cross draw sheaths

S

Salolan

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Feb 27, 2013
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I am looking to make a couple of what I would call a cross draw sheath for a couple knives I am finishing up. Similar to this....
0QVVJtr.jpg


Every sheath of that style I see has stitching out around the loops and some even have separate stitching completely around the belt holes. Is this purely aesthetic or does it serve another purpose? Stiffening and strengthening the loops perhaps?

Are there benefits to having both the front and the back of the sheath extend out to the loop area as I've seen in most photos?

As always, thank you in advance,
Chris
 
Hey Chris this style of sheath is often referred to as a Pancake sheath. Very popular in holsters too for toting around handguns. I thinnk it got its name from the fact that it lies flat against you like a pancake. Most are made a little differently than the one you pictured. Looks like they sewed a stacked sheath on a belt slide. Most of these pancakes are a front and a back with a welt in between with the slots being integral to the design. The perimeter stitiching is essential. Stiching around the slots themselves is not and I have done it both ways. I've probably made as many of these as anybody, both sheaths and holsters and I have never seen separation around the slot to be an issue. Having the slots extended from each other provides several benefits. One is spreading the weight out so it is more comftable, two it allows you to angle the knife more and it also, depending on where worn, allow you to split belt loops instead of just sticking it in between where it might not fit well. Couple of suggestions on your design. Those slots have to be parrallel or you will create a whoaie or bubble in the belt behind the sheath that will have difficulty laying down flat. Another, I've found that 7" oal on the knife is about the biggest that will practically work in a crossdraw position. Get much bigger and the handle is poking you when you move or the tip sticks out past your body and catches on EVERYTHING. Pancakes work very well with larger knives in other postions like the small of the back or behind the hip with a butt forward draw. But crossdraw, 7" is about the limit if you are gonna be doing anything more active than watching tv.
 
Thank you Dave.
If I correct the slotting issues would you think it okay to just have the belt slide only 1 layer thick? Or should I just do the full 3 layers? I tried to go smaller than 7" on the OAL for the knives but they started looking toyish at shorter lengths.

Thanks,
Chris
 
Chris, I'd probably stay away from single ply. In my eye it wouldn't look finished. You'll get better wear from two ply too. Yeah, that becomes a matter of taste I guess. Anything I make pushing 8" seems like a machete to me. I make a lot of knives in the 5.25" to 6.5" range If its a larger knife think about carrying it behind the hip or small of the back. There's a couple of pics in the Sheath Makers and Such sticky. My stuff is at the bottom.
 
Chris, I asked similar questions and got the same great info from Dave. One thing I was confused on was if the welt extended to the wings (making three ply), or if the sheath had a traditional welt that surrounded the blade only. If I understand it correctly, the wings are two ply and the welt only surrounds the blade.

I haven't had a request for one of these yet, but they do seem popular. I'd like to see what you come up with. I think I'll try one of these when I get my Fiddleback Karda back (I sent it to a friend to try out). Maybe we can get enough info in the thread to make a quasi how-to.

Btw, do you stitch by hand, or do you have a machine? I feel like these and inlays are going to be far easier with a machine.
 
On mine the welt is only on the edge side. It doesn't surround the blade totaly. It does extend all the way to the perimeter on the edge side though. You only get the occasional gunsel that can't tell up from down. So really havn't had a problem with cut stitches along the spine of the blade. Pancakes tend to form to the body and this allows that without a bunch of break in.
 
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Thanks Dave. I had already decided against the single ply last night after I posted. I will however likely do a full 3 ply as in the past I have had issues with knives trying to dig in when inserted if I don't have a welt on the spine side. Also, I it will allow me to tool both sides and the user can switch to behind the back if he does feel that to be more comfortable. I was curious, how do you make the belt slots? Do you have a punch that does it all at once or do you punch both ends and cut between?

Anthony, I hand stitch. I'm still small time! lol

Chris
 
Yeah I use a 2" punch for the slot. If you're gonna buy one get the Weaver. They are great. If you are having those problems as you mentioned you might have something else going on. May be an upswept point knife? On those I will do a welt all the way around. I have played with the flip around idea. Didn't work for me. As I mentioned the pancake sheath will take a "set" or mold to the curve of the body. So you move it from above the left front pocket and flip it to wear as a right hand SOB draw and all the edges of the sheath that are suppose to be flat against the body are sticking up in the air if that makes sense.
 
Man I need one of those bag punches. I use the Stohlman punch-punch cut-cut. Works fine, but it can be a little tricky. Like an English point I suppose. You can do them by hand, but they are a pain if yer gonna do more than a few.
 
You know the trick on the English point if you're cutting them by hand with a head knife? Try this if you are not doing it already till ya get ya a punch. If you are right handed cut the right side of your point first then flip it over with the flesh side up and cut the other side. Much easier to get the cuts even arc wise. Most folks want to make the cut grain side up pointing away then swap their strap around to cut with the point at you. Harder to get the arcs even that way.
 
Thanks Dave, I'll try that. I think I'm doing it as you say, the hard way. Usually I end up needing to shape them a little with sandpaper, but I don't like touching leather to sandpaper if I can help it. Getting quality proper thickness leather (7/8oz in my case) as well as switching to the round knife have eliminated a lot of sanding for me. The leather I'm using is nicely buffed and far more pliable than my last hide too.

If anyone plans to do more than a couple of strap ends without using a dedicated punch I suggest making a pattern/template. I made a couple of round and English point patterns for 1" straps out of my go-to pattern making plastic, those flexible cutting boards, or flexible 3 ring binder covers. Helps a lot instead of looking everywhere for a pill bottle or jar or coin or whatever you use to make your strap ends with.
 
Dave, if you don't mind, I got your phone number from the your website and I'm going to give you a call.

Thanks again,
Chris
 
Well after scrapping the first attempt and redrawing the pattern once again, here is what I came up with....

7TuaNvm.jpg


All that remains is to stitch it, burnish the edge and oil it.

Thank you all for the advice.
Chris
 
You bet Chris I was out of town for four days and kinda off the grid. I'll return your call today, I have your number. Above looks good so far.
 
No worries Dave. I think I answered most of the questions I had myself. The leather I had tried to use at first was 9/10 oz and the whole thing was just too thick I thought. I ended up using some 7/8 and then skived the welt down a bit as well.

Yes, those are still flat Anthony. I don't want to risk pulling the glue apart until I get them stitched up.

Chris
 
I'd gree with that Chris, stitch em up then wet mold em.
 
Yeah, that's the way I do it. With non-stamped pieces I wait to dye it until after molding. The dye can run and splotch. Eco-Flo (water based) will run horribly, which is the main reason why I don't use it. Fiebings pro oil resists running far better, but still will a little in my experience.

With stamped work I do as little wet molding as possible because, obviously, it can blow out the stamping. In those instances I stamp, dye and finish first. I use a tiny bit of warm water on the inside and mold. The dye and finish stiffens the leather and resists blow out.

Post pics when you're done. :)
 
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