Carbon Steel, Exposed Tang Fixed Blades and Handle Rust! What do you do?

VermontEdge

VermontEdge

Joined
Jun 10, 2015
Messages
1,144
Hey Everyone! Long time forum reader but a brand new member here! Excited to join the community!

So, I have a problem/inquiry/issue I was hoping to get some feedback on.

For years, I've only owned stainless steel knives, though the concept of a carbon steel knife always really, really interested me. However, I was always really concerned about rust, corrosion, etc. I take really good care of my knives, and I worried that I would be too picky about carbon steel to really be able to use and enjoy it.

One of my more specific concerns was around carbon steel knives (Bark Rivers, Blind Horse, etc) with exposed steel in the handle. I understood about forcing a patina, oiling, not getting finger prints on the blade, yada yada. However, I have inherently sweaty palms, and I always though...doesn't that mean that every single time I pick up a carbon steel knife, I'll be getting my salty palm sweat all over that steel? But, I put my concerns aside and, last christmas, I pointed my inlaws in the direction of a Blind Horse Lumberjack AT on ebay, in A2 steel. And, since they're amazing, I had a new knife on christmas morning.

I love this steel. I mean honestly...it's wonderful. I now vastly prefer it to any S30V or VG-10 or Sandvik stainless that I own. I used it all winter to process kindling and make fuzz sticks, and even for cooking sometimes. The blade is already starting to develop a nice, deep grey patina. However, the other day I remembered my initial concerns about tang rust and, sure enough, I found some red rust spots all over the exposed handle steel! Ah!

I've looked online for info in this area, but I haven't found anyone else who has run into this. How is that possible? Are my hands that much sweatier than an average person?

I wipe my blade down after every use...but it seems awkward to also then hold the blade and wipe my handle off too, right?

Anyway, last night I pulled out the mustard and vinegar and started a forced patina on that exposed steel in the handle (after cleaning off the rust) and I'm starting to feel better about it but...what's the deal?

Do other people have this problem?
Should I just not sweat (pun intended) it?
Should I find some other kind of coating/inhibitor?

Wondering what other experiences people have had with this.

Thank you!
 
Use an eraser to remove the bigger spots of rust followed by some good metal polish. If that fails use some really fine stropping compound. If that fails, then get some very fine sandpaper. For prevention then find a good corrosion inhibitor that's not a lubricant. There are many good reviews for EEZOX but I haven't used it so I can't give a thumbs up or down.

And they'll probably move this thread to maintenance.
 
I only have one knife with exposed bare steel on the tang (the others are coated knives that I stripped the blade, but not the handle area), but I have not personally had a problem with it yet. Must not have corrosive hands :P.

So far, in my experience the texture/finish of the steel has a lot to do with how quickly/easily it rusts. The rougher finishes rust faster (likely because they have more surface oil to trap stuff that causes rust, and more for oxygen to interact with), while the polished ones seem to do much better.

With that in mind, I'd either 1) sand/polish the exposed tang to as high of a grit as you can 2) force a patina on it, 3) both #1 and #2 or finally, 4) coat it with something. Ive heard that clear nail polish or the like can work quite well for this (never tried it myself).

Good luck :).
 
I use stainless exposed-tang knives (S35VN has proven to be very tough with excellent edge retention) or hidden tang fixed blades.

Blackjack knives makes great hidden tang knives, like the traditional model 125 or the more militant (but still classic!) model 5. The tang is inside of the micarta/wood/g10 handle, protected from sweat. Before I got a Model 5, and used it, I had a misguided distrust of non-full-tang knives. I used the knife for every camp chore possible and it held up beautifully.
 
My hands tend to patina the steel rather than make them rust so I've never really had the issue. Then again I think the rust issue is a little overblown so maybe I've never checked too closely.

When asked what knife people take sailing with them, this guy answered with opinel. It's seen it's share of rust and still works. You bought carbon steel. It's okay if it's a bit ugly. Shows character. Just like people. :D

opinel.jpg
 
Thanks for the responses everyone!

Shotgun: I dig what you're saying. I think part of my enjoyment with carbon steel so far is the "memory" if you will. I love it for the same reason that I love raw denim jeans and red wing boots: through your various usage and adventures, these things start to wear the marks of where they've been and what they've done (not to get too sentimental about it).

I know that carbon steel topics have been kind of beaten to death here, but I will ask this follow up question: people make a big deal out of rust and pitting. I think my biggest concern about the rust on the handle wasn't cosmetic, but was instead about that rust slowly eating away at the handle, spreading, pitting or generally compromising the functionality of the knife. Then I look at pictures like that opinel one posted by shotgun and I think...yeah. I should just let my handle rust/patina however it will and...no problem.

So: letting the handle situation continue - problematic? Or no biggie?
 
I have this problem with some carbon knives. Specifically my Bravo 2 in A2. The exposed tang would get rust spots over and over even with trying several types of rust inhibitor. The blade was fine. I am sort of sweaty. Anyway. I did a vinegar mixed with mustard patina on just the exposed tang and have not had any rust or any more discoloration since.
 
"No biggie" kinda hits the nail on the head.

Out here in Malaysia it is really humid and we almost exclusively use mild carbon steel for parangs. If they are in constant use the rust doesn't get time to form and any that does form overnight is easily worn off with the next day's usage.

I get that you want to keep your new knife pristine but really it's only the edge which needs to be clear of any surface rust - the rest is just aesthetic....

Enjoy your knife!

Ben
 
Peroni1973 said:
"No biggie" kinda hits the nail on the head.

