CPM-154 vs. ELMAX (I'll throw in M390 too)

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Kirk_Ferentz

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Feb 16, 2010
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As a preface, I should specify that this question is really for those of you fortunate enough to have done substantial work with any two of these three steels... I'm looking for educated opinions about how you find that they perform (in whatever areas you think matter). Strengths/weaknesses? Which do you prefer? Which would you want in which type of knife?

When I picked up my ZT 0551, ELMAX had some good reviews but it seemed that there was not a lot known about it. Now that people have put it through the paces, it looks like ELMAX has turned out to be better-reviewed than I ever thought it would be. Also, I forgot that ELMAX is a powder steel like CMP-154, which may account for how well it seems to sharpen up. I also see that it has done very well in Ankerson's edge retention tests--on par with exceptionally hard CPM-154 and outperformed by M390.

Anyway, CPM-154 is the only other stainless steel that I always thought I would have to try. It seems to have great reviews but unlike some of the other "super steels," is easy to re-sharpen (something that is important to me). M390 seems to be a favorite of many experienced people as well, but I have not seen as much about its general properties. But with the great reviews of ELMAX, I wonder if there is anything to be gained from these other steels.
 
from what i have heard cpm 154 is similar to s30v. some have said its a bit better some disagree. ive got a couple knives in 154 cm and find it a very nice knife steel. i would have to imagine that cpm 154 is a bit better on edge holding. have no experience with m390 or elmax, these are much newer steels than 154 variants. i would think that theres some performance gain on those newer steels. i think theres a steel comparison chart buried in the forum somewhere where you might get better answers.
 
ELMAX sharpens like CPM-D2 performs a little like ZDP and takes impact like CPM-M4. It stays razor sharp for a long time and will hold a overall edge longer that I had things to cut. For me it is the perfect steel because it performs as expected and beyond.

154cm & CPM-154 is good when done right but not my cup of tea.

M390 is in a different class. High wear
 
I have M390 and 154 CM (Sorry, no Elmax or CPM154). By my own testing, M390 holds and edge very comparably to S90V but IMO, has a "toothier" edge than any other stainless I've tested (S90V, 154CM, N690, 440C). 154 CM takes a nice edge and I'm guessing CPM 154 takes a similar edge and holds it longer...but not like M390.

If someone has compared Elmax vs. M390 directly, that would be an interesting comparison. However if you asked me right now, I see no downside to M390 when compared to CPM 154 or Elmax.

M390 sharpens easily as well...but takes longer than 154 CM to do so. Easily means there is no special "tricks" needed like I have to do with S90V...it just takes a bit longer due to all the hard carbides it has.

Get a BM 581 or the new TSEK 806 or the Spydie Millie in M390...sharpen it and be wow'd by the aggessive cutting and edge retention.

Having said that, I EDC CPM 3V because I love the edge it takes :P. M390 is my second choice with my BM 581 or TSEK 805.
 
M390 is a curious one. I've noted it takes and holds a razor edge much like CPM-M4. At Rc 62, I've cut half-inch thick pieces of cardboard with it and it still seemed to roll rather than chip:eek:. Though I know it will have micro-chipping on dirt at Rc 60(but what doesn't?). I'd describe it as a stainless M4.

Elmax is similar, though it trades edge holding for more toughness. I've heard that someone bent a blade of Elmax to 90 degrees without breaking, though that sounds a bit ridiculous. I've still never heard of it chipping before though.

As for CPM-154, I haven't been too impressed with it. Sure it'll take a beautiful mirror polish with ease, but I've chipped it more than a few times. I suppose it's better than S30V unless you plan to really abuse it.
 
So sounds like I'm not missing anything with CPM-154. With M390, sounds like the sharpening is not a huge issue (although I'm guessing you have to use the super tough stones, like shapton glass or diamond, and my japanese water stones would get eaten up by it), but it is more towards the edge-holding end of the spectrum (toughness being the other end). If that's right, I think ELMAX is probably better suited for my uses since I want to know that my blades have a lot of toughness, as I pretty much only carry them when I am out in remote places where I may end up needing them to take some abuse.

I hope we see more ELMAX blades.
 
CPM-154 @ 62 HRC is comparable to ELMAX @ 60 HRC and ZDP-189 @ 65 HRC from my testing.

M390 is a step above those 3 @ 60 HRC, more in line with S90V at 60 HRC if M390 is at 61 HRC or higher.

One really can't lose with CPM-154, ELMAX or M390.

I think ELMAX is the best all around steel because it has excellent edge retention while be VERY tough even at high hardness, 62 HRC.

M390 is the premium steel of the bunch, excellent edge retention with good toughness at high hardness of 61+.

M390 and ELMAX are very stain resistant also.

CPM-154 is just a great steel with good toughness and edge retention, but usually only avaiable in Customs these days at good hardness.

We definitely need to see more ELMAX models offered and at good hardness of 60+.

IMO ELMAX could take the place of S30V and S35VN as the go to steel for all around mainstream models, ELMAX is the steel that all the others want to be when they grow up. :)
 
Sounds like it may end up being quite a bit cheaper than S30V... if so I wonder if it would have the potential to overtake the likes of VG-10 and 154CM as well as S30V, etc.
 
M390 and S90V have higher impact toughness at higher hardnesses compared to Elmax (PM PLASTIC MOULD STEELS–WEAR RESISTANT AND CORROSION RESISTANT MARTENSITIC CHROMIUM STEELS; C. Kerschenbauer,M.O. Speidel), and they are all in the range of CPM154 and S30V for impact values. Reduce the hardness of Elmax and it gets a jump in toughness, but at 62 I would take M390 for higher wear and toughness, as well as CPM-M4 some more toughness but lower corrosion resistance.
 
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