Choosing Needles and Thread for Hand Stitching.

Diomedes Industries

Diomedes Industries

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Mar 19, 2007
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I have to say - I am pretty much baffled when it comes to the thread choices for hand stitching leather. I use a couple of different sizes - but frankly do not know what makes them different other than they 'feel' different.

I don't know how to determine the numbers of weight or denier and could use some help. Are there any sources you can advise me toward to understand what type of thread is good for light, medium, and heavy weight hand sewing?

It strikes me that 0,00,000 Harness Needles would handle these types of threads well (I have plenty of Small and Large) - but I am clueless when it comes to threads. I don't mind waxing them - so that is not an issue.

Thanks for the help.

TF
 
I have not hand stitched in years so I can't be of much help. Regarding thread and needle size, you want the thread to fill up the hole the awl/needle makes or at least nearly fill it. The Awl needs to make a hole JUST large enough for the smaller needle, no larger. Spacing also comes into play, the larger the number of stitches per inch, the smaller the awl, needle and thread.

You might experiment with #69 poly or nylon machine thread. That's what I use for the lighter applications and have stitched a couple of inches by hand from time to time successfully. You could easily wax it also.

Paul
 
That chart is for machine needles and corresponding thread sizes. I don't know if there are harness needles even available in comparable sizes.
This might be a good question to pose over on the Leatherworker.com forum.

Paul
 
Okay Paul - I think I have figured some things out.

1) The current Awl thread I am using is 3 Cord size #207 thread.

2) I likely should have split down the sinew to a thinner size.

3) I think getting two more sizes - #138 and #92 would likely take care of the majority of my projects.

Do you use any of these sizes Paul in your machines? If so - which ones do you use predominantly?

I agree on the needle question. When I figure out what weight thread to get - I will look for a good needle size.


TF
 
Until I got my machine I hand stitched everything including some longer double layer belts which is pretty rough. In my machine I use the bonded nylon thread which seems to work really well. However for hand stitching it doesnt grip very well (assuming your doing saddle stitching), however I have used it to hand stitch straps and such just so it matches the work.

The best hand stitching thread I have used is barbours http://www.campbell-randall.com/shop/index.php?route=product/category&path=43_60_62 I get it from here. I use the barbours natural linen thread. It can be dyed different colors with your leather dye. For general edge stitching and what not I use the 6 cord stuff with I think its a 00 needle but cant remember the needle sizes.

Few things,

One I follow the practice of thinning down the ends, basically its in Al Stohlmans books which are very valuable to learn from. I take a razor blade and scrape the ends down . Then I take my ball of wax which is actually a melted down mix of bees wax/ rosin/ neats foot oil. This makes the string very tacky and lubricated. Once pulled tight it grips nicely. Anyways wax the thread length then twist the thinned out tips which makes them nice and pointy for threading the needle.

When hand stitching I take lengths that are about as long as my arms stretched out from tip to tip, Ill make several at the same time. Unless your doing a smaller project then adjust accordingly. The ends are harder to thin out once its already been waxed.

Hope this helps.
 
Quint - that does help me a lot. It appears they only carry 3 strand and above. I have three strand and have no need to go larger (yet). I am indeed doing a saddle stitch.

I will call them and see what they think concerning sizes and weights.

Thanks again,

TF
 
Tal, I use bonded threads as does Quint. I use 207 top and bottom in the Cobra 4 through a 25 needle for the edges of sheaths and heavier stuff. I use 69 thread through an 18 needle on the flat bed for lighter work, trim around inlay windows and everything else.

Paul
 
Hey Tal,

I hand stitch everything using either 207 or 277 thread depending on what's needed and use a Boss stitcher to punch the holes. I hate harness needles, they are a pain to thread the eye when you have to do it 50 times a day. I use regular harness needles, The eyes are a little more fragile but needles are cheap and I only break a couple a week.
I generally will only do one stitching run no matter how long it is because I dislike the look of multiple back stitch runs on a sheath. Single welts take about 6x the total length, double welts 7x and double with a wedge 8x.

Waxing just depends on the volume your doing. A few sheaths here and there and you can just wax it as you go, I do a pound spool at a time. It's a bit of a chore.

Based on Paul's recommendation I picked up a Cobra 4 stitcher a few months ago. I got it off the pallet and unboxed last week, At the rate I am going I might even get the thing assembled in the next couple years and figure out how it works sometime right before I retire. :D
 
This may help some of you out. Usually only done with linen thread as the other stuff doesnt work right.

Take the thread and with a razor or sharp blade scrape it at a 90 to thin it out. Then wax it up and twist the ends into a nice point. I usually trim just the end off. Then it will slide right into your needle.

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After much research and going out on a limb I found a seller of Ritz 25 (Tiger Thread) braided and made in Sweden. I have heard a LOT of great things about it from the boys in Europe. I became a customer of a company in England and ordered 0.8 and 1.0mm sizes to try out. I will let you know what I find.

Quint - thanks for the tutorial - I got the idea before - but the pictures really help.

Dwayne - I am using the awl thread from Tandy right now - it is a bit thin - hopefully the new stuff solves this issue.

TF
 
Very true about the thinness of the awl thread, its difficult when the Tejas is just right but is so often over coated in wax.

I look forward to seeing how that braided thread works! I've seen some great colors come out of Europe, and been looking for red and yellow of all things. :p I've been hand sewing everything this past year, its been fun, but its like having a Corvette in the garage while driving a Chevette. I want both, but the Corvette is not running more often than it is.
 
Please do let me know, shipping is much cheaper when two or more get in on the order, we can't be the only one's interested here. :)
 
I will do a full review and can organize an order. I can send you a hank of each Dwayne to sew a sheath and see what you think.

TF
 
Sweeet! Sounds good to me! :)
 
interested in hearing what you think of these, too - I've been using the artificial sinew and dark brown waxed 3-strand from Tandy as well, and they're OK, but I'd love to find something better.
 
Is there any reason that sewing machine thread like the #207 or even the #277 shouldn't be used for hand stitching?

I hand stitch my lining with #69 machine thread. I like the outcome.

I have been contemplating the same question as the OP. I think I might try the #277 for hand stitching.
 
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