Damascus knives are there any advantages

How do you feel about damascus steel

  • It is inferior to many modern blade steels

    Votes: 35 30.2%

  • When done right it is a great performing and attractive option

    Votes: 65 56.0%

  • The risk of hidden inclusions or weld failure is a big concern

    Votes: 7 6.0%

  • I don't care about the steel, it is the design and geometry of the knife that matters most

    Votes: 9 7.8%
  • Total voters
    116
I have one damascus knife, L6/1095 by Jodie Muller at about 61Rc. Looks good, holds an edge and cuts great. The mokeme bolster pairs well with the damascus.
 
My only Damascus knife is this 2015 Case TB61028W DAM.
The Damascus is from Devin Thomas, a "Top USA Maker", from what I've heard. I don't know if it is his "High Contrast" or "Double High Contrast" Damascus. I only know it isn't his "All Stainless" Damascus. I believe it is a "Ladder" pattern Damascus.

As the knife is somewhat rather mighty fancy, I don't carry or use it much, except for go to meetin' duty, which at this point/stage in/of my "life" is rare.
Hence I don't know how the edge holding compares to my other knives with mono-steel blades.
Both the "High Contrast" and "Double High Contrast has/uses O1, according to his website, so it might hold an edge a little better than say my 440A, 1095/T10, and (Buck) 420HC blades?

View attachment 1455249
 
jfk1110 said:
Initially, Damascus steel meant a blade.of wootz steel, a product of India forged in medieval middle eastern techniques that were lost over time. Within the last dozen years or so Alfred Pendray managed to identify and replicate the.processes used to make a damn good and close iteration of the famed blades that would slice a hanky falling thru the air.

Pattern welded steels have become popular under the misnomer of Damascus steel. Personally I like Damasteel. Their process and product both appeal to me!

In the end, it all comes down to taste and use! Everybody will differ on these!
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Anyone who believes that wootz steel or Frank Richtig's mysterious heat treat or ancient Japanese sword makers or whatever produced steel that was in some way superior to the steels produced by modern metallurgy should have someone who is mentally competent managing their finances and whatnot for them.
 
not2sharp said:
Then there is the other misnomer, so called cable or wire rope damascus. I like that the thing is forged from a homogeneous steel; which to me means the potential for better welds and heat treatment. But, I don’t know whether the high carbon cable used has the chemistry that we want for quality knives.

cacable_damascus_integral_175807_2.jpg

post-24759-128466686525.jpg



n2s
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My favorite is cable steel

I find when done right it makes a very good cutting tool and call me crazy it seems to give me a toothy edge






[URL=https://app.photobucket.com/u/jparanee/a/ed68763d-3358-4cf3-96d7-a7deae423ab0/p/8bcb899f-866c-4d4d-8291-28873b4fcf33][/URL]
 
I do not mean to insult anyone. I am simply pointing out that there are a lot of "opinions" in this thread. Not necessarily facts.
I collect William Henry knives with Mike Norris stainless Damasteel. This type of blade has "micro serrations". These are by no means hard use blades! If one were to cut for instance a plastic tie they will chip the blade badly. Or worse, snap the blade off altogether. All I do is open mail and have also tried the rope test. Of course with an appropriate size rope in regard to the blade size. Now, here is the kicker. Given the rope test the Mike Norris stainless Damasteel outperforms my favorite super steel! Which just happens to be S90V. I prefer it to S110V and S125V. I feel that it has the best balance of all considered properties. I also do not prefer M390. No, it is not the same thing as S90V. M398 Is a real loser IMO(my opinion, perhaps not yours). I take into consideration a myriad of parameters for a blade. Not just how sharp or edge retention. Anyways, my point being That there are in fact quality Damascus knives.That go so far as to outperform Super Steels. Limited to certain tasks, of course. This is the polar opposite of the Pakistani knives.
 
