Designing a folding knife for Spyderco

[W. Anderson]

The Yojimbo2 keeps coming to mind for some reason.

 

[David Mary]

I looked through some of the other pieces you have made. Very, very nice.

Thank you!

When I said "modified sheepsfoot/wharncliffe-esque" up above, what I meant might be closer to the seax knives that you've made. I think a sheepsfoot blade generally has too rounded a shape near the front and a wharncliffe might be a little too pointy.

What do you (and others, of course) think of a seax style blade like you have done that integrates a thumb ramp?

I think that is a very interesting idea. So kind of like a folding (and obviously scaled down!) version of this bad boy?

 

[NWPM2]

Thank you!



I think that is a very interesting idea. So kind of like a folding (and obviously scaled down!) version of this bad boy?

View attachment 1378323

That is exactly the shape I was thinking of when I made the comment with about the blade shape! I think that would work remarkably well in a folding knife.

I don't know the tradition or history behind seax knives and it does seem that people tend to prefer thin blades, but that with a hollow grind and some thickness would be nice. That might be impractical depending on the height (edge to spine dimension) of the blade since it might leave the tip somewhat thin and fragile. I think a flat grind would also work. Maybe with less tapering toward the tip.

There has to be a good Old Norse word that you could name it!

 

[David Mary]

I have sent off an email to Spyderco asking them if G10 is strong enough alone to support the CBBL without liners. Awaiting a reply.

 

[Danke42]

I have sent off an email to Spyderco asking them if G10 is strong enough alone to support the CBBL without liners. Awaiting a reply.

Works on the Dodo.

 

[David Mary]

Fantastic!!!

 

[David Mary]

I received a reply from Peter in R&D, which basically amounted to "it depends", but he said not to use Chinese G10, or G10 under .050" thick. Okay. No problem. I want it made in Golden, and I want the G10 about 4mm thick. I asked more questions, basically pertaining to the feasibility of a full length cutting edge for a CBBL knife. I showed him pics and a video of my regrind of the Manix 2 XL in action, and I'm awaiting his reply.

Here is a basic concept so far. I might as well send it to him and see what he says. I'd love to hear all your thoughts too.

PICS REMOVED per Sal's suggestion:
https://forum.spyderco.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=87150#p1437057

 

[David Mary]

N NWPM2 , You really inspired me, and though I was going to shy away from a sheepcliffe design, I'm glad I didn't. This is my dream Spyderco.

 

[NWPM2]

That's really nice of Spyderco to reply to you so quickly. I'm constantly impressed by the consistency and speed with which everyone in the company seems to respond to their customers.

I really like that design in the picture you posted above. That blade shape is exactly what I was picturing in my head. The full length cutting edge looks superb and the slight downward angle of the blade look great. (I don't know the terms here, but if the knife were open and on a flat surface, I like how the tip touches the surface and then the edge rises off the flat surface as you go toward the pivot.) I think your placement of the holes for the clip are perfect! I assume it's on purpose, but the angles of the holes look perfect. When tip up, the knife would angle toward the seam of your front pocket and when tip down it would allow access to the CBBL.

The overall design strikes me as somewhat reminiscent of a Manix 2 lightweight with G10 for handles along with a bit of Manix XL thrown in there as well. I'd imagine the internals of the Manix 2 lightweight would work with your design.

I also watched a disassembly video of a Native Chief the other day. That one looked like it had phosphor bronze washers riding against G10. I've never heard anyone complain about the durability of that knife. That's also coming out in S90V so I imagine it's selling really well for Spyderco.

I have never had or used LC200N steel. That might make the knife appeal to a much wider audience since it would be extremely corrosion resistant.

I do have one very selfish request: A deep carry clip that fits the standard Spyderco screw pattern. I think that would be a big source of controversy.

Edit: I think this is pretty obscure, but I wonder if a variation of the Janisong clip could be used. The hole pattern on that is very wide, but I like the clip.

 

[NWPM2]

N NWPM2 , You really inspired me, and though I was going to shy away from a sheepcliffe design, I'm glad I didn't. This is my dream Spyderco.

I threw out some vague terms in an attempt to convey a few poorly formed images I had in my head. You deserve the credit for running with it! My suggestions were actually inspired by looking at the other pieces you made.

Ok, sheepcliffe is the term. There are so many variations to the blade shapes and I'm not familiar with them.

