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Expandable Baton laws?
- Thread starter drjones
- Start date
- Joined
- May 1, 2000
- Messages
- 2,259
PC 12020 prohibits possession of a "billy," but doesn't define "billy." It is generally accepted that a baton, expandable or otherwise, would fall into this category. Since it's not clearly defined, if you have anything, e.g., in your car, that could be considered to be a "billy" you could find yourself in trouble. While you could get away with a big flashlight or (car locking) Club, and maybe even a lug wrench/tire iron, a baseball bat (sans other baseball paraphernalia), ax handle, or similar item could likewise get you busted.
Look up CA laws here: http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/calaw.html
Look up CA laws here: http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/calaw.html
apologies for reviving this thread but I have a similar query...
I am visiting California in the near future. I wish to buy an expandable baton and bring it out of the USA. Is it legal to buy one in a brick and mortar store in California? Can internet sales companies ship my order to California?
Thanks.
I am visiting California in the near future. I wish to buy an expandable baton and bring it out of the USA. Is it legal to buy one in a brick and mortar store in California? Can internet sales companies ship my order to California?
Thanks.
They are a felony to posess in CA. (For the serfs, I mean...)
I live in CA and had no problem at all getting one shipped to me, however.
[/B]
A felony? That sounds bad.
I would have it sent to my relatives in CA and the recipient will be in their name. Would my relatives encounter any problems? What if I have the package named after me with my relative's address. I guess I do not want my relatives to be in trouble.
Moreover, would it help if I do not take it out of the package whilst I transport it in my luggage so that I can easily explain that I am bringing it out of CA. (I do not want to be detained nor the baton to be confiscated).
TIA.
I got caught carrying one of these (In my back pocket) in Sacramento, California..
Felon Weapon Possession, I got lucky and the judge dropped it to misdemenor because I told him I didn't know it was a felony, And that I had bought it at a store in California, so how could they sell it if it was a felony?
But yeah, Only cops get to have these in the golden state ..
Felon Weapon Possession, I got lucky and the judge dropped it to misdemenor because I told him I didn't know it was a felony, And that I had bought it at a store in California, so how could they sell it if it was a felony?
But yeah, Only cops get to have these in the golden state ..
- Joined
- Aug 24, 1999
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- 2,271
I beg to differ
I don't know about CA but in Canada batons are not technically illegal...however, you better have a good explanation for carrying one (e.g. scary dog on your street)...my Strider RDT might be a little harder to explain (hey, you never know when a falling tree might attack you
)RL
)...but once it locks open, the head stays put.
- Joined
- Jun 20, 2001
- Messages
- 292
I believe that kubatons are also a no-no in Kali. I just left sandiego afte 3 1/2 yrs. and I know that one person was told by the police to loose the kubaton.
Kali is actually ok for knife laws, although I think LA and SF have their own knife laws that are stricter than the state.
How about OC ? I think that is ok, but guns, batons, chucks, and the whole menu of SD items is not ok in the used-to-be golden state.
Kali is actually ok for knife laws, although I think LA and SF have their own knife laws that are stricter than the state.
How about OC ? I think that is ok, but guns, batons, chucks, and the whole menu of SD items is not ok in the used-to-be golden state.
- Joined
- May 3, 2001
- Messages
- 368
I think it's doubtful that kubatons are generally illegal in California.
California Penal Code Section 12020 bans possession of, in part: "...any instrument or weapon of the kind commonly known as a blackjack, slungshot, billy, sandclub, sap, or sandbag." I think it would be a stretch to fit a small palm stick such as a kubaton into the definition of "billy," and they are clearly not blackjacks, saps, slungshots, sandclubs, or sandbags.
Section 12020 also bans "metal knuckles", which are roughly defined as something worn on or in the hand which cushions the force of a blow (as to the hands) or concentrates the force (as to the recipient of a strike). The term includes a projection from the hand. Thus, a koppo stick (kubaton with straps allowing it to be worn) is probably a type of illegal "metal knuckles," but a kubotan, which is simply grasped and not worn, probably is not.
Plastic knuckles are also controlled, but only as to the importation for commercial sale or offering for commercial sale (Section 12020.1). So a plastic or wooden koppo stick would probably be OK.
