Buck's 13-16 degree factory grind and modern sharpening systems

J

jor fly

Joined
Dec 19, 2014
Messages
45
Hey folks,

I'm an avid Buck knives fan and collector, but I've noticed an odd pattern. I have both Lansky and Worksharp KTS, and have investigated other guide sharpening systems, they all seem to recommend either a 20 or 25 degree angle for hunting and outdoor knives, while Buck insists their grind is 13-16 degrees, which is on par with most fillet knives. I guess my question is: Does buck know something the makers of these sharpeners do not? or vice versa? I try to keep my knives close to the factory sharpening angle, but I have been forced to re profile at least one 110 to 20 degrees.

Thoughts?
 
I bought the WS KO edition mainly to sharpen my Bucks.Its adjustable degrees. 15-30 Once I get the edge close I switch to ceramic rods. Works out great for me. But yes alot of knife manufacturers just run 20degrees
 
Tanker 1/66 said:
I bought the WS KO edition mainly to sharpen my Bucks.Its adjustable degrees. 15-30 Once I get the edge close I switch to ceramic rods. Works out great for me. But yes alot of knife manufacturers just run 20degrees
Click to expand...

Do you find that the edge after using the KO is still close to the original factory grind, AND for ceramics what brand/system? (Just curious)
 
jor fly said:
Do you find that the edge after using the KO is still close to the original factory grind, AND for ceramics what brand/system? (Just curious)
Click to expand...

Yep my edges come out perfect. I set it between the 15 and 20. As for ceramics lol I use everything from ths bottom of an unglazed dinner plate ( a trick I learned from my Grandma) to the inside element of old sodium vapor lamps. They work fantastic by the way. Right now im currently using a unglazed ceramic weight from the foot valve off a chemical injection pump. I'll try anything. Just make sure its unglazed. Its all about abrasives.
 
I use 19 degrees (as marked on my Gatco guided sharpener) on my Buck Vantage. Works great as my EDC knife. I don't consider the angle marking definitively accurate on any low end guided system. The width of the knife blade changes the angle. But that angle is what works.

I have a Buck 110 that predates the Gatco, I used a Lansky guided system to convert it from an indicated 20 degrees to 17 (per side). The conversion was a tedious process. I've stayed with 17 on the Lansky for the 110 because changing was such a pain. I'm not a deer hunter so the 110 has never unexpectedly run into a large bone. 17 degrees has thus not been tested much. I have used it to break down racks of ribs, which involves some tough cartilidge.

I got two used 119's because they were cheap and I've brought both of them to 20 degrees per side. I really need to start shooting large animals...
 
I do freehand sharpening and have angle wedges. Sometimes I use them but mostly I take my user knives (110, 112 & 334) to 15*. As I like this
performance level. I enjoy this angle on S30V and 440C with my folders and Empress Trio kitchen knives. On my 119 & 120 I go with a 17*. A little more durable edge for field use.
If I'm sharpening a customers knife it will always be at 17* because I don't know what they will be cutting with it. If it is a commercial grade food service knife. I'll put a 15* edge on it. They won't complain. DM
 
The 13 to 16 degrees is one side only. I believe the Lansky 17, 20, 25, and 30 degrees is one side only, also. So, Buck's 13 degrees equals most likely 26 degrees inclusive. However, this is an opinion, only.

edited for better accuracy.
 
Last edited:
I know the forum has discussed this often and answered the questions completely. It would be nice if we had a nice pargraph we could all copy to answer this often asked subject quickly and to the point.

