Care and feeding of Snake(skin).

[Omega Leather Works]

I bought a pack of various snake skins. The pack has 8 relatively small pieces (8 3-4"x6-9") which I think will be perfect for inlays.

Here's a vendor pic.

I'll be sure to post pics and impressions when they arrive.

I have owned a few items with various exotic skins, but I've always wondered how they should be maintained. My cobra wallet has been great for the last 3 years. Seems very durable, especially since I've accidentally washed it a few times.

Anyway, any insight on the best way to treat it, or just general comments on its use as inlay material is appreciated. I assume that I won't want to use my go-to 5 stitch per inch wheel. I have the overstitcher kit that also includes wheels for 6 and 7spi wheels. Is the 7spi wheel suitable?

Thanks as always.

 

[Omega Leather Works]

Okay my snakeskins arrived today. Honestly, I'm not that impressed. I bought this from Dangerous Threads. I wouldn't buy their veg splits for anything I do, but the sole review (or maybe it was two) had really good things to say about their snakeskins.

Their ads claim first quality skins with no rips, tears or holes, yet more than one came riddled with holes. I believe I can make most of it work for inlays, but I'd be upset if I were making something where the skins were more prominent, wallets or whatever.

I'm going to contact them and see if they might exchange these for better quality items. In the meantime there are a few very usable pieces. Frankly, the price was pretty low, and I'd be satisfied if they didn't make claims that were incorrect. Not that big a deal for me, but it certainly could be for one of you.

As always, I'll post whatever I find.

 

[leatherman]

Watching with interest! Sorry to hear of the holey skins, I've found a few myself though the years, no fun. Seems whip snake is the most susceptible to whatever makes those little holes.

 

[Omega Leather Works]

I'll keep ya posted brother. I was at my local cobblers shop the other day (super kind folks) and he offered to sell me a rather enormous boa skin for $50. Seems like a good deal, but (to me) the skin looked a little boring.

On a side note, they also carry reptile skin conditioner, so my original question was answered there.

 

[Omega Leather Works]

Okay, so they got back to me. They asked that I immediately send the skins back for a replacement. Fair enough, I do wish that they didn't come full of holes, but agreeing to replace them is fine. I'll buy from them again, but next time I'll call and be specific about my needs.

 

[Omega Leather Works]

I don't want to start another thread, so I'm gonna ask here.

I want to do an overlay instead of an inlay. I don't feel like I have what I need to do the inlay properly.

Can I just glue a skin on top of the veg tanned, then stitch as usual? What about stitch grooving? Wet molding? Basically, how is it all done?

 

[leatherman]

Now your entering some pretty interesting territory now.

Most snake skin isnt what I would call overlay material, its simply too thin and delicate. I always try to use a frame to help protect the skin.

Now that said it can be done, and no you dont want to groove the stitch line (issue number two) The groover will simply cut through the snake skin. You will want to mark your stitch line in another way.

Snake is good for wet molded leather as it will simply stretch over the contours of the molding, I've never had issues with that.

You can experiment with the overlay with snake skin, but I would suggest that you work toward learning how to make a frame for inlay. It not only looks classy, it helps your inlay's last longer.

I wish I could get the fellow that I learned inlays from all those years ago, the late Dave Cole, he taught me all I know about inlays and how to make them fit. I owe him a lot, and tip a mug to him often.

After I finally get the dying tutorial done, inlay's might be the next on my list.

 

[Omega Leather Works]

Dude, an inlay walk through would be amazing, as would a template walk through. I'm getting better at templates, so let's focus on the inlays.

I have a few questions.

Which tools are necessary aside from the regular stuff? What weight leather is necessary for the frame? Do I need like a French beveler to skive out a place for the inlay? All I have is 8/9oz, that's too thick for the frame, no?

My thinking with the overlay was to groove a heavy stitch line in the top piece of veg tanned, cement the snake on top, then stitch so the snake settled into the groove. I planned to wet mold the whole mess, but I'm not sure any of this is even remotely correct.

I have a great deal of respect for the leather I use to make my sheaths. I feel it's especially important to get it right using the skin of two animals.

Here are a bunch of random pics. Thus far the sheath is cut and the welt is glued in. The top is grooved.

