End Mill recommendations

Willie71

Willie71

Warren J. Krywko
Joined
Feb 23, 2013
Messages
12,214
I set up my mill a couple weeks back, and bought a selection of cheap end mills to try it out. Well, they were cheap, not only in price. I am going to purchase some better end mills but the information is so overwhelming. Prices from $5.00 to hundreds of dollars. I have googled a lot, but I really don't know where to start. Any advice for a total newb? I am basically using the mill to cut guard slots and fullers.
 
Keep an eye on ebay for high quality carbide end mills in the requisite sizes. I've been buying "Best Carbide" brand stub length 4 flut TiALN coated 1/8 and 3/16 for about $8 each from Best Carbide lately from a seller named "toolguys2" and been thrilled with them. Find them to be on par with any of the more recognizable brands or better.


Shoot me a PM if you want a link, don't want to violate any rules.


Once you learn the terminologies and the "brands" to look for, you can get premium tooling very cheap, if you buy retail, you'll get raped.
 
Carbide can be a bit tricky, but smaller sizes in HSS are usually fairly easy. Niagara is one of the big names, and their cutters come silly sharp nowadays (I've watched their grinding get better and better over the years). They tend to be the "house brand" at mcmaster carr.

+1on EBay is good for carbide. I've picked up the few I have slowly over the years, some of them there. Sometimes you can have luck with Craigslist.

Make sure to calculate your cutter speeds and use coolant of some type :)

Those two things are critical for tool life and surface finish.
 
Those TiAlN coated cutters I mention specifically because of their excellent performance cutting dry, FWIW.

Great carbide is available from many small outfits now here in the US now. There's a huge number of shops that have the requisite equipment to make all sorts of specialty cutter configurations and coatings, and there seems to be a lot of competition among them.


I'm not recommending import cutters at all, and I'm not talking about economy brands, however there are many players in the carbide field that offer better products than the old school "name" brands in end mills like Niagara. Don't get me wrong, it's still great stuff, and when I'm searching for large cobalt cutters I regularly look out for old stock Niagara, Putnam, Fastcut, Weldon, etc. etc. I just personally don't think it's the best value in small carbide tooling.

Anyway, not trying to be contradictory, so I hope it's not taken that way.
 
Cheap Chinese end mils Suck!

I use 2 flute solid carbide from 1/16" to 1/4". Order from MSC when they have 30-40% off.
 
I'm finally at a normal keyboard for once. I wanted to type a better reply but it's hard to do on a smartphone in the shop.

I agree with you on the smaller carbide companies. Carbide is so popular nowadays, and the quality so high, that it is almost an entirely different beast compared to when I first started purchasing tooling.

The good news is that you can do well second hand, especially if you stick to domestic manufacture.

I've done some dry cutting myself, but it is an iffy proposition for a beginner I think. If you get your feeds and speeds right, that is half the battle, but it can be touchy with tool life if you don't dial in right, plus it can have a lot to do with heat load on the part, especially larger cutters with smaller parts, and also things like deep pocketing operations, such as cutting a guard slot. You can always creep down, and blow out the slot (which you probably would kind of do anyways), but I think a novice would have better luck with some type of spray or flood, or even just oil dripped/brushed into the area by hand.


Willie, just so you know, I've been using the same 1/8" HSS Niagara end mill to cut 416ss guard slots since I started making knives. It's a double ended Niagara that I think cost me about $12-13. You could get a premium carbide 1/8" diameter/shank carbide 4 flute from McMaster-Carr for $10 uncoated/$12 with your choice of coating.

Depending on how thick your blades go (might need 5/32", 3/16", etc.), a simple 1/8" carbide end mill should last you months if you're not doing more than a few guards a week. So as far as the guard slotting goes, I definitely recommend that. You're pretty much good for $20 including an extra for spare. Stuff from McMaster is usually top notch, their carbides are often ultratool, which is a good brand and USA made, in fact they were one of the first to make truly decent carbide IMO. Very good grind quality. For $10 it's hard to argue.

I agree with Don completely, this is NOT an area to skimp. I would hammer nails in with a spoon before I bought a cheap end mill. It is just plain a huge waste of everything.



Either way, Javand, I completely agree with you, there are many terrific smaller suppliers of cheaper high quality tooling. For what he needs, though, a simple $20-30 McMaster-Carr order may be enough, or maybe $50-60 for a good starter set of knife-centric end mills.

Willie, if you share some more details of what you'll be doing, I'd be happy to assemble a short list of part numbers with explanations and email it to you.
 
Agree Ian, although it's worth mentioning, from the novice perspective, that intermittent cooling of carbide cutters is more likely to ping them, than no coolant at all.


Big issue is that most guys using small bench mills and mill/drills, don't have coolant systems, although they're easy to rig.


So, I definitely want to just recommend having a few backups, since breaking carbide cutters is more likely when you're learning than wearing one out. Nothing worse than breaking an end mill to find out it's the only one small enough to finish your slot. ;)


Cobalt cutters are much more forgiving FWIW, but as Nathan has called me out on in the past, for these sized cutters, the added rigidity of carbide is almost mandatory.
 
I appreciate the suggestions. Thank you everyone. Ian that is very generous. My e-mail is wjkrywko@gmail dot com. I use a variety of steel thicknesses from 1/16 to 1/4". I have only done one dagger with a fuller, and messed it up royally (great excuse to do it in 1075 rather than 1084 now that I have my 1075 stock :)) I don't think I will do a lot of fullers for now, but maybe in the new year. I use brass, mild steel, and stainless for guards. I don't know the exact stainless as it is drops from metal supermarkets, but it isn't hardenable. I have done brass guards up to 1/2" thick, but most are under 1/4" thick.

I have been dripping cutting fluid into the cut, but will likely upgrade to a cooling system soon.
 
Can't think of much to add... I usually buy from Enco with a promo code or MSC when they do their 30% off sales. I still haven't had much luck with ebay yet... I think I just get overwhelmed with all the crap that's on there and spend so much time looking that it ends up being cheaper just going to a retail outfit.

Wish I had ebay figured out like Javan does.

I'd recommend you go to a known ss for guards. There are a lot of ss out there that are a pita to machine. The 300 series is the most common in fab shops, and unless you have 303 that has sulphur added to make it machinable, they're a pain, for me anyway. 416 machines almost as easily as mild steel, especially if annealed. Random/unknown ss is a very difficult material to learn with, IMHO.
 
The SS is a bear to file. It work hardened horribly when drilling it or filing. Advice taken and I'll get some 416 SS. Iirc they said it was probably 316?? It was a while ago and I don't remember for sure. It isn't a knife steel for sure.
 
Are you using Center cutting end mills? Not all of them will drill the initial hole.
 
The package didn't specify center cutting, so I drilled holes and tried to cut across the slot. No good on that either. I will definitely get center cutting in future.
 
Willie,

Sorry for the delay. I've been slammed.

I'll do my best to get that list done for you this evening if you are still in need of it.
 
No rush for me. I have a fair bit on the go and won't likely order until after Christmas.
 
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