In looking at the pictures a little more, are you thinking of some type of G10 or metal backspacer for the knife? I see 6 screws running along the top edge of the handles. From the pivot moving toward the back, I assume there would be some sort of metal insert for the CBBL mechanism that would likely take the first two pairs of body screws. I think a backspacer would likely need at least two locating pins anchored in the G10 along with the remaining pair of screws. The backspacer might be a good opportunity to add a contrasting color for a little visual interest.

 

[David Mary]

Thank you very much for the kind words. Yes, I thought carefully about everything I did up there, especially clip placement. That's not to say I didn't make any mistakes, I may very well have, but I am sure they will be revealed soon if they exist. I have multiple layers, including the lock and tang, but they are not ready. I might see if I can leave the engineering intricacies of lining those up just right to Spyderco. If not, I'll seek help with it from the community.

You'll note the lack of a lanyard fob hole. There is no need on such a large knife. If someone wants it badly enough they can use a drill!

Sal has stated that Spyderco will not get into deep carry clips, because Spyderco doesn't want to step on the toes of craftsman who have carved out niches for themselves making and selling after market clips. I would be getting an MXGear clip for mine.

I think Sheepcliffe is sort of an unofficial term.

Yes, the first two body screws are for the lock bar, and the last one would be for a stand off. Keeps the weight down. Maybe a backspacer would be called for though to balance the knife.

 

[bikerector]

Lanyard/fob acceptance: For the most part I think they're overrated on folders but for a knife using LC200n you're probably looking at people that would take this out to the water where some type of line to the knife would be a way of not losing it. Also, I use fobs on several of my 4" bladed folders and pull the clip off so the fob sits at the top of the pocket and the knife is allowed a more natural position within my pocket. Probably not in the majority there. I have one on my millie and had one on my buck 110 LT but moved that to a belt pouch carry so I removed it. I like using bails and fobs even, blend in some of the aesthetics from the old scout slipjoints.

I think a slight adjustment to the front "guard" spot to cover up the exposed blade tang when the knife is folded could be a nice touch if it can be integrated in without making it a pecking point in the pocket, like flipper tabs tend to be. I think some slight scalloping of the handle near the spydie hole, like the endura and delica, wouldn't hurt my feelings, even if just to smooth it out for a sliding point into the spydie hole.

I could see the pinky beak and pocket clip area being weird catching a pocket lip, but that's purely a theoretical problem that could be vetted with some quick testing, just a thought at this point and maybe not an actual problem

Lastly, and this is theoretical, but I think the pivot may be a little too far forward as conceptually it seems like there would be very little steel on the area at the backside of the blade around the pivot. I would have to measure my millie there to see what they have but in a larger folder that may get used I think that would be a weak point. I believe the spyderco tatanka had a weak spot in the pivot and it was a point of failure in some destruction videos on youtube, maybe it was one of the cold steel challenge vids. Purely theoretical and basing that solely on the looks and proportions of the image and that's something I would base on numerical data of what spyderco already has on their knives, like your resilience.

Any plans for gimping on the thumb ramp or back of the handle like the manix 2 has? Maybe some around the butt for the thumb for reverse grip shenanigans?

 

[bikerector]

And a special request, get that baby in orange in case it falls into the salt series but dislike pee yellow colored handle scales.

 

[W. Anderson]

Looks like a very useful, no-nonsense cutting tool. If this comes to pass I'd grab one 100%

 

[Chinook3]

Awesome. I really like the design you came up with. The larger “sheepcliffe” blade with the negative angle is sweet! I really like how you made it 4.25 cutting edge which is a little different for spyderco. It looks comfortable in reverse grip too, I hope this comes to fruition. So what’s the name gonna be the David Mary Sheepcliffe!?

 

[TraditionalMedicinal]

I really like what you've come up with so far, can't wait to see the end results

 

[NWPM2]

Thank you very much for the kind words. Yes, I thought carefully about everything I did up there, especially clip placement. That's not to say I didn't make any mistakes, I may very well have, but I am sure they will be revealed soon if they exist. I have multiple layers, including the lock and tang, but they are not ready. I might see if I can leave the engineering intricacies of lining those up just right to Spyderco. If not, I'll seek help with it from the community.

You'll note the lack of a lanyard fob hole. There is no need on such a large knife. If someone wants it badly enough they can use a drill!

Sal has stated that Spyderco will not get into deep carry clips, because Spyderco doesn't want to step on the toes of craftsman who have carved out niches for themselves making and selling after market clips. I would be getting an MXGear clip for mine.

I think Sheepcliffe is sort of an unofficial term.

Yes, the first two body screws are for the lock bar, and the last one would be for a stand off. Keeps the weight down. Maybe a backspacer would be called for though to balance the knife.

