Dying Curly maple wood

A

AmericanSoldier1989

Joined
Apr 16, 2014
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I'm wanting to dye some curly maple scales to match the color of the scales in the picture of this Winkler axe (photo by bladehq). I have a beltknife II, and I'm wanting my axe to match it. I'll be making them from scratch (first time). I've also never worked with wood before, or shaped any scales.

I've tried searching , but, I can't find info on how to make it as dark as the ones in the picture. I've read that maple can be difficult to dye compared to other woods. Some dark dye turns it pink?

Can someone point me in the right direction please?



 
Fiebings Leather Dye. Wipe a small amount on and immediately wipe it off with another rag. Work fast.
 
If you want the flame to pop as much as possible, you can coat with whatever dye you use and then sand back the surface...repeat a few times. Each time the flame gets darker, so it pops more when you do the final finish. I do this on custom guitars done in figured maple to push out as much figure as possible without getting it too dark.
 
Aqua fortis is the ultimate for curly maple. You have to be in a well ventilated shop. Leather dye, and the analine dyes from Lee valley work well too. I use fine steel wool rather than sandpaper to knock the surface back.
 
This is a good circumstance to forgo dye and just use a wood stain - MinWax or a much, much better product - Behlen.

As you build your scales (or any other project where you need to develop colors with stain or dyes) make up extra material that can be sanded and processed just like your scales as the test pieces. You can control stain easier than dye and you can wipe your scales with a thin coat of WATCO or BLO as the first treatment before you stain to help prevent potential blotchiness. The old base will be compatible with the stains.

Can offer more on the go advice when you get to doing it.

Ray
 
TRACK OF THE WOLF sells Aqua fortis. It comes with directions. You can make the maple as light or as dark as you like.
 
Behlen was what I first started looking at. I just couldn't find the contrast with the maple that I want. That black/red color. The blood red does look the closest to the color I want though... is there a way to make the curly pop more with this stain?


Will the fieblings dye colors show up like the samples? Looks like mohagany is the closest in this dye. I've read on some past threads that some people have done Black , sanded, and then a dark red on top. Should I consider that or no? Thank you for the help guys.

I've also been reading up a lot about Aqua fortis, it just doesn't seem to be that rich deep red I'm looking for. Could I add like a fiebings dye or Brieling stain on top of that?
 
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The fieblings light brown has a slight red tinge, and I've mixed mahogany or oxblood with it to get a rich Koa like colour. The amber analine dye from Lee valley is fairly red too.
 
AmericanSoldier1989 said:
Behlen was what I first started looking at. I just couldn't find the contrast with the maple that I want. That black/red color. The blood red does look the closest to the color I want though... is there a way to make the curly pop more with this stain?


Will the fieblings dye colors show up like the samples? Looks like mohagany is the closest in this dye. I've read on some past threads that some people have done Black , sanded, and then a dark red on top. Should I consider that or no? Thank you for the help guys.

I've also been reading up a lot about Aqua fortis, it just doesn't seem to be that rich deep red I'm looking for. Could I add like a fiebings dye or Brieling stain on top of that?
Click to expand...

Is the stain you have the color you want? Using the knock back technique, you can repeat it until the desired figure pop you want is achieved, but still have the color you like. Other than that, you have to add darker dyes to the undercoat, and that changes the dynamics of how the color shape play when overlapped. I'd test on scrap. That said, I can usually get extremely 3D figure in big leaf and European flame maples on guitars repeating the application and sand back method. When someone wants truly darkened flame with a color over it, I use much darker colored dye to wash the grain with, sand back, and then put the lighter pigmented finish coats over that. If you want blackened flame with blood red, you'll have to do a darker treatment to darken the flame first.
 
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This for example is high contrast doing black dye first, sanding back, and then applying color coats.
 
Coloring wood is a challenging business and the desired results are often elusive. Getting the right color is a trial and error process that often requires 3 or 4 colors (dyes or stains) to work from and multiple samples. I've done as may as 20+ samples trying to achieve perfect matches. Fortunately you don't need a "perfect" match. The secret to success is to make certain that your samples are of the same material AND just as sanded and clean as to the same level as your intended finish piece. If you don't properly prep your samples you will never know the final results until you do the final piece.

Dyes can look incredibly different when first applied - browns can be very yellow for example - and you can't know the end color until you process all the way through to your final coat of finish. Stains are more revealing of the potential color. As ERRN writes above you can knock back to dark a stain by waiting at least overnight then sanding to lighter or by wiping with mineral spirits when the stain is still wet. You can also establish some control and some grain highlighting (pop) by applying a coat of thinned Boiled Linseed Oil or WATCO oil. This seals the more porous grain so that the stain doesn't over darken. Mixing stains of the same brand is an option too but be sure to mix enough to complete the job. Nearly impossible to mix spoonfuls and then duplicate the final effect.

