Choosing a shotgun

flava

flava

Joined
Mar 3, 2000
Messages
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Hi guys,

I'm about to get a shooting licence which will allow me to own a shotgun (no pump-action allowed) or a hunting riffle. I'll go for a shotgun, since I don't hunt and I'll keep it at home ... ;)
I looked arround what I can find that is simple, reliable and not too expensive and I found 2 Baikal shotguns:
Baikal IZH-43 : double barrel (2 shots) side by side shotgun, about $500
Baikal IZH-18 : single barrel (1 shot) shotgun, barrel a tad longer than then IZH-43 barrels, about $130
Which one would you get between these two? Any better suggestions? :) Thanks.
 
For a home defence gun the side by side is the better choice by far.
As you don`t need it for hunting or shooting clays go for the shortest legal barrellength to make it as handy as possible.
In Europe 16gauge is very common so it does not matter to much if the gun is 12 or 16 gauge.
Baikals are simple but very robust and reliable guns.
I would suggest a side by side with outside hammers , it can be kept loaded all the time, without being cocked.
Personally I would also consider a higher quality used shotgun, again side by side and outside hammers.
Take care that the stock will fit you as that is the most important for hitting with the gun.
If you bought one ,new or used, go and shoot it at the beginning on regular bases , and after that at least from time to time to
get familiar with it.
Some will recommend a pump action and I don`t know if that is a legal choice for you, but I still would go for the mentioned side by side with hammers because the are the easiest and most reliable to handle.
 
i've never handled a side by side. how do you decock the hammers if you decide to not shoot? seems to me that would be pretty hairy: if the hammer slips, then you have an ND....no?

or can you open the breech even w/ the hammers cocked?
 
I don't know what the used gun market is in France, but it's worth looking into -- guns don't wear out. Don't expect to get one for half the new price like you would with other used gear (other people know they don't wear out too) but you can get a better deal than new.

Bill G, you practice decocking until you can do it in your sleep before you ever load the gun, and you always do it with the gun pointed in a safe direction. It's a common cause of unintended discharges but only in the hands of people who haven't practiced.
 
Like cougar Allen said.Yes, you can open the breech while the hammers are cocked.You decock by holding the hammer back and pull the trigger a little till you feel the hammer is falling. Release the trigger and let the hammer go down.
Usually this typ of shotgun has 2 separate triggers and in general the front trigger is for the right hammer and the back one for the left.
Most of the time the hammers have a build in safty device, working that way that the hammer can only reach the firing pin if the trigger is hold back.
Thats why you should release the pressure on the trigger and let it go forward as soon as you feel that the hammer is going down.
 
I'd get a side-by side double barrel but would skip on the outside triggers. Get one with the internal-striker (if that's what it is called) keep it unloaded and store it with the safety OFF. You'll find you can load a double barrel lightening fast, and won't have to worry about forgetting to cock the thing or having to remove a safety in a high-stress situation.
 
Spydiefan, for that case he should be aware that many hammerless shotguns will automatically switch the safty on when the action is opened for loading.
A hammerless will do just fine for a home defense gun,still a ready loaded shotgun with hammers is faster to get into action
BUT for the case there are children in the house I will completely agree to keeping it unloaded. If kept unloaded the hammerless gun is actually faster and a better choice.
 
Thanks that's the point I was trying to make, although I didn't exactly come right out and say it. It's easier/quicker to bring a hammerless one into action if stored unloaded for safety of kids, nosey visitors etc. Can you not buy a pump or semi-auto in France? You are right about the safety switching itself on, I had forgotten about it because I have mostly older guns without such a feature.
 
European (including British) hunters have an odd idea repeating shotguns are unsporting. It's okay to reload a double fifty times and kill a hundred birds, but only an utter cad would use a repeating shotgun because then you could kill three birds at once! :eek: :eek: :eek:
 
Cougar Allen is right, especially the older Generation thinks that way. The younger generation hunters are not so stuck in traditions anymore. To hunt in Europe is a different ballgame than in the US. Tradition is a lot more important here and sometimes sort of a ritual. In the US its historically more a way to put meat into the freezer.
If flava can get a pump or a selfloading shotgun I don`t now, as a hunter in Germany I can.
But anyway, a double will be sufficient for home defence and for the unlikley case you need to reload , is pretty fast. It does not take much more time to fire 4 shots out of a double than with a pumpaction. This is due to the very fast second shot.
It would be a good idea to have spare ammo handy i.e. on a Uncle mikes elastic carrier that slips onto the buttstock.
Stay away from slings as ammocarriers or off any fancy stuff. For in the house do not put a sling on the gun.
For ammo selection, I suggest 00 buckshot for allround use or, to minimize overpenetration any shotsize down to 4 mm.(No1) for in the house.
If you think you might have to take a longer shot the brenneke slug is a very good choice.
But with a double you need to check where the barrels hit. Its unlikely that both shoot at the same point with slugs.
For home defence(though I probably will never need to it) I own an old 16 gauge, hammered side by side. Brand is actually Baikal, I bought it very slightley used and did get the barrels shortened to about 18 inches.Overall length is about 35 inches.Price was about 180 us$ and another 50$for cutting the barrel, putting the frontsight back on and filling the gap between the barrels.
It shots to point of aim with BOTH barrels at 50 meters(about 54 yards) I can get around a 4 inch group with both barrels at that distance, which is very good for a double and not the norm(for both barrels together)
Go for a cylinder bored barrel, you don´t need any choke.
A double is always shorter in overall than a pump or selfloader with the same barrellength, due to the action. Not really important but a fact if you want a fast handling gun.
 
Thirteenth Star, I suggested a Side by side as I was suggesting a hammered gun. If you go for a hammerless gun it does not matter if side by side or o/u., not for a self defence gun.
For hunting or clay shooting the o/u design is better imho.
 
There are a few bolt action shotguns around that flava might want to look at.

A fair compromise to a banned pump action, and can be kept "chamber empty- magazine on" for additional home safety.

Mossberg 695(?)
 
FWIW, pump shotguns are not banned in france.
I have seen plenty of them in many shops.
what is restricted is the size of the magazine and the number of shell one can put in it while hunting (no more than three if I recall correctly)
Semi auto are very common too.
 
I have a Baikal side by side in 20 ga. and it's a nice gun for the money. Action is a little tight but I've only fired two boxes with it.
 
lapinot2003 said:
FWIW, pump shotguns are not banned in france.
I have seen plenty of them in many shops.
what is restricted is the size of the magazine and the number of shell one can put in it while hunting (no more than three if I recall correctly)
Semi auto are very common too.
Click to expand...

Yeah, but they are 4th category (self defense) and right now I can't have that (it requires at least 6 months membership in a shooting club and an authorisation from the prefecture. The double barrel shotgun is category 5 (hunting) and you don't need authorisation, you don't even have to declare it...

Thank you all for the advice. I'll go for a double barrel shotgun and I'll look arround to see what I can find other than the Baikal ... and if nothings pops up I will most probably get the Baikal. BTW, it is a hammerless model.
 
Look hard at an over under with a 26" barrel.
Also, why not join a sporting club and try shooting some clay pigeons? Its a helluva lot of fun and will get you very familiar with your shotgun and its capabilities.
 
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