I really like the clip placement you put in your concept. I think leaving out the lanyard/fob hole is the right call. I could see them being useful on a smaller knife, but not called for on a larger knife. That's especially true when the lanyard hold interferes with the clip placement.

The deep carry clip was a long shot suggestion! I know the controversy behind it, but thought I'd throw it out there anyway.

I think this is taking shape nicely!

 

[NWPM2]

C Chinook3 brought up names. How about an Old Norse word for a name?

How about the David Mary Custom Spyderco Skar?

It looks like "skera" is the verb "to cut" and "skar" is the "third person singular past indicative" of that verb. So that would be like, "It cut."

 

[ferider]

I love the idea of another >= 4" bladed collaboration knife.

However: the Sheepsfoot and Wharnie are well covered now by Spyderco (Caribbean and Yojumbo). And the Yojumbo is something else ... I suggest not to compete with it, you'll loose

What's missing in the current line-up is a large Bowie-type blade shape with a straight top-edge'ed tip, like the Chinook 1 (not a Persian trailing point like the Chinook 4).

Roland.

 

[David Mary]

Lanyard/fob acceptance: For the most part I think they're overrated on folders but for a knife using LC200n you're probably looking at people that would take this out to the water where some type of line to the knife would be a way of not losing it.

Duly noted.

I think a slight adjustment to the front "guard" spot to cover up the exposed blade tang when the knife is folded could be a nice touch if it can be integrated in without making it a pecking point in the pocket

On the to do list. Thank you.

I think some slight scalloping of the handle near the spydie hole, like the endura and delica, wouldn't hurt my feelings, even if just to smooth it out for a sliding point into the spydie hole.

Some chamfering would be called for, certainly but I don't want to make any change that will alter the existing outline, except perhaps to deepen the entire inward curve of the front of the handle. That is a possibility. On the to do list to play with it.

I could see the pinky beak and pocket clip area being weird catching a pocket lip, but that's purely a theoretical problem that could be vetted with some quick testing, just a thought at this point and maybe not an actual problem

It can use some refinement for the reasons you stated, and for aesthetic purposes. On the to do list.

pivot may be a little too far forward...

The center of the pivot on my Resilience is just under 3/8" away from the front of the scales. I set up the knife above to be a touch more than that. I think it will be strong. And the further back the pivot goes, the less blade length we get relative to handle length, so I didn't want to go too far back.

Any plans for gimping on the thumb ramp or back of the handle like the manix 2 has? Maybe some around the butt for the thumb for reverse grip shenanigans?

Absolutely. The is going to be a Filipino grip focused knife, but it is designed to allow a saber grip nonetheless, although the force vector for thrusting or piercing in that grip is not anywhere near as efficient as something like the Military or Police.

And a special request, get that baby in orange in case it falls into the salt series but dislike pee yellow colored handle scales.

Duly noted. I think Spyderco has a tendency to try things in the "safe black" before they start sprinting but I can certainly put it out there. I would actually really love this in orange.

Awesome. I really like the design you came up with. The larger “sheepcliffe” blade with the negative angle is sweet! I really like how you made it 4.25 cutting edge which is a little different for spyderco. It looks comfortable in reverse grip too, I hope this comes to fruition. So what’s the name gonna be the David Mary Sheepcliffe!?

Thanks! Reverse grip edge in and edge out are both going to be very comfortable and efficient with this design. I am trying to think of a name that captures the essence of both Filipino and Norse cultures, as an homage to the dual inspiration which gave birth to the original Barong Seax machete this is based on. So far I haven't come up with anything much other than the name "Astrid", because Filipinos tend to have a wide variety of names, and so I figured there was no reason a Fliipino couple wouldn't gave their daughter a Norse name like Astrid. I don't know. The Spyderco Astrid? The name is feminine, and derived from Norse words for godliness and beauty, so I question the viability of this name for such a big "manly" and "ugly" knife.

I really like the clip placement you put in your concept. I think leaving out the lanyard/fob hole is the right call. I could see them being useful on a smaller knife, but not called for on a larger knife. That's especially true when the lanyard hold interferes with the clip placement.

While I sympathize, Chad made a good point about the fob hole for water goers, so adding one is on the to do list.

I think this is taking shape nicely!

Thank you!

the Sheepsfoot and Wharnie are well covered now by Spyderco (Caribbean and Yojumbo). And the Yojumbo is something else ... I suggest not to compete with it, you'll loose [sic]

I guess we'll see, but I think we'll tight.