Matthew Stagmer]

Here is how it looked when it went out from here.

Seeing close ups of this sword I realize I should have taken a little more time in truing the shoulders and the finish. I decided to spend most of my time on the performance of the blade and at the cost I didn't want to spend too much time on it.

The wood is leopardwood. First time I have used that wood and believe it or not this is the first slab handle I have done on something sword sized. I and Kerry agree that the next one should be 3 pins not 2.

This was also the prototype of this piece. Which means it should be picked apart as it is being and improved apon. I am super happy with the distal taper and the performance of the edge.

I look forward to making more of these and I only see them getting better.

 

[FortyTwoBlades]

Here is how it looked when it went out from here.

Seeing close ups of this sword I realize I should have taken a little more time in truing the shoulders and the finish. I decided to spend most of my time on the performance of the blade and at the cost I didn't want to spend too much time on it.

This was also the prototype of this piece. Which means it should be picked apart as it is being and improved apon. I am super happy with the distal taper and the performance of the edge.

I look forward to making more of these and I only see them getting better.

As a prototype that totally makes sense! The other aspects of the piece look very nice, so I hope my criticism isn't taken as too harsh. Just pointing out things I think could be improved on, since they wouldn't take too long to clean up. It's clearly a performance-driven piece, and I expect you'll iron out all the wrinkles as you grow adjusted to the stages of making the particular model. :thumbup:

 

[Matthew Stagmer]

I will be honest. Most of the time a critique like that bothers me but not at all on this piece. I understand. A few minutes with a file could have solved most of the issues. I dont like to make excuses, but I am so super buisy right now that I just missed it. My fault. The next one will better. I am actually thankfull for the honest review and I am glad that overall, he likes it!

 

[crimsonfalcon07]

Thanks for chiming in. If you don't mind, I'd love to know what kind of steel and wood it is. I think those are pretty much the last questions I had. I'm not too bothered by most of the little things, since most of them I can and will fix. Although the comment about how it was when it was shipped seems a bit odd to me. The mistakes most people are pointing out aren't things that just appear in transit.

I decided to spend most of my time on the performance of the blade and at the cost I didn't want to spend too much time on it.

What bothers me here is this sentence. Most of my blade purchases tend to be at a lower price point than this, and I was expecting something on par with your Maintz or other productions. I wasn't expecting what was presented as a custom blade to be lower quality in fit, finish, and general time spent, than your production blades. I could have gotten a LOT of my own steel, wood, and such for this price. And while you may call this a prototype, I do believe it came from the particular request I made to get something like the Gage Gladius, fullered, at a lower price point. I was led to believe this would be a custom blade, and I expect to be impressed by a custom blade. I had requested that in another thread and you got in touch with me, not the other way around.

If you had told me up front that you weren't planning on spending sufficient time on this to have it come out perfect at the cost, I would have understood, but I also wouldn't have done business with you at all. It also would have been nice if the price you quoted had included the full charge including shipping, and you hadn't tacked on an additional 10% on my first payment without even asking me, and to have gotten the sketch so I could have requested more of a pommel. It doesn't really make me happy to find out that really, you weren't planning on doing your best work at the price point. If that's the case, perhaps you should have quoted a higher price in the first place.

For what it's worth, this is mostly just feedback so perhaps the next person who works with you will get better service and a more reliable quote. I'm still impressed with how good the blade is, and I was honestly hoping this would provide better advertisement for you. I try to be an easy-going customer. But bear in mind, no customer likes to feel like a second class citizen, and that's what you're leaving me with. I don't want the sword I commissioned to be a "prototype, oops, sorry about all the mistakes, it will improve for future customers, but you basically got a sword that's not as good as it should have been, and that's all, folks." I like the sword, but most of the way this transaction has gone has left a sour taste in my mouth.

 

[FortyTwoBlades]

I will be honest. Most of the time a critique like that bothers me but not at all on this piece. I understand. A few minutes with a file could have solved most of the issues. I dont like to make excuses, but I am so super buisy right now that I just missed it. My fault. The next one will better. I am actually thankfull for the honest review and I am glad that overall, he likes it!

It's good to have critiques bother you. That's what inspires change and improvement. :thumbup:

 

[horseclover]

I do appreciate the link to the Angus Trim, and from the pics, aside from the superior plunges, it doesn't look like it's significantly better than this one, and the areas where it excelled, I think this one does too.

