Cold Steel vs. Emerson

stonproject said:
I dont understand the extreme fixation most of you are having on "the stronger lock". We are talking about incredible forces, which cant even be generated by human hands, that will take to even break a liner lock. Have you EVER had a knife lock break? I mean come on.

Is it just the "cool" factor? Or are you using your knives as fork lifts?
Click to expand...

I've had liner locks and frame locks fail. Neither from abuse. I like my fingers, so stronger locks are a nice touch.

Also, you're WAY off on what it takes to make a lock fail. The forces required are anything but incredible.
 
Last edited:
sloth357 said:
Someone above said something like:

NEW STEELS AND MADE IN AMERICA


I see new steels. True. HT unknown.

And MADE in Taiwan. I know Spyderco has made in Taiwan, but they have a "quality" facility: Taichung Taiwan.

I DO care where a knife is made and the end fit and finish DOES matter...

Just more for the "discussion".
Click to expand...

At least two models will be US made. As for the heat treat, CS does a more than adequate job with the steels they use, it may be worth holding off a bit to see if they got it right in the initial run, but there's no reason to speculate that it won't be solid. As for fit and finish, the Cold Steel products I own have been head and shoulders above the Emersons.
 
Insipid Moniker said:
I've had liner locks and frame locks fail. Neither from abuse. I like my fingers, so stronger locks are a nice touch.

Also, you're WAY off on what it takes to make a lock fail. The forces required are anything but incredible.
Click to expand...

Bolded for truth...

I've had all sorts of knives that came NIB with lock issues or would fail with very little pressure applied to the spine of the blade; some previously owned but LNIB, others BNIB. All were liner or framelocks FWIW. :confused::rolleyes::foot:

I can list the knives if you like. ;):D:thumbup:
 
"Someone above said something like:

NEW STEELS AND MADE IN AMERICA: They do have new steels and at least one new model will be a mid-tech made in the US. So where is this a problem?


I see new steels. True. HT unknown. : Cold Steel has never failed on their heat treat, in fact it's one of their highest praises. So where is the problem?

And MADE in Taiwan. I know Spyderco has made in Taiwan, but they have a "quality" facility: Taichung Taiwan. : Cold Steel Taiwanese made knives are very well made, do you have any experience handling one or are you just speculating?

I DO care where a knife is made and the end fit and finish DOES matter... : CS fit and finish is arguably higher than Emerson.

"I can't back Lynn Thompson, period. It takes a certain caliber person that actually "likes" his style and behavior." : With this sort of bias, you can't remain neutral on your observances because they are tainted by your contempt for the owner/company.
 
I've never owned an Emerson, and I've only owned one CS, a Recon 1 clip point combo edge.

However...

I've often looked at both brands. First impressions are important, which is why I've hesitated buying one. Here are my impressions based on many factors.

Emerson:

Major fit and finish issues in the past, though supposedly things have changed.
Steel: 154CM is a good all around steel, nothing great. Truth be told I feel for what EKI charges, this steel is outdated.
Liner lock--My least favorite locking mechanism as a whole, though some do it better than others (Brous and Spyderco GB come to mind). The only Emerson I've handled I felt the lock bar to be rather weak, a major concern for me. It is easy lock to disengage than most though.
Wave feature--a novelty to me. I owned a Kershaw Emerson briefly, I never really felt the need to wave it, and when I tried remove it from my pocket with out waving, it halfway opened, stuck in my pocket, then snapped closed on my finger. Trip to the ER and a couple stiches later, that made the wave a no-no. Thanks, but no thanks. I owned a waved Spyderco Endura, which was vastly easier to take out of the pocket without it opening, but it still wasn't for me.
Made in the US--Take it for what it is. You're paying more money for what is not necessarily a superior product.
Frankly, I will never own one.

Cold Steel:
Tri-Ad lock is vastly superior to the liner lock IMHO. But it's also a bitch to close one-handed unless you have large hands and strong fingers (like me).
Very grippy G10 on many of their models, easily shredding pockets. But I can tell, you ain't gonna loose one falling from the clipped position.
Ambidextrous, good for the lefties and those who swing both ways.
Steel: AUS-8A--Immensely strong knife, average at best steel. Kinda like a 6 cylinder Chevelle. You can get by, but do you really want to?
Steel: CTS-XHP--My experience with this steel is in my Spyderco Manix 2 sprint, and it is far and away my favorite stainless. If CS can produce it as well as Spyderco, then they will be on par with and even ahead of their competitors.
Made in Taiwan--A detractor for many, but once you've experienced a Taiwanese Spyderco, your impression will change. While CS is not on par with the level of the Taichung Spydies, they are still very well made with good fit and finish.
Variety--Many models to choose from, they aren't all super tacticool beasts.


As a whole, tactical knives do not interest me. At 6'4" and 245lbs, I'm usually left alone. Good friends of mine are in a band from the south side (Chicago) and I've been to most of the bad areas and some very seedy bars, and never have I felt threatened. If confronted, I'd rather plant a fist in the BG's face then run for it than fumble for the knife in my pocket, which the aggressor will likely see I'm going for something and attack before I can respond.

I am really excited for the new and updated Cold Steel knives. I've shied away due to the AUS-8, but now they are calling my name.
 