Out here in Malaysia it is really humid and we almost exclusively use mild carbon steel for parangs. If they are in constant use the rust doesn't get time to form and any that does form overnight is easily worn off with the next day's usage.

I get that you want to keep your new knife pristine but really it's only the edge which needs to be clear of any surface rust - the rest is just aesthetic....

Enjoy your knife!

Ben
Click to expand...

^+1 :).
 
I don't worry about it, you could probably leave it outside for a few hundred years, bet the handle area will still be there....
 
VermontEdge said:
However, I was always really concerned about rust, corrosion, etc. I take really good care of my knives, and I worried that I would be too picky about carbon steel to really be able to use and enjoy it.
Click to expand...

If you take really good care of your knives then, yeah, you're being way too picky. ;)

meh ... what's a little rust anyway?! Most of it will simply wipe off with a Scotch Brite BLUE or PINK non-scratch pad and a little mineral oil.

As far as functionality, it would take years, if not decades, of neglect before rust would actually 'damage' a blade. Rusty ol' blades can still be made razor sharp. ;)
 
A2 is not that rust prone at all. Flitz metal polish works great for getting rid of rust from any knife. I've got very sweaty hands too but haven't had any problems with exposed sandwich tang knives like the Bark River Bravo 2. You just wipe off clean after use and maybe put on a little oil. Before storage, clean off any rust with Flitz and put on a coat of oil with 3 in 1 oil. Don't store in leather sheath and avoid humidity if possible.
 
VermontEdge said:
Thanks for the responses everyone!

Shotgun: I dig what you're saying. I think part of my enjoyment with carbon steel so far is the "memory" if you will. I love it for the same reason that I love raw denim jeans and red wing boots: through your various usage and adventures, these things start to wear the marks of where they've been and what they've done (not to get too sentimental about it).

I know that carbon steel topics have been kind of beaten to death here, but I will ask this follow up question: people make a big deal out of rust and pitting. I think my biggest concern about the rust on the handle wasn't cosmetic, but was instead about that rust slowly eating away at the handle, spreading, pitting or generally compromising the functionality of the knife. Then I look at pictures like that opinel one posted by shotgun and I think...yeah. I should just let my handle rust/patina however it will and...no problem.

So: letting the handle situation continue - problematic? Or no biggie?
Click to expand...

I don't know about you but I don't like little red rust spots. That is not a patina to me and that was what I was getting over and over. After forcing a nice looking patina, no more little rust spots. This is the case for my Bravo 1 in A2 and my Esee 5 in 1095 as well.

GrReaper said:
A2 is not that rust prone at all. Flitz metal polish works great for getting rid of rust from any knife. I've got very sweaty hands too but haven't had any problems with exposed sandwich tang knives like the Bark River Bravo 2. You just wipe off clean after use and maybe put on a little oil. Before storage, clean off any rust with Flitz and put on a coat of oil with 3 in 1 oil. Don't store in leather sheath and avoid humidity if possible.
Click to expand...

I have not found this to be true at all. My A2 Bravo 2 will get rust spots on the handle just sitting in my office, not on the blade though (I have a very good kydex sheath that somehow protects it better). This is even with Marine tuff cloth. Rust can be totally dependent on where you live too. Here in the North East it is very humid in the summer with sometimes daily thunderstorms. The only option to avoid humidity here, or anywhere on the eastern seaboard would be to stay inside an air conditioned space. Not a fun place to use a woods blade...

Again though. Patina added. Problem solved. YMMV.
 
When i strip a knife, such as Becker (1095) I thoroughly clean the entire knife, withe the handle slabs removed of course, then mask off everything but the handles area and then spray with shake-a-can automotive clear coat. Once dry, I re-install the handle slabs.
 
Clean the rust off the best you can then apply a bit of Nu-Finish car polish to the steel. Do this periodically and see if it stops the rust. :)

For further protection you could wrap the handle with paracord or leather.
 
Thanks for the feedback everyone! I put another "layer" of patina on after work yesterday. I think I'll keep periodically adding until I feel it's sufficient.

Just for the record, none of this is causing my love of A2 to falter. Just still adjusting to the carbon steel world. As I'd always hoped, the benefits of this steel already clearly outweigh my concerns.

Any advice for the next carbon steel to try out? I do find that A2 is somewhat rust resistant-ish with its decent amount of chromium. I'm also curious about O1, 1095...others?
 
3v. It is semi-stainless but is at the top of the list right now. It is my favorite.
 
VermontEdge said:
I know that carbon steel topics have been kind of beaten to death here, but I will ask this follow up question: people make a big deal out of rust and pitting. I think my biggest concern about the rust on the handle wasn't cosmetic, but was instead about that rust slowly eating away at the handle, spreading, pitting or generally compromising the functionality of the knife.
Click to expand...

Well the scales on the blind horse SHOULD be epoxied. If done right that epoxy will seal the inside of the knife from moisture so all that should be rusting is the exposed metal you can see. Even if it wasn't done right, I don't believe the rust that would occur under the scales would ever cause the knife to fail in your lifetime. Rust just doesn't work that fast IME.

I pretty much like most all carbon steel. If I had to pick one steel I like the best it would be SR101. It just takes a wicked fine edge. Note that most will rust faster than A2. If you just can't shake the rust issue than you should go with stainless. There's a lot of good stainless steels today and really the only reason I go with non-stainless is because I like the patina and non-stainless steels are usually easier to sharpen with less than ideal sharpening tools.
 
I heat up a bowl of apple cider vinegar to about boiling and then let my carbon blades soak for a couple hours. It will remove rust already formed and put a patina on any exposed steel. I've never had this method hurt any handle material yet.
 
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