Extreme Cold Army sleeping bag

J

jscalia

Joined
Dec 11, 2006
Messages
126
Does anyone know if the army issue "Extreme Cold Sleeping bag" works to its -30F rated temperature? I have had one for 15 years but never had a chance to test it in very cold weather.
 
I used both the old army type II arctic bag and the newer extreme cold weather clothing system sleeping bag when I was stationed in Alaska. I did "sleep" with both bags at -30 F on several occasions. However, there is a huge difference between sleeping relatively snug and comfortable and keeping you alive. They do work at that temperature, but those were some pretty cold and uncomfortable nights. A polar fleece sleeping bag liner, fresh winter socks or booties, a wool watch cap or balaclava, poly pro glove liners, poly pro long johns, and a thick closed cell sleeping mat helped to make the situation alot better at that temperature or below.
 
Mine are the older style with wolf fur ruff. 10f degrees is the coldest I have used mine. With a wool cap (tanker helmet liner), a thin Nylon and down liner bag, and wool socks, I had to vent the bag to keep from overheating. Dunno about minus temps. I will second the idea that a good insulating pad makes a lot of difference.

Codger
 
Hey, guys. How about some pictures of these cool sleeping bags? Especially the Modern Army version.

Houdini: Did you dig out a shelter to help protect you while enclosed in the sleeping bag? You didn't mention one but I assume you did not just lay the bag out in the open.


Thanks,

ADF
 
ADF,

I spent time in canvas 10 man tents, debries huts covered in snow, and out in the open in snow trenches a couple of times. The 10 man tents with a yukon stove were obviously the warmest because of the stove. However, we had to maintain a fire watch which caused about two hours less sleep each night. Without a stove or fire, the debries huts were the best way to go. We would cover them with about a foot of snow and stuff them with dry grass, leaves or pine/spruce needles. Once inside, we would use our rucksacks or a bag filled with snow to plug the entrance and seal it up. I usually could find dry grass, needles and leaves in the "wells" created under trees in heavy snow; but sometimes it took some work. The debries huts worked pretty well once in our sleeping bags. Getting out in the morning and dressed could be an adventure. Once out of the bag, we didn't dilly dally about getting dressed. Obviously, sleeping out in the open in a trench was the worst and is to be avoided if possible at that temperature. We were forced to do this in controlled situations to prove that our sleeping bags would work to keep us alive in the cold and give us confidence in our equipment. It did work, but I was pretty cold and didn't get much sleep if any. Also, with both types of sleeping bags, I would pull the draw string tight to make an opening about the size of a silver dollar to breath through and always used a closed cell sleeping mat. The draw string was easier to tighten down on the old type II bag. I hope this helps some.

Houdini
 
I have a moderate cold weather bag and an extreme cold weather bag both bought on ebay. I find them very comfortable because of the cotton constuction. I am a very warm sleeper so at around 20oF the moderate bag is plenty warm and the extreme bag is way too much. I haven't yet used he extreme bag in low temps so no opinion yet. I try to eat something like cheese and salami or a choclate bar before I go