I don't know much about which snakes these skins come from. If anyone has any ideas, I'd really appreciate the input.

I'm thinking of using this one for the overlay (inlay?).

Random.

This one is rough like shark.

Hopefully you guys can get some idea of where I'm at. I still need to make the piece for the back that will get stitched on to loop to the belt.

 

[leatherman]

Nice collection of skins there! The beaded looking one is Karung snake, its a tropical snake, becoming more and more uncommon as its hunted for its flesh as well. Getting expensive as authorities are considering protecting the species.

The white belly cut is, I think, Cobra, a common skin but nice eh?

A couple of the others are types of python, the spots and streaks are good indicators. Also thickness, its usually a bit thicker, but not always.

Most of the others are whip snake, a very common snake skin a few years ago when I got a few boxes full. Its a very thin skin and tears easily. Care cutting and gluing whip snake should be a priority.

For the frame, I use two thickness's, for smaller work I use 3/4 ounce, for big bowies I use 4/5 ounce as it looks better. No thicker as it starts looking funky. The 3/4 ounce is inexpensive if you wait for a good sale, Tandy has it nicely priced for a side right now, around 50.00 and you get a years worth of frames out of it. The 3/4 ounce works well for any frame honestly. The sides I talked about have holes, but its so easy to work around them its a non issue.

 

[Omega Leather Works]

Good calls! I believe you're right on the id's. The one you said is cobra, I thought the same because it looks like my cobra wallet. I had written as much, but deleted it to see if you might get it.

Beaded, are you referring to the course one I said felt like shark? If so, that's funny that it's rare-ish because it's the most boring from a visual standpoint.

You even got the thicknesses right.

My order from Springfield just arrived. Nothing major, just a bunch of stuff that I needed to round out my supplies. I really wish I had thought about what I needed to do the inlays. The only leather I ordered was a belt blank from HO leather, B grade I believe, but it'll be great for danglers and straps. I would have ordered some thinner leather if I had thought to.

So, I have one of those safety skivers. I guess I could thin a piece of 8/9 down couldn't I? I've skived welts but got somewhat inconsistent results. I could probably nail it on a frame if I really took my time. Is there any good reason not to do this?

I also grabbed a #2 keen edge beveler the "old #126(?)" model. Works great. I had to see for myself if it was totally necessary. I could do the job fine with either of the tools I made, or with a knife alone, but I guess the beveler is faster.

Back to the overlay. Does my plan sound like it might work? I think I'm at a stage where doing an inlay (on this one) is impractical. It's already mostly assembled and uses heavy leather. I was thinking about how I should attach the snake to the top leather. I planned on using contact cement, but that might get lumpy. Might try some 3m spray adhesive.

I get the feeling that there isn't just one (or likely even just a few) ways of putting a sheath together. I'd like to follow others that have done what I'm doing, and been where I'm at, but I think a lot of this is going to be trial and error. In any case, I'll try to share whatever works, and what doesn't. Obviously I write a lot, maybe I'll start doing some wip threads that point out where I went wrong. Might help someone that hasn't tried whatever I'm doing.

 

[sheathmaker]

Dwayne is right. The brown beaded one is definitely Karung. I got a bunch, and I mean a big bunch of it from Jerry Van Amburg at the Wichita Tx. It is really great for inlays and not so much for for the overlays for the reasons Dwayne has outlined. My only objection to it is the pattern of the scales is kind of blah.Paul

 

[Omega Leather Works]

So are overlays not typically a skin bonded to leather? Sounds like the whole top piece is usually whatever exotic you are working with.

Well, I really hope this goes well. As I mentioned, I'd hate to inadvertently waste an animals hide.

Here's the cobra cut to dimension, as well as the roughed out belt loop.

I've skived a little of the flesh out of the belt channel. I'll clean it up with sandpaper. The corners will be stitched along with the sheath and cobra. Still trying to think of the best solution for bonding the top leather and skin together. Can Weldwood contact cement be thinned? I like the bond, but don't want any lumps or wrinkles. Hopefully the cobra won't wrinkle at, and due to, the stitch grooving while stitching.

I understand the concern for durability. If this particular skin is as tough as the skin on my wallet, I'd think it'll be good for a few years. My wallet has been carried every day for 3 1/2 years and has been washed in the wash machine a few times by accident. Still looks pretty good, although it does look like it's lost a scale or two. This sheath is for a small Fiddleback Forge knife in my collection. I think I'd probably have to do an inlay instead were the sheath for sale.

