Corrugated Bevel Technology??

Grego

Grego

Joined
Apr 22, 2007
Messages
402
I was wandering if anyone can tell me what the science is behind the CBT on models like the CG FBM...I know that it will reduce friction while cutting, but as far as making the blade stronger, how is exactly does it do that?

I was told that the CBT will give that .25" piece of INFI the strength of a thicker piece of steel, and of coarse...there lies the science behind CBT?

As far as saying that the CBT will give a CG FBM the strength of a FFFBM, who knows?? but what do you think would be a fair comparision?

And what are your overall thoughts between the CG FBM and FFFBM...pros and cons on both?

This CBT has really sparked my curiousity:D
 
The corrigations will not give a .25" thick blade the strength of a thicker piece of steel. If you could take a flat piece of .25" INFI and bend it into corrigations, then it would be much stronger, just as is done with corrigated steel roofing material. But unlike sheet metal corrigations, the CBT blade corrigations are cut into the steel.

What the corrigations will do is to maximize bending strength per unit weight. That is, if you took a solid blade of INFI that weighed the same as a .25" blade with corrigations, then that solid blade of INFI would be slightly less than .25 inches thick, and it would bend before the corrigated blade of the same weight would.
IMO, this is still a significant advantage. Maximize strength relative to weight and reduce cutting friction. Sounds good to me.
 
MikeH said:
The corrigations will not give a .25" thick blade the strength of a thicker piece of steel. If you could take a flat piece of .25" INFI and bend it into corrigations, then it would be much stronger, just as is done with corrigated steel roofing material. But unlike sheet metal corrigations, the CBT blade corrigations are cut into the steel.

What the corrigations will do is to maximize bending strength per unit weight. That is, if you took a solid blade of INFI that weighed the same as a .25" blade with corrigations, then that solid blade of INFI would be slightly less than .25 inches thick, and it would bend before the corrigated blade of the same weight would.
IMO, this is still a significant advantage. Maximize strength relative to weight and reduce cutting friction. Sounds good to me.
Click to expand...

So in a sense, the corrigations gives the .25" piece of INFI greater lateral strength. If I understand you correctly?

What I like about the CG FBM, while it may not be as strong and "beefy" as the FFFBM...is that it feels a little more livelier or quicker while manipulating it, but if I can have the best of both worlds in a CG, because of the CBT...then that was an outstanding idea to add those. The difference in overall strength and performance between the two models...is it a land slide in favor of the FFFBM or not??

JUST CURIOUS.
 
Grego said:
So in a sense, the corrigations gives the .25" piece of INFI greater lateral strength. If I understand you correctly?
QUOTE]

No, the corrigations will not give the .25" piece of INFI greater lateral strength than a non-corrigated 0.25" blade.

For two identical blades of the same dimensions (except for thickness) and the same weight, the uncorrigated blade will be thinner than the corrigated one, and the corrigated one will be stronger.

For two dimensionally identical blades (including having the same thickness), the non-corrigated one will be heavier, and it will be stronger than the corrigated one.

The difference is subtle. The statement that a corrigated blade is stronger can be true or false. To say that it is stronger per unit of weight is true. To say that it is stronger per unit of thickness is false.
Click to expand...
 
Grego said:
I was wandering if anyone can tell me what the science is behind the CBT on models like the CG FBM...
Click to expand...

There's no science. It's all elves, pixie dust, and magical adventures.

Sssssshhhhh.......

Honestly, I think the FBM CG is going to be one of the most sought blades in the next couple of years. I got my ten. You? :D
 
bloodgrooves!? never tried it but when puncturing with a thrust, will the blood flow freely?
 
I've already killed 17 imaginary elves with my FBM CG. Blood grooves work great...
 
thanks for the defintion! so it actually lightens and stiffens (I-beam). being in construction it makes sense! however, i am dissapointed that the marine corp taught us wrong! (they never got the memo!)
 
Ok, here is the scoop on corrugations:

Corrugations on any material are supposed to add strength for lateral flex much like an I-beam or C-channel steel beam is stronger than a flat steel beam of the same overall mass. Simple strength of materials design and easy to figure out.

Anyway, the reason why the CG FBM may be as strong as the LE is not just because of the corrugations. The CG is only about 0.24" thick versus 0.32" for the LE. The difference lies in the grind. The LE is Flat Ground. The FFBM is a high Sabre Grind but after the sabre part it is a flat grind all the way to the edge. The SE is this way as well just thinner than the FF. The CG is not Flat ground at all. In fact it is more of a low sabre grind and it really isn't even that: From the edge to the beginning of the corrugations, there is a slight convexing that gives more material. From the corrugations all the way to the spine, the blade quickly comes to full thickness making even thicker than the LE at almost any given point from halfway down the blade to the edge. This is why te CG FBM feels so front end heavy for such a thin blade.

There is a lot of thought that went into the design of that blade and I would say that there is no way it could have been done as economically without CNC. The CG FBM may well be the hardest Busse knife to make ever. Duplicating one would be nearly impossible unless you had the CNC program to do it, and if you asked for one to be made by hand, it would cost much more than the other FBMs to duplicate.

This is all my opinion and analysis and not based on facts.
 
Thanks for such an in depth report Cobalt

Cobalt said:
Ok, here is the scoop on corrugations:
Corrugations on any material are supposed to add strength for lateral flex much like an I-beam or C-channel steel beam is stronger than a flat steel beam of the same overall mass. Simple strength of materials design and easy to figure out.

