I have a few of questions to ask. I have some of my late father-in-law's Camillus knives . Among them are the following:1. Camillus "fighting knife" ( 7" blade, 12" oal, stacked leather handle, black sheath ,parkerised blade, reads "U.S. Camillus N.Y." on the blade below the guard), 2. Camillus M4 Bayonet (6 3/4" blade, 11 5/8" oal, stacked leather handle, parkerised blade, reads "U.S. M4 Camillus" on the guard, no sheath) and 3. Camillus Pilot's Knife (5" blade, 9 3/8" oal, reads "Camillus N.Y. 2-1972" on the pommel, leather sheath with "Pike" stone, non-parkerised blade). My father-in-law worked for Camillus during the late sixties and early seventies so I know that these knives date from that time (he was an engineer and I believe he left Camillus in the spring of 1973) but it seems to me that, except for the Pilot's knife, there is no way to prove how old these knives are. I see them on ebay variously described as "WWII" or "Vietnam era". How does one tell for sure? As for the Pilot's knife, it has a highly polished blade. I don't think my late father-in-law would have bothered to polish any of his Camillus knives (he had dozens) so I'm wondering if this was prototype knife, a production model (I haven't seen any others on ebay) or just a mistake? Finally, I have read that the military spec for the "fighting knife" is that it has an anti-rotting coating on the handle. Is this true for the bayonet as well? All the Camillus military knives that my father-in-law had in his collection have natural leather handles (not black) . None of them were ever used (they were found in a filing cabinet next to his desk at his home in Syracuse) so the coating could not have been "worn off". Were some issued without the coating, or did he pull them off the line before they were finished? (I think he was in design or quality control) Any ideas? Thankyou for your help.
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Camillus Military Knives
- Thread starter geoduck
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textoothpk
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The highly polished blade of the ASEK (jet pilots knife) could be the result of a contract Camillus had with firm for commemoratives. I have one dated 1983 that was supplied to 'WestWinds Productions' for a series with etched blades. Or, it may have been the 'Astronaut' -civilian version of the Jet Pilot, although my only specimen of that knife I have is dated a bit earlier. Maybe the Camillus guys here can help.
Camillus made lots and lots of the 'Mark 2' usmc knives over the years. Go here for information on dating yours:
Frank T
See the highlighed POINT 8 in the same link for info on the M4.
As for the anti-rotting compound used on the leather handled knives... I just don't know if Camillus used it on knives made after WW2 or not. Again, maybe a Camillus guy can answer.
I wish I had a dollar for every Mark 2, M3 and M4 Camillus repro that I have seen on ebay & at knife and gun shows, advertised as 'WW2' knives. That date stamp on the ASEK keeps those knives honest at least.
Camillus made lots and lots of the 'Mark 2' usmc knives over the years. Go here for information on dating yours:
Frank T
See the highlighed POINT 8 in the same link for info on the M4.
As for the anti-rotting compound used on the leather handled knives... I just don't know if Camillus used it on knives made after WW2 or not. Again, maybe a Camillus guy can answer.
I wish I had a dollar for every Mark 2, M3 and M4 Camillus repro that I have seen on ebay & at knife and gun shows, advertised as 'WW2' knives. That date stamp on the ASEK keeps those knives honest at least.
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I'll give it a shot. The five inch or pilot survival knife was manufactured for private customers with a shiny blade. Time frames I'm not sure of although I remember doing that as late as the early eighties.
Yes, the handles were dipped in a anti-rotting formula and if the leathers on yours are natural meaning REAL light colored then they were not dipped.
BTW, if you don't mind, what was your father-in-law's name? Just wondering if I might have heard of him. I started in '78 so I missed him by a couple of years.
Yes, the handles were dipped in a anti-rotting formula and if the leathers on yours are natural meaning REAL light colored then they were not dipped.
BTW, if you don't mind, what was your father-in-law's name? Just wondering if I might have heard of him. I started in '78 so I missed him by a couple of years.
To textoothpk: I did go to the site you suggested and found out that the bayonet is actually the 1953 version of the M4. Still not sure as to the exact date of the "fighting knife", but did determine that it is authentic and not a repro. Many thanks again.
textoothpk
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The buzz in this forum is for the most part the new, the high tech, the 'tactical', the collaborations. I'm always glad to see someone like you, Geoduck, stop in with a classic old Camillus product and ask a question about it.