I own 10 Emersons and 0 Cold Steels. That atto tell you something. I also own many knives from other knife manufacturers but none of which are Cold Steel. I don't really feel like we're comparing apples to apples here. I've always have and still think of Cold Steel knives as "cheaper" or "budget" versions of Emersons. Emerson pretty much started the whole tactical knife scene and if it weren't for him Cold Steel probably wouldn't even exist. The ONLY innovation I've seen from Cold Steel is the triad lock which is basically just a modified lock back.
 
In my humble opinion, the best thing that can be done to a production Emerson is a framelock conversion.
 
I'm going to say it, you get a lot more for your money with a Cold Steel knife than you do with the Emerson. If USA made is your thing, I respect that. But apples to apples, the CS knives are better made, use similar price point (154Cm and AUS8a, good mid-level tough steels) steels, have the stronger lock and are better finished. Emerson designs are getting a little long in the tooth, the price points vs materials may have made sense a decade or more ago, today there are better options. Now with some of the options available in XHP, they will still be priced lower than EK.
 
CS is the best value production knife company.
 
Haha incredible forces lol don't make me laugh. Tri-ad out right spanks Emerson liner lock in abuse and hard use capacity. Not even close. I don't think there is a liner lock made that will endure more hard use than a tri-ad lock.
 
I really dislike CS because of LT. It makes me jealous as heck when I see his videos. Looks like a lot of fun but when I try dancing around in bike shorts swinging my battle sword they lock down the ward and call security. ;)
 
Insipid Moniker said:
I've had liner locks and frame locks fail. Neither from abuse. I like my fingers, so stronger locks are a nice touch.

Also, you're WAY off on what it takes to make a lock fail. The forces required are anything but incredible.
Click to expand...

Well, whats required to make a lock fail then? I am talking properly made locks. I have never had a liner lock or framelock slip, or "fail" that wasnt on a total POS knife.

There seems to be a reacurring trend of people who dont like liners/framelocks to have had them "fail many times". Im just curious the exact circumstances that would cause this. I cant imagine a PROPERLY crafted liner lock would ever fail unless subjected to extensive use over a long period of time.
 
stonproject said:
Well, whats required to make a lock fail then? I am talking properly made locks. I have never had a liner lock or framelock slip, or "fail" that wasnt on a total POS knife.

There seems to be a reacurring trend of people who dont like liners/framelocks to have had them "fail many times". Im just curious the exact circumstances that would cause this. I cant imagine a PROPERLY crafted liner lock would ever fail unless subjected to extensive use over a long period of time.
Click to expand...

You're getting into a circular argument here. You can define away any example that fails as improperly executed, for what it's worth the liner lock was an Emerson that failed with spine pressure and was returned, the frame lock was a Fox that did the same.

As for the kind of forces required, watch some of the testing Allen Elishewitz did and the frequent weight hang tests on Youtube. And those are essentially static loads, add in someone tugging, twisting or bouncing on the knife handle and you'll get a lot of broken locks. That's one big reason I like strong locks, even the strongest ones are honestly fairly weak when compared to a decent fixed blade.
 
It is sort of like comparing a Harley with a Honda. Both are solid. With a Honda there is nothing to do other than to push the start button, and it will cost you less. With a Harley there will be a longer break in period and during this time you might get to know the finer points of your bike wether you like it or not, for a slightly higher price. In the end it comes down to personal style. If you want an extremely reliable, hassle free, foreign made product you go with Cold Steel. If you want an extremely reliable (albeit with a little more commitment in the beginning), American made, iconic product you go with an Emerson. Which is "better"? The one that you choose based on the qualities that matter most to you.
 
I've only had one lock failure ever occur, and that was the liner lock on a CRKT M16-12Z. It has made me leery of liner and frame locks ever since.

Given time and/or abuse/misuse any lock will fail.

Despite my distaste for liner and frame locks, five of my ten folders feature them. The other five are back, BBL, and compression.

Cold Steel's Tri-Ad lock is definitely the strongest of any I've encountered. The next closest would be the BBL, then compression.
 
GronK said:
I really dislike CS because of LT. It makes me jealous as heck when I see his videos. Looks like a lot of fun but when I try dancing around in bike shorts swinging my battle sword they lock down the ward and call security. ;)
Click to expand...

^Had me dying! Hahaha
 
Jamesh Bond said:
Keep it civil and objective. Lets not turn this into one of "those" threads. Lets show we are better than that.

Id like to see intelligent discussion take place here in Cold Steel.
Click to expand...

There really isn't much to say
My biggest complaint about CS is the cheese that goes into their marketing; country of origin; and their steel isn't the best.
Emerson has a good warranty and made in the US. However, they're extremely overpriced and fit/finish that children making three bucks a day can outdo.
 
Cold Steel all the way for me. I have owned Emersons in the past; I own none now, but I own numerous Cold Steel models. The stronger and longer lasting Triad lock, the grippy G10, CTS-XHP (a great steel BTW), great designs, and very reasonable prices make Cold Steel the clear winner in my book. Somehow the fit and finish on my Cold Steel knives has been impeccable, even on cheap models. Maybe I am just lucky.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top