Can anyone confirm this is a genuine Kiku Matsuda?

D

Dan512

Joined
Aug 19, 2019
Messages
28
So I recently went to a knife makers workshop to buy some steel and handle materials.

He had to move into a retirement home some years back and now the family is liquidating the leftovers after the shop and house got hid by the floods in Germany in 2021.

I ended up buying all they had (there was not much) amongst it a few collectors knives.

One of them is a Kiku Matsuda (or a well done clone).

I suppose he owned the knife for quite a few years, because his family said he has been of poor health for quite some time, and couldn‘t go to any knife shows anymore.

I live in Luxembourg (Europe) and have asked around on a german knife forum, but those knives are quite rare over here and I got responeses from genuine to clone through maybe.

I also wrote to Kiku 2 weeks ago but haven‘t gotten a reply as of yet.

Can someone confirm I got a real Kiku.

The blade is signed but not stamped with the steel type. Under the handle scales, a „2“ is stamped in and the handle scales have a „2“ scratched into the back as well.

If needed, I can upload more detailed shots.







 
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I have one Kiku Matsuda knife—a different model—and although I’m no expert, your knife looks genuine. The signature/maker’s mark looks identical. The handle scales look like they were made by the same person. The jimping and the placement of the jimping are like mine. The sheath looks right.
The only visible difference is that mine has the steel type on the blade.
Also, I’m not able to remove my handle scales at the moment to see if there is a number stamped. I will try later, particularly if you don’t receive any further responses.

(EDIT: My apologies, I was unable to remove one of the handle screws so I can’t see if there’s a number stamped on the inside. Regardless, I still believe your knife is authentic.)
(EDIT 2: Now I’m less certain. See KenHash posts below.)
 
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It would help if you could show us a photo of the whole knife so we can ID the model.
I have owned Kiku knives, and I have also seen Chinese counterfeits. Often you can't tell them apart
by the kanji as they copy it perfectly.
 
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KenHash said:
It would help if you could show us a photo of the whole knife so we can ID the model.
I have owned Kiku knives, and I have also seen Chinese counterfeits. Often you can't tell them apart
by the kanji as they copy it perfectly.
Click to expand...
Sorry, I thought I posted one in my opening thread. Please disregard the "Made in USA", the seller put that on there because that's what it says on the Tek-Lok.

Here it is:

 
jfk1110 said:
The gentleman I tagged above can read Kanji symbols so give him another day or so to respond.... Holiday and all....He might be away....

K KenHash
Click to expand...

Kiku knives are copied and counterfeited.
The Kanji for Kiku 菊　is usually copied perfectly,
For example, below is a Chinese fake,
JxgL1R.jpg
 
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KenHash said:
Thanks for the photo. I can not identify the model. Right now I think the probability of a fake is pretty high.
Click to expand...

What about the number "2" under the handle scales? And the complex grind geometry? (This is me clinging to straws :rolleyes: )

Here are some better photos hoping it's not a clone.

I'll also stop by at a friends tonight who has a set of hardness testings files to see that HRC it is at.










 
As I stated, I can not with certainty determine whether that knife it is authentic or a clone.

1. I can not identify the model. It has features seen on some other models and comes close but not exact.
2. No idea what the "2" on the tang represents.
3. Every Kiku I've had has been hamaguriba (convex grind) and a clear edge bevel was not visible.
An example of the edge looks like the photo below. However, this is not an absolute.
4. Every Kiku I've had has had the steel type, D2, OU-31 on the blade next to the 菊 logo.

On the other hand, IF this is an authentic Kiku, it would be a model that goes back some ways, maybe 20+ more years.
I think that ID'ing the knife model itself is the first step in determining authenticity. Short of someone recognizing the model
or getting a confirmation from Kiku Knives themselves, the authenticity would remain up in the air.
cHhn6U.jpg
 
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Dan512 said:
So I recently went to a knife makers workshop to buy some steel and handle materials.

He had to move into a retirement home some years back and now the family is liquidating the leftovers after the shop and house got hid by the floods in Germany in 2021.

I ended up buying all they had (there was not much) amongst it a few collectors knives.

One of them is a Kiku Matsuda (or a well done clone).

I suppose he owned the knife for quite a few years, because his family said he has been of poor health for quite some time, and couldn‘t go to any knife shows anymore.

I live in Luxembourg (Europe) and have asked around on a german knife forum, but those knives are quite rare over here and I got responeses from genuine to clone through maybe.

I also wrote to Kiku 2 weeks ago but haven‘t gotten a reply as of yet.

Can someone confirm I got a real Kiku.

The blade is signed but not stamped with the steel type. Under the handle scales, a „2“ is stamped in and the handle scales have a „2“ scratched into the back as well.

If needed, I can upload more detailed shots.







Click to expand...
It's great that you were able to acquire some interesting knives from the workshop. Determining the authenticity of a Kiku Matsuda knife can be challenging, especially without a response from the maker himself. Here are a few suggestions to help you verify the authenticity of your knife:
  1. Research: Take some time to research and familiarize yourself with the characteristics, design features, and craftsmanship of genuine Kiku Matsuda knives. This will help you make comparisons and identify any discrepancies in your own knife.
  2. Expert Opinions: Reach out to experts or knowledgeable collectors who specialize in Kiku Matsuda knives. They may be able to provide insights based on the details and photos you provide.
  3. Authenticity Marks: Genuine Kiku Matsuda knives often have distinct markings and engravings, including the maker's signature and possibly the steel type. Look for these markings on your knife and compare them to known authentic examples.
  4. Material and Build Quality: Examine the materials and build quality of the knife. Genuine Kiku Matsuda knives are known for their high-quality materials, precise craftsmanship, and attention to detail. Compare these aspects to what you observe in your own knife.
  5. Seek Additional Verification: Consider reaching out to other sources, such as knife appraisal services or reputable knife dealers, who may be able to assist in verifying the authenticity of your Kiku Matsuda knife.
Remember that it can be difficult to authenticate a knife without direct confirmation from the maker or expert examination in person. While these steps can help provide some insights, they may not guarantee a definitive conclusion.
 
ridaco said:
It's great that you were able to acquire some interesting knives from the workshop. Determining the authenticity of a Kiku Matsuda knife can be challenging, especially without a response from the maker himself. Here are a few suggestions to help you verify the authenticity of your knife:
  1. Research: Take some time to research and familiarize yourself with the characteristics, design features, and craftsmanship of genuine Kiku Matsuda knives. This will help you make comparisons and identify any discrepancies in your own knife.
  2. Expert Opinions: Reach out to experts or knowledgeable collectors who specialize in Kiku Matsuda knives. They may be able to provide insights based on the details and photos you provide.
  3. Authenticity Marks: Genuine Kiku Matsuda knives often have distinct markings and engravings, including the maker's signature and possibly the steel type. Look for these markings on your knife and compare them to known authentic examples.
  4. Material and Build Quality: Examine the materials and build quality of the knife. Genuine Kiku Matsuda knives are known for their high-quality materials, precise craftsmanship, and attention to detail. Compare these aspects to what you observe in your own knife.
  5. Seek Additional Verification: Consider reaching out to other sources, such as knife appraisal services or reputable knife dealers, who may be able to assist in verifying the authenticity of your Kiku Matsuda knife.
Remember that it can be difficult to authenticate a knife without direct confirmation from the maker or expert examination in person. While these steps can help provide some insights, they may not guarantee a definitive conclusion.
Click to expand...
LOL...Seems like ChatGPT has joined the discussion.....
 
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