CPM S60V vs CPM S30V

I don't know how much better it actually is, but S60V is measurably better in edge retention than the S30V.
The only problem is that the 60V tends to be brittle when the hardness is high. Spyderco had some problems with chipping when they cranked up the Rockwell rating, so back when 60V was called CPM440V, those blades are about 55HRc.
30V performs quite similarly to the 60V, but it can be machined much easier, and can be harden to higher levels.
I have a S60V and a S30V Spyderco, and they perform quite similarly, but fixing the edge on the S30V is a much easier task.
Hope this information helps.
 
Common, I like to sharpen my knives. Easiness on sharpenning is not first thing I look for good blade - best in this parameter is 420.
And I am not chopping wood with my folders. Now I am sertan that S60V is better for me then S30V.
Thanks, Vassili.
 
In addition, according to Crucible data:
S60V more then 8 times better then 440C - 800%
S30V 1.45 times better then 440C - 145%
It is a huge differense!
Thanks, Vassili.
 
I wouldn't take the Crucible charts as actual measures of performance you'll see in real life, more just as relative swags at what you can expect. In my experience, S60V does have better wear resistance -- which is not the same thing as edge retention-- than S30V. Does that mean you'll have better edge retention with S60V? Well, if all you're doing is cutting highly abrasive materials, then you probably will. But if you're putting any real stress on the edge, S60V will micro chip out quickly whereas S30V is very tough. For any use that is not purely abrasive but also puts other stresses on the edge, you can expect better edge retention out of S30V, unless you leave the S60V edge thick and non-performant.

Joe
 
I am by no measure an expert on blade steel, but for me, using a knife is my test on the best steel for me. I have knives of both types, and much prefer the S30V. My S30V's hold an edge just as well as the S60V. I think it has to do with the hardness of the S30V, as the previous writer said, the S30V can be at a greater hardness. Yes I have had one of my S60V's chip at the edge.
 
When we here talk about "edge retention", we mean how long an edge will stay sharp. Crucible is using the term as synonymous with wear resistance. I'd suggest that the way we use it here is much more meaningful for a knife user. It would be very confusing, for example, if I read Crucible's charts and came to the conclusion that S60V has better edge retention than S30V. Then I take an S60V knife and S30V knife, do some whittling, some cardboard cutting, a little hacking, and now I can't figure out why my S30V blade is still sharp, but my S60V blade is blunted and chipped and doesn't cut anymore. It's because S60V has better wear resistance, but won't retain its edge as well when subject to stresses that S30V can handle just fine.

That's why I continue to try to get us all to use "edge retention" as the commonsense meaning: how long the edge is retained (which is a factor of abrasion resistance, toughness, strength, and what in particular you are doing with it), rather than how abrasion resistant it is.

Joe
 
I agree with gull wing. I have blades in both alloys and the S30V holds an edge just as long as the S60V if not a little longer when you use the blades on the same type of material and for cutting only. The S60V will chip when cuting something that is a little tough to cut. During the winter I do quite a bit of whittling/carving and I have used these two particular knives on this type of cutting on purpose just to see how they will compare on edge retention. After using each one on separate days for a full day, the S30V holds an edge better than the S60V and the S60V will have very small chips in the edge. If a person wants to check edge retention on wood, get some well cured Zebrawood and try cutting it across the grain.
 
Vasilli, what joe is suggesting is that there may be other factors that can affect edge performance than simply wear resistence. He's raising an example where the edge can be blunted and yet it is not really related to wear resistence, but more to the brittleness of the blade.
I recall Mr. Glesser (at Spyderco) had said that he had to lower the hardness on their 440V (S60V) blades because they chip too easily, and that had probably created a problem where too many blades were coming back to the warranty & repair center.
If edge retention is everything to you, I'd suggest you look at carbon steel heat treated by a master.
 
I think this debate is getting close to being moot as in all probibility S60V will be in very few new designs as most people and manufactures now prefer S30V.

But if not, here we go again.

Nice to see ya again Joe T.
 
We have interesting discussion on Russian forum on this matter. With survivors, outdoorsmen, hunters, etc. Conclusion is - S30V can not substitute S60V. S60V better holds edge, S30V - tuogh and this is just different things.

Nobody like idea to not to use S60V any more and use only S30V instead. Best is have both: S30V on big knives (Green Beret, etc) and S60 on small knives, gentelmen knives etc. Now there is a rush in Russia - people looking for old Military with S60V. They want have both Military with S30V and with S60V and even first run with S60V overhardened and use each one for different tasks.

And every posts "pro S30V" here actually taling same things too. But S30V can not be just better - it is for some tasks, it is not for other. I like to have small "city" knife like my Hiro LB from S60V - I will not chop or cut something hard with it. Also I like to see my faivorite KaBar USMC fron S30V too.

Thanks, Vassili.
 
I'll take the edge I can depend on- day in and day out for any job over one which is specialized; unless thats all I intend on doing with it! s60v seems a bit too finicky to my $'s at a reasonable hardness level. Just a thought.
 
Interesting bump. What's so finicky about S60V? It's discontinued now, got replaced by S30V, which in turn is being replaced by S35VN.
 
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Kind regards,

Jos
 
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