The big differences are the profile and cross section of the ATrim being done on a computer controlled milling machine, so the "plunges" are actually machined. There is minimal more grinding aside from breaking the blank out of the web before heat treating. Finish grinding and sharpening after the heat treat. The stock thickness as well takes it more out of the realm of the thinner stock which then basically act like a glorified machete or bolo.

Marquenced 5160 can make for a real difference as well. Gus farms out his heat treat to an aerospace contractor. Gus also has and continues to do precision machining on contract. He has been doing swords on a fairly large scale since 1999.

I don't know how much in house heat treating BKS does either but I'm sure Matt could speak to the steel being used, distal taper numbers (doesn't look like there is much-if at all), weight and the type of steel used. I believe he mentioned Leopard wood for the grip. I do know BKS caters to the eye appeal and popular theme while still being capable (at a price) to do some really spectacular work (that continues to evolve).

Kerry Stagmer and BKS go way back as well and I remember them listed on Albion's way old page before they moved from the east coast to Wisconsin.

In general though, I would think buying from ready stock is the way to go with BKS unless there is no time table for completion and some micro managing may be required before accepting not just the original commission but approval before receipt of the product. This is true of not just BKS though, so anyone working with makers "to order" need to make their own check list apparent before proceeding and before sending dollar one, let alone accepting the piece before it is sent. Some photos should have easily shown some of the "character" one would expect once in hand. If Matt is doing commission work more or less independently within BKS, that may be a whole different ball of wax.

Cheers

GC

 

[FortyTwoBlades]

I agree entirely with the above. Different makers have different focuses and strengths, and having a personal checklist up front is a good way to go.

With regard to the glorified machete/bolo comment I'll put my hand up and state that the Oberst I posted above is intended to be just that--a sword/machete hybrid rather than a full-blown dedicated weapon like the BKS piece. I posted it mostly for being in a similar style or theme.

 

[Matthew Stagmer]

Wow...I am sorry that I offended you. Me saying that this is how it was when it was shipped was just to show how the handle was. I felt it should be shown. I also thought my pics showed the color and pattern of the wood a bit better. That's all I meant.

I also stated that I should have fixed those minor details and that is on me, but stating that my focus was on performance is a simple matter. That is why it is called a tactical weapon. No frills all performance. That's all I meant by that.

This was always in my mind #1 of a production run of these. I should have done some better finishing. I didnt mean to say that it wasnt my best work or that you got a 2nd rate job from me. I spent a ton more time on this then I should have on a $400 sword. That is on me on quoting to low but I had wanted a good reason to do this project because I had this sword planned in my head for years now.

 

[Matthew Stagmer]

Glen AKA Horseclover,

I cant help but feel like every post you make about me or my work is sublty crappy. I feel you post and take shots at me and my product all the time and at the same time you seem to always link to other makers and how they do things better...

Comments like this:

"distal taper numbers (doesn't look like there is much-if at all)"

Crimson if you have a way to measure the thickness at the shoulder and the tip please post that. I measured it at one time but I cant seem to find where I wrote it down. I beleive it reduces by half. 3/16" should be the thickness at the shoulder.

We also send most of our blades out to be HT by an aerospace pro shop. We are fully capable of heat treating in house but with the numbers that we do(batches of 60 -100 blades) we need the help.

This piece is Chromoly heat treated to 48-52 Rc. This piece was sent out for HT not done in house.

Also Crimson I always meant to sketch this piece up for you but I got inspired one day and just made the piece. I also felt I gave you the option of taking this one or not. I never pressured you to take this sword. You never once mentioned you wanted more pommel and its funny that you did want more pommel becuase my original design had more pommel but my slab of wood wasnt wide enough so I made the pommel area slimmer.

Quote from the email after I send you the picture of the sword finished:
"Awesome! That looks great. Can you put half on my card?"

I didnt even charge you a cent untill you saw a picture of the finished item. I never do that. I didnt want you to pay for something that you didnt want. a responce like "Awesome! That looks great. Can you put half on my card?" lead me to believe that it was right on the money for what you wanted.


I feel it should also be stated that I didnt take a penny from you untill 12-22-2011. I am sorry that me charging you shipping upset you. I guess I should have stated I was planning on doing so. I assumed(bad idea in buisness) that you would have expected to be charged for shipping.

 

[FortyTwoBlades]

I also gave you the option of taking this one or not. I never pressured you to take this sword. You never once mentioned you wanted more pommel and its funny that you did want more pommel becuase my original design had more pommel but my slab of wood wasnt wide enough so I made the pommel area slimmer.

^Important detail!