Sometimes I think that the 'toothy' grind on new Bucks make folks think it is a 'unfinished' or low class edge. But as we know and have discussed it will generally cut paper and your finger with ease. I do as David and Doc suggests and micro edge the factory angle a time or three then polish off all the factory 'tooths' to a nice mirror finish just because it makes me feel good. I still, in the end, bevel with a micro edge so I can crock stick for many touch-ups to follow. And then someday a good ways down the road worry about redoing the main bevel to a polished factory angle. For me a blade only has to be sharp enough to cut paper without effort or shave the hair from the top of my hand near the base of the thumb. If I see a hairless thumb I generally know I may be talking to a knife guy. 300
 
Last edited:
I will give my thoughts on this (sharpening) subject. I hope this hits some of what you're meaning.
When I sharpen I'm thinking about the steel and what it can support and cut well. 2) how is the owner or user going to maintain this blade afterward.
3) what will it be used for.
A decent upper end steel will support a 15* edge. And less. And still be strong in cutting. I think I've done this with our kitchen knives which are 420HC. I have reprofiled my Alaskan Guide 110 to a 15* edge. It came at 17*- 18*.
Here were talking about increasing performance. As long as it doesn't diminish the blade's life. My Southern girl will on occasion hit the edge on a ceramic plate during use. Men, remember the goal here is 'Supper'. Not scolding her. Back honing will easily take this out without removing metal. After one bite of her sweet potato pie, I'll forget all about having to sharpen that knife. Next time I'll give it a 17* edge angle. Think durable.
2) is maintenance. Buck puts a coarse edge on most of their knives. Which I think is correct. This allows the end user some options to tailor the edge for
his use. For a meat cutter a coarse edge really works. Because, how does he maintain his blade? Normally by using a 'steel'. This works great on a coarse edge.
It bends back the cutting edge into place with a little refining. Thus, with his method it will last a long time. The same for the guy who strops his edge. He can easily bring it back to life without removing metal. Increasing blade economy. How many of us have wore down a 6" boning blade in 2 years? Meat cutting professionals do. Also, the coarse stone is the backbone of all sharpening. If you can't get a good edge coming off your coarse stone. Then your technique needs work. At least an edge that can cut paper or rope and some hair.
3) we sharpen most knives for general use. strip wire, cut rope, open mail, ect.. I wouldn't fillet a fish with a coarse edge. I'd want it more refined. But I would prune a oak tree. Nor would I dig out a splinter. For this delicate work I take that edge up to 1-2000 grit. Because as I touch the skin I want it to cut. Not shred it like a saw. So, I keep a blade sharpened for this use as I get lots of splinters. I haven't found a Buck knife with a 16* or less edge angle. But I haven't purchased one of their fillets yet either. So, somewhere it could show up. Their Sabatier was close.
I hope this gives you some thoughts toward your sharpening strategy. DM
 
Last edited:
Thanks for all the reply folks, gives me a lot to think about. I do believe a 16-17 degree angle on a buck is going to work. I did reprofile my 110 using a worksharp to 20 once, and I didn't like it, so I reprofiled back closer to 16-17 angle. Now it cuts nicely. DM, I tend to be live Buck when they say they put a 13-16 edge, so I'm a little confused about your statement that you have never found a buck with a 17 or less angle?
 
I got a knife from the factory once that was sharp as blazes but 17 on one side and 20 on the other (per my Lansky). As I said before I do not think the absolute measured angle per the Lansky is accurate, but I do think it is repeatable. In this case I took the knife out and put it back in several times, thinking I was crazy. I wasn't.

I suspect a chip or a piece of lint or who knows what made it clamp up crooked in the jig at the factory. I don't blame Quality for not finding it, it was hard to see until you had it in the Lansky jig and tried the stone at various angles. If they checked sharpness it would have passed. Anyway I took the 20 degree side to 17.
 
Even fillet knives are no sharpened to 16 degrees inclusive, more like 30 degrees inclusive. Only surgical knives with delicate edges are sharpened as low as 13 degrees per side or inclusive. It takes a super steel to get that low and still hold up to use. I do not think Buck sharpens knives that low of an angle as they would not hold up. The edge would chip away quickly.
 
Yes, I agree. I have a Empress Trio 9" that I rebeveled to 15* and it's working fine. (440C steel) And my S30V is at 15* and I haven't noticed an issue. On the 420 steel I took it from 15 back to 16-17*. I think this is the better angle for this steel. As I do different cutting with it than kitchen use. It seems to work better for me. Jor, I said 16* or less angle. DM
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top