Any input from anyone is appreciated. Siper, if you see this, your input would be appreciated too. I know you do inlays, and also work with Fiddleback's.

 

[leatherman]

Weldwood out of the can is all I use to bond inlays. A word of caution, once that skin touches the sheath its there for good, dont try to pull it off to reset it. I use a "float" method, simply holding the skin just off the surface of the leather and let it hit the highest spot then carefully working it down the hill. A bone folder helps immensely. Keep it tight as you work it on. It takes a bit of finesse and practice. But I tell ya, I still goober one every once in a while.

Just brush the glue on smooth, its not difficult to get a nice even coat.

Your question on overlay's. As a rule of thumb are thicker skins, like lizard, gator, ray, shark, etc. Paper thin skins arent usually used because of their frail nature, but I've seen a few. A sheath is exposed to the elements, shrugged against stuff, and basically knocked around. A wallet spends most of its time either in a pocket or on the dresser.

 

[Omega Leather Works]

Bah... Good points all.

Well, as they say, here goes nothing!

I did some more work on the loop. It needed some tweaking. I drilled all the holes and beveled the edges.

Now I'm trying to decide on color. I'm thinking the loop and back will get a light brown and I'll leave the edges natural. Maybe. Then, obviously the top will be snakeskin.

I wonder if the beeswax/coconut oil mix that I use is appropriate for this snakeskin. I'm only interested in weather resistance and I *think* it would be fine.

Thanks so much for all of your help guys. I really appreciate it.

 

[leatherman]

Your beeswax mix should be fine, test it on a scrap first. Best rule of thumb in leather work.

Sometimes the most fun is fussing with a new design trying to make it better in both look and function. I'm working on a series of custom forged Bowies right now that the sheath patterns keep evolving.

btw, speaking of me working with customs more and more now, it was a harsh lesson for me, dont "put all your eggs in one basket" I specialized for many years in one company, when that relationship got a bit strained I could not leave. Think of it as being stuck living with an ex.

 

[Ulf Krogstad]

Really like the way reptilian skin looks and feels. Don't know anything about it so can't help you out. I'm off to see if i can find a snake skin sheath.

 

[Omega Leather Works]

Tweaking the design is one of my favorite parts.

At this point I hate pattern making. It feels confining and I end up using a ruler and basic math far more than I'd like. That's the one thing that I like more about knifemaking. I don't plan for anything. I draw a very general idea of what I want, then freehand grind. With sheathmaking I have to first be sure that the sheath fits the knife, then I can have a bit of freedom.

My wife was watching me do some stuff last night and said that I was taking to this naturally. I told her that I have everything to learn, and she said, "yes, but I can tell that you are going to be really good at it". She's not one to blow smoke, so that made me feel pretty good.

Ulf,

I like the look and feel of reptile skin too. It creeps my wife out, probably because we used to own snakes, but it doesn't bother me.

There are a number of great sheath makers right here, I'd suggest pm'ing, or emailing one who's work you admire.

Edit- btw I used saddle tan on the loop piece and back. I'm not sure I like it, but I thought it would look good with the natural micarta on the knife. Can I dye black over the tan? Also, does gum trag act as a resist? If so, I'll use saddle soap, dye then gum trag.

 

[Omega Leather Works]

Need to finish burnishing, but I'm going out of town, thought I'd post a few pics.

I'd totally change the belt loop altogether. It's fairly tight and looks funky. I'm happy with the fit, and other than looks, it's stitched well.

Constructive criticism welcome.

 

[leatherman]

At the risk of sounding like an echo Edges. Sand them edges, sand them good, sand them often.

Before I got my disk/belt sander I used a sanding block, in other words sand paper glued to various shapes of wood to make it easier to work with. One of the best was a long strip of sand paper attached to a 1/4 inch piece of plywood, about 12 inches by 2 inches. If you use a releasable glue like rubber cement you can replace the sand paper as you need it.

Did I mention edges? Its only a little important to me.

 

[Ebbtide]

Super 77 spray adhesive.

Messy if you're not careful, but just the right amount of adhesion