SS234 said:
I do not mean to insult anyone. I am simply pointing out that there are a lot of "opinions" in this thread. Not necessarily facts.
I collect William Henry knives with Mike Norris stainless Damasteel. This type of blade has "micro serrations". These are by no means hard use blades! If one were to cut for instance a plastic tie they will chip the blade badly. Or worse, snap the blade off altogether. All I do is open mail and have also tried the rope test. Of course with an appropriate size rope in regard to the blade size. Now, here is the kicker. Given the rope test the Mike Norris stainless Damasteel outperforms my favorite super steel! Which just happens to be S90V. I prefer it to S110V and S125V. I feel that it has the best balance of all considered properties. I also do not prefer M390. No, it is not the same thing as S90V. M398 Is a real loser IMO(my opinion, perhaps not yours). I take into consideration a myriad of parameters for a blade. Not just how sharp or edge retention. Anyways, my point being That there are in fact quality Damascus knives.That go so far as to outperform Super Steels. Limited to certain tasks, of course. This is the polar opposite of the Pakistani knives.
Click to expand...

How do you know your Damasteel has “microserrations”? What steels are used in it? Have you chipped out or snapped a W&H blade?
 
Mike Norris said so. I base my whole rant on a demonstration he did at a show. Although I have compared his William Henry steel to the 940-1 and I would pretty much agree with him. The 940-1 would much better suited at breaking down boxes and cutting plastic straps. The William Henry Kestrel B09 more suited to opening mail and cutting tape. Not to say that a more robust Damascus blade cannot be built. It can. Have a look at his web page. It says what steels he uses. My one of a kind WH has his Raindrop pattern. As for microserrations JParanee just mentioned that it was "toothy".
 
Originally, damascus steel was both a process and a product that formed carbon nanotubes and that's why it outperformed the other metal weapons of the time. Until the last few decades, this was not understood and pattern welded steel was an aesthetically pleasing and decent performing blade material.
Today, the arguments about different steels are really only useful as an academic exercise. Don't get me wrong, I love the research and micrographs and fractions of difference in performance we can conclude by testing, but the reality is that I don't care if you are using a Buck 110 in cheap stainless or the latest high tech steel, after taking apart a deer or elk you are going to need to strop that blade if not fully sharpen it if you didn't use a thick blade to break through the pelvis and other spots bone needs dealing with.

And if you are using your knife to open boxes, it's your life, but that's a pretty dumb thing to do when a boxcutter is the right tool for the job.

My grandfather used to say that flashy fishing lures vs. a good old Rapala popper or Mepps spinner was designed to catch the fisherman, not the fish. It's the same with knife steels. I've yet to find a steel that maintains a hair whittling edge after the first cut or two, and after that most of them stay sharp enough for regular tasks regardless of the steel. It's fun to chase the latest and greatest but completely unnecessary for practical purposes.

The only exception are the truly stainless blades like H1, cobalt, SM-100 which you can abuse with saltwater for a few days of surf fishing without pitting or rust.
 
Motega said:
Originally, damascus steel was both a process and a product that formed carbon nanotubes and that's why it outperformed the other metal weapons of the time. Until the last few decades, this was not understood and pattern welded steel was an aesthetically pleasing and decent performing blade material.
Today, the arguments about different steels are really only useful as an academic exercise. Don't get me wrong, I love the research and micrographs and fractions of difference in performance we can conclude by testing, but the reality is that I don't care if you are using a Buck 110 in cheap stainless or the latest high tech steel, after taking apart a deer or elk you are going to need to strop that blade if not fully sharpen it if you didn't use a thick blade to break through the pelvis and other spots bone needs dealing with.

And if you are using your knife to open boxes, it's your life, but that's a pretty dumb thing to do when a boxcutter is the right tool for the job.

My grandfather used to say that flashy fishing lures vs. a good old Rapala popper or Mepps spinner was designed to catch the fisherman, not the fish. It's the same with knife steels. I've yet to find a steel that maintains a hair whittling edge after the first cut or two, and after that most of them stay sharp enough for regular tasks regardless of the steel. It's fun to chase the latest and greatest but completely unnecessary for practical purposes.

The only exception are the truly stainless blades like H1, cobalt, SM-100 which you can abuse with saltwater for a few days of surf fishing without pitting or rust.
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There's a lot that can be argued against here and various steels absolutely have noticeable differences.

That said, this thread was about any potential benefits of Damascus.
 
I tend to agree with Bill Bagwell on the subject of cable damascus. DONE RIGHT, it's probably the toughest blade material that still holds a good edge. It's just not easy to do right.
 