Bottom line is to be patient with the process - prep work, drying times between coats, sanding and cleaning between coats. Don't sand stain unless you are trying to change the color - sand before stain and after between coats of finish. AND don't beat yourself seeking perfection in the color. Get close and be happy. Why beat yourself up. Good luck.

Ray
 
You're going to tear off the handles on a $350 custom knife and make your own?
What would Winkler charge to replace the scales to match the axe you ordered?
 
jdm61 said:
Fiebings and steel wool work well.
Click to expand...

I really like the dark tone of you "W2 blade, 416ss fittings, curly maple handle" that's in your gallery of your site. What dye/color of Fiebings and steel wool did you use? If you don't mind me asking..

Not sure if it's the lighting , but, It looks similar to what I'm trying to achieve.
 
daizee said:
You're going to tear off the handles on a $350 custom knife and make your own?
What would Winkler charge to replace the scales to match the axe you ordered?
Click to expand...

Haha noooo. I'm going to the local woodcraft store and buying maple blanks. I'll be making this from scratch and ditching the black scales to put on my crkt t-hawk. I'm trying to match the maple, to the maple scales of my belt knife
 
ERRN said:
Is the stain you have the color you want? Using the knock back technique, you can repeat it until the desired figure pop you want is achieved, but still have the color you like. Other than that, you have to add darker dyes to the undercoat, and that changes the dynamics of how the color shape play when overlapped. I'd test on scrap. That said, I can usually get extremely 3D figure in big leaf and European flame maples on guitars repeating the application and sand back method. When someone wants truly darkened flame with a color over it, I use much darker colored dye to wash the grain with, sand back, and then put the lighter pigmented finish coats over that. If you want blackened flame with blood red, you'll have to do a darker treatment to darken the flame first.
Click to expand...

Ok, that's making sense. I might end up trying this. What brand/dyes do you recommend?
 
RayseM said:
Coloring wood is a challenging business and the desired results are often elusive. Getting the right color is a trial and error process that often requires 3 or 4 colors (dyes or stains) to work from and multiple samples. I've done as may as 20+ samples trying to achieve perfect matches. Fortunately you don't need a "perfect" match. The secret to success is to make certain that your samples are of the same material AND just as sanded and clean as to the same level as your intended finish piece. If you don't properly prep your samples you will never know the final results until you do the final piece.

Dyes can look incredibly different when first applied - browns can be very yellow for example - and you can't know the end color until you process all the way through to your final coat of finish. Stains are more revealing of the potential color. As ERRN writes above you can knock back to dark a stain by waiting at least overnight then sanding to lighter or by wiping with mineral spirits when the stain is still wet. You can also establish some control and some grain highlighting (pop) by applying a coat of thinned Boiled Linseed Oil or WATCO oil. This seals the more porous grain so that the stain doesn't over darken. Mixing stains of the same brand is an option too but be sure to mix enough to complete the job. Nearly impossible to mix spoonfuls and then duplicate the final effect.

Bottom line is to be patient with the process - prep work, drying times between coats, sanding and cleaning between coats. Don't sand stain unless you are trying to change the color - sand before stain and after between coats of finish. AND don't beat yourself seeking perfection in the color. Get close and be happy. Why beat yourself up. Good luck.

Ray
Click to expand...


I'm literally torn between AquaFortis, Behlen stain, and Fiebings dye. Does maple wood work better with one or the other? And what do you find works easier/best for you? I like the knock back option and I feel like stain is easier and more forgiving?

But, just google image searching, that AquaFortis looks damn good in some pictures, and as I understand it, It will darken with time. But, I'm worried I can't get it dark enough. I've read that it will stop reacting after about 3 coats.
 
I vote for the feibings leather dye. Especially not having a lot of woodworking experience. Wear gloves or it will look like your fingers tore through the tp.
I don't like wood stain with figured wood. Tends to finish blotchy.
With dye I would go a shade or two darker than you want. Then lightly sand with 600 grit till you like the shade.
Finally a clear top coat.
 
Burl Source said:
I vote for the feibings leather dye. Especially not having a lot of woodworking experience. Wear gloves or it will look like your fingers tore through the tp.
I don't like wood stain with figured wood. Tends to finish blotchy.
With dye I would go a shade or two darker than you want. Then lightly sand with 600 grit till you like the shade.
Finally a clear top coat.
Click to expand...

Looks like I'll be going with Fiebings then. What clear cost do you recommend? I want it finished in as matte as possible. I also ordered a bottle of Aquafortis as well
 
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