However, many police and sheriff departments have a policy of arresting anyone who tells them an item is carried as a "weapon" (offensive or defensive), and/or confiscating the item. This is probably based on local law, such as Los Angeles Municipal Code Section 55.01, which states:
"SEC. 55.01. CONCEALED WEAPONS PERMIT.
No person, except a peace officer shall wear or in any manner carry
concealed upon his person, any loaded or unloaded gun, pistol or revolver, or any other dangerous or deadly weapon permitted to be carried by law without having, at the same time, actually in his possession, and upon his person an unexpired permit so to do issued by the Board of Police Commissioners."
Violation is a misdemeanor. So for any cities and counties in California that have a similar law (you can search for yourself on the web; try, for example www.amlegal.com's Online Library), a kubaton might be considered "illegal." But the L.A. law is worded somewhat vaguely and is not a statewide law. Practically-speaking, most citizens caught with a kubaton in a jurisdiction with such a local law would have their kubaton confiscated. But that's not to say all: some would be arrested and possibly charged. I'm using a lot of weasel words such as "probably," because the outcome of an encounter with law enforcement while in possession of a kubaton is uncertain.
I just did a quick seach of California case law on the subject and didn't find anything.
If I've overlooked any law, please respond with specifics.
Regards,
Johnny
California Penal Code Section 12020 bans possession of, in part: "...any instrument or weapon of the kind commonly known as a blackjack, slungshot, billy, sandclub, sap, or sandbag." I think it would be a stretch to fit a small palm stick such as a kubaton into the definition of "billy," and they are clearly not blackjacks, saps, slungshots, sandclubs, or sandbags.
Section 12020 also bans "metal knuckles", which are roughly defined as something worn on or in the hand which cushions the force of a blow (as to the hands) or concentrates the force (as to the recipient of a strike). The term includes a projection from the hand. Thus, a koppo stick (kubaton with straps allowing it to be worn) is probably a type of illegal "metal knuckles," but a kubotan, which is simply grasped and not worn, probably is not.
Plastic knuckles are also controlled, but only as to the importation for commercial sale or offering for commercial sale (Section 12020.1). So a plastic or wooden koppo stick would probably be OK.
However, many police and sheriff departments have a policy of arresting anyone who tells them an item is carried as a "weapon" (offensive or defensive), and/or confiscating the item. This is probably based on local law, such as Los Angeles Municipal Code Section 55.01, which states:
"SEC. 55.01. CONCEALED WEAPONS PERMIT.
No person, except a peace officer shall wear or in any manner carry
concealed upon his person, any loaded or unloaded gun, pistol or revolver, or any other dangerous or deadly weapon permitted to be carried by law without having, at the same time, actually in his possession, and upon his person an unexpired permit so to do issued by the Board of Police Commissioners."
Violation is a misdemeanor. So for any cities and counties in California that have a similar law (you can search for yourself on the web; try, for example www.amlegal.com's Online Library), a kubaton might be considered "illegal." But the L.A. law is worded somewhat vaguely and is not a statewide law. Practically-speaking, most citizens caught with a kubaton in a jurisdiction with such a local law would have their kubaton confiscated. But that's not to say all: some would be arrested and possibly charged. I'm using a lot of weasel words such as "probably," because the outcome of an encounter with law enforcement while in possession of a kubaton is uncertain.
I just did a quick seach of California case law on the subject and didn't find anything.
If I've overlooked any law, please respond with specifics.
Regards,
Johnny
Two cases from the Corpus Christi Caller-Times:
"100 Leming Avenue: Police said they found a baton in a car glove box during the arrest of a 30-year-old man. Officers said they were arresting the man on a San Patricio County warrant.
Legan Lane/Ray Ellison Drive: A 28-year-old man was arrested during a traffic stop after police saw a club between the driver and passenger seat of the man's car."
Ironically a concealed or unconcealed longarm is legal in TX as long as one isn't a 'prohibited posessor'.
"100 Leming Avenue: Police said they found a baton in a car glove box during the arrest of a 30-year-old man. Officers said they were arresting the man on a San Patricio County warrant.
Legan Lane/Ray Ellison Drive: A 28-year-old man was arrested during a traffic stop after police saw a club between the driver and passenger seat of the man's car."
Ironically a concealed or unconcealed longarm is legal in TX as long as one isn't a 'prohibited posessor'.