Anyway, the reason why the CG FBM may be as strong as the LE is not just because of the corrugations. The CG is only about 0.24" thick versus 0.32" for the LE. The difference lies in the grind. The LE is Flat Ground. The FFBM is a high Sabre Grind but after the sabre part it is a flat grind all the way to the edge. The SE is this way as well just thinner than the FF. The CG is not Flat ground at all. In fact it is more of a low sabre grind and it really isn't even that: From the edge to the beginning of the corrugations, there is a slight convexing that gives more material. From the corrugations all the way to the spine, the blade quickly comes to full thickness making even thicker than the LE at almost any given point from halfway down the blade to the edge. This is why te CG FBM feels so front end heavy for such a thin blade.

There is a lot of thought that went into the design of that blade and I would say that there is no way it could have been done as economically without CNC. The CG FBM may well be the hardest Busse knife to make ever. Duplicating one would be nearly impossible unless you had the CNC program to do it, and if you asked for one to be made by hand, it would cost much more than the other FBMs to duplicate.

This is all my opinion and analysis and not based on facts.
Click to expand...
 
Cobalt said:
Ok, here is the scoop on corrugations:

Corrugations on any material are supposed to add strength for lateral flex much like an I-beam or C-channel steel beam is stronger than a flat steel beam of the same overall mass. Simple strength of materials design and easy to figure out.

Anyway, the reason why the CG FBM may be as strong as the LE is not just because of the corrugations. The CG is only about 0.24" thick versus 0.32" for the LE. The difference lies in the grind. The LE is Flat Ground. The FFBM is a high Sabre Grind but after the sabre part it is a flat grind all the way to the edge. The SE is this way as well just thinner than the FF. The CG is not Flat ground at all. In fact it is more of a low sabre grind and it really isn't even that: From the edge to the beginning of the corrugations, there is a slight convexing that gives more material. From the corrugations all the way to the spine, the blade quickly comes to full thickness making even thicker than the LE at almost any given point from halfway down the blade to the edge. This is why te CG FBM feels so front end heavy for such a thin blade.

There is a lot of thought that went into the design of that blade and I would say that there is no way it could have been done as economically without CNC. The CG FBM may well be the hardest Busse knife to make ever. Duplicating one would be nearly impossible unless you had the CNC program to do it, and if you asked for one to be made by hand, it would cost much more than the other FBMs to duplicate.

This is all my opinion and analysis and not based on facts.
Click to expand...


HuH??? I thought those corragations were "Cast" into the blade, like adding re-bar to cement??? :eek:
 
So that's why you are collecting Infi dust, you want to mix up a batch to pour a few more steel hearts.

Good plan.
 
Cobalt said:
Ok, here is the scoop on corrugations:

Corrugations on any material are supposed to add strength for lateral flex much like an I-beam or C-channel steel beam is stronger than a flat steel beam of the same overall mass.
Click to expand...

Again, the key words are "of the same overall mass."

If you take a .25" INFI steel blade and cut or lase corrigations into it you have reduced the overall mass, and it will not resist lateral bending as well as if you had not corrigated it. The reduction, however, may be so small as to be irrelevant. If you take an identical .25" INFI steel knife and thin it until it has the same overall mass as the corrigated blade, then the corrigated blade will resist lateral bending better.
 
randucci said:
HuH??? I thought those corragations were "Cast" into the blade, like adding re-bar to cement??? :eek:
Click to expand...

your not the onlt one that thought that? :D

Remember Valleytinworks, he thought e had discovered the secret as being cast blades.:D

Where is Chris anyway. It has been sometime since he's been on. hope all is ok.
 
MikeH said:
Again, the key words are "of the same overall mass."

If you take a .25" INFI steel blade and cut or lase corrigations into it you have reduced the overall mass, and it will not resist lateral bending as well as if you had not corrigated it. The reduction, however, may be so small as to be irrelevant. If you take an identical .25" INFI steel knife and thin it until it has the same overall mass as the corrigated blade, then the corrigated blade will resist lateral bending better.
Click to expand...

yup yu got it.

But there is more going on than just corrugations in the CG FBM. It is more of a convex ground blade with corrugations. It has way more mass near the edge than the the other FBM's with the exception of possibly the FFBM, but even then I think it has slightly more metal behind the edge.

If you want a chopper but don't want weight the CG FBM is the way to go and like I said earlier, it definitely took more work to make it even with CNC.

For example the FBM LE is much more neutral in balance than the CG FBM yet it is way thicker at 0.32". What makes this even more amazing is that the CG FBM is not 0.25 inch thick by any means. I have several and have mic'd them all and they are all about 0.24 with the coating which makes them about 0.225 or the same as an a std FSH, SFNO or SJTAC LE in thickness. But it is more convexed and has the corrugations which give it more weight and much more strength.
 
Cobalt said:
your not the onlt one that thought that? :D

Remember Valleytinworks, he thought e had discovered the secret as being cast blades.:D

Where is Chris anyway. It has been sometime since he's been on. hope all is ok.
Click to expand...


First there was CPMS30V, CPM154, CPM3V, CPMD2, now we have CPMINFI!!!! Jerry has taken all of the INFI dust he has been saving over the years and has secretly made molds and is casting then sintering the FBMs!!!
 
randucci said:
First the was CPMS30V, CPM154, CPM3V, CPMD2, now we have CPMINFI!!!! Jerry has taken all of the INFI dust he has been saving over the years and has secretly made molds and is casting then sintering the FBMs!!!
Click to expand...

LOL.... Hey lets spread that rumor. Cast INFI is baddass. :D

I want a CPM sintered cast Friction Forged INFI blade.:D
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top