Camillus was the major manufacturer of Military knives during WW2 (14,000,000 of 'em). In the illustration below, you'll see in the top left corner the 'Army-Navy E pennant'. This was a symbol given to the company by the military in recognition of excellent workmanship and delivering the important war goods on time. There was a war going on... precious, rationed steel was sent to Camillus in good faith that they would produce.. and they did. Hard-working men and women putting in overtime on the homefront to 'support the troops' (anymore we just put a bumper sticker on our Chevy to show support).
I hope your little collection of Camillus Military knives takes on a whole new meaning to you. Oh, my favorite, by the way, as per my screen name, is the Texas Toothpick emergency fishing knife, second from the bottom, left hand page.
Phil
Camillus was the major manufacturer of Military knives during WW2 (14,000,000 of 'em). In the illustration below, you'll see in the top left corner the 'Army-Navy E pennant'. This was a symbol given to the company by the military in recognition of excellent workmanship and delivering the important war goods on time. There was a war going on... precious, rationed steel was sent to Camillus in good faith that they would produce.. and they did. Hard-working men and women putting in overtime on the homefront to 'support the troops' (anymore we just put a bumper sticker on our Chevy to show support).
I hope your little collection of Camillus Military knives takes on a whole new meaning to you. Oh, my favorite, by the way, as per my screen name, is the Texas Toothpick emergency fishing knife, second from the bottom, left hand page.
Phil
The 7" f/u is not a ww 2 era fighting knife, but much later. Ontario took the contract for these in the early 80's has been making them ever since. I have an issue one of these. The pilots knife was probably made for the private sector. The m4 was adopted by the army in april 1944 if I remember corrrectly. It was to replace the m3 fighting knife and take the place of a bayonet at the same time.
Thanks to all who responded to my inquiry. To rev jch: (or is it "ich"? I can't tell from my monitor) I sure didn't mean to imply that the 7" fighting knife was WWII vintage. Quite the contrary. I thought all the Camillus military knives I have were late sixties or early seventies models and I was surprised that the bayonet was from 1953. I am even more curious now as to the date of manufacture for the 7" "f/u". By the way; excuse my ignorance, but what, besides the obvious vulgarity, is "f/u"? To Textoothpk: What a great poster! Thankyou for that. I noticed a few other knives there that I have, but the image did not reproduce well enough to make out the model names. If possible, could you let me know if the poster or image is available for sale or for free somewhere on the web? Thanks.
textoothpk
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Geo... f/u = "fighting utility"
The photo I posted was scanned from the book: The Standard Knife Collectors Guide, (third edition) by Roy Ritchie and Ron Stewart. It is not all that cleat in the book itself. I will attempt to re-scan and enlarge these two pages and email them to you as large jpeg images. This is an 'official' Camillus photo, so our moderator here may be able to help you out as well. I know Tom Williams has scanned old factory catalog pages for many of us and then sent them via snail mail.
Glad to help out. I have learned just as you are learning, through the courtesy and helpfullness of others.
Phil
The photo I posted was scanned from the book: The Standard Knife Collectors Guide, (third edition) by Roy Ritchie and Ron Stewart. It is not all that cleat in the book itself. I will attempt to re-scan and enlarge these two pages and email them to you as large jpeg images. This is an 'official' Camillus photo, so our moderator here may be able to help you out as well. I know Tom Williams has scanned old factory catalog pages for many of us and then sent them via snail mail.
Glad to help out. I have learned just as you are learning, through the courtesy and helpfullness of others.
Phil
textoothpk
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Geoduck.. Frank Trzaska is the military knife expert. Whatever he says; it's probably right.
I was hoping Mr. Trz would show up here.
Phil
I was hoping Mr. Trz would show up here.
Phil
To textoothpk, rev jch, trz and everyone else who took an interest in my post: my heartfelt thanks. Just goes to show what a great website this is. That a newcomer can feel so welcome so quickly is a testament to all who choose to participate in this forum. I'm still going through my father-in-law's Camillus collection and I'm sure I'll have a lot more questions in the near future. Best to all.
textoothpk
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Hugh... Hiya! The Camillus toothpick I sent to you was a much more recent issue. Hope you still enjoy it. I was recall your back had you laid up at the time.
Geoduck... Nice of you to stop in and write that. This is how we all learn. And if you come across any Schrades in your treasure trove, come on over to the Schrade forum right here at BFC. Email me for a larger version of the image I posted.
Phil
Geoduck... Nice of you to stop in and write that. This is how we all learn. And if you come across any Schrades in your treasure trove, come on over to the Schrade forum right here at BFC. Email me for a larger version of the image I posted.
Phil
!