SS234 said:
Mike Norris said so. I base my whole rant on a demonstration he did at a show. Although I have compared his William Henry steel to the 940-1 and I would pretty much agree with him. The 940-1 would much better suited at breaking down boxes and cutting plastic straps. The William Henry Kestrel B09 more suited to opening mail and cutting tape. Not to say that a more robust Damascus blade cannot be built. It can. Have a look at his web page. It says what steels he uses. My one of a kind WH has his Raindrop pattern. As for microserrations JParanee just mentioned that it was "toothy".
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So you haven’t chipped or snapped a WH damascus blade, I’d be surprised if you did. Matt Conable makes a pretty knife, but they are made to be used. The weak point is generally damage to the handle material not the blade.
 
I have a "few" WH knives. I have not even been so nice to some of them. Not one of them has ever sustained any type of damage whatsoever. Anywhere on the knife. You get what you pay for.
On the other hand I have broken a custom Michael Walker. Although I was outright abusing it at the time. Just goes to show.......

On William Henry they did not make the blade. It is Mike Norris, Devin Thomas ETC.
 
brownshoe said:
How do you know your Damasteel has “microserrations”? What steels are used in it? Have you chipped out or snapped a W&H blade?
Click to expand...
Any steel can be sharpened to have microserrations . In this case I think “microserrations” make sense only in different wear of two different steels used in that Damasteel so it hold edge longer ?
 
SS234 said:
I do not mean to insult anyone. I am simply pointing out that there are a lot of "opinions" in this thread. Not necessarily facts.
I collect William Henry knives with Mike Norris stainless Damasteel. This type of blade has "micro serrations". These are by no means hard use blades! If one were to cut for instance a plastic tie they will chip the blade badly. Or worse, snap the blade off altogether. All I do is open mail and have also tried the rope test. Of course with an appropriate size rope in regard to the blade size. Now, here is the kicker. Given the rope test the Mike Norris stainless Damasteel outperforms my favorite super steel! Which just happens to be S90V. I prefer it to S110V and S125V. I feel that it has the best balance of all considered properties. I also do not prefer M390. No, it is not the same thing as S90V. M398 Is a real loser IMO(my opinion, perhaps not yours). I take into consideration a myriad of parameters for a blade. Not just how sharp or edge retention. Anyways, my point being That there are in fact quality Damascus knives.That go so far as to outperform Super Steels. Limited to certain tasks, of course. This is the polar opposite of the Pakistani knives.
Click to expand...
Damasteel is a brand name. Mike Norris does not make Damasteel.
 
On William Henry they did not make the blade. It is Mike Norris, Devin Thomas ETC.[/QUOTE]
Larrin said:
Damasteel is a brand name. Mike Norris does not make Damasteel.
Click to expand...

Do you believe damascus has microserrations?
 
Last edited:
Well I figured you'd know, given you've probably seen a lot. Thx.

I've got one damascus knife and don't feel its serrated. It is hard, cutswell and holds an edge but that's not micro serrations.
 
soc_monki said:
The original "Damascus" steel was magical. It was hard to produce, but it had good qualities.
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At the time, it was considered magical.

Compared to modern high strength, high hardness, high toughness steels it is not even a contest.

I've seen studies of ancient Wootz/Bulat damascus where the steel tested in the mid to low 40 rc in hardness tests. Compared to iron blades It would have seemed magical.
 
It is 61rc. Per William Henry. It is slightly "toothy", it is not serrated! That is per many users and my own findings. This is due to the opposing metals. That is per William Henry. Mike Norris on his website states that he makes "Damasteel". I imagine the name is tossed around. Such as "Kleenex" being a term for all facial tissue. We do not need to argue these points all day. Since it is not "I" that made them. "I" simply passed them along. One thing holds true. Modern stainless Damascus is in no way comparable to that of it's Ancient counterpart. Only in name. Period. Modern Stainless Damascus tends to perform likewise to modern "Super Steels". Again, passing that along. Not solely my opinion. However, opening envelopes it does me as well as S125V. I would imagine under harder use, even S35VN may outperform stainless Damascus. I am not the one to ask. Please do not argue with me. These are not my opinions. I am simply reciting what I have read multiple times in multiple places. My actual opinions are based on opening envelopes only. I think I have been clear here on what are my opinions and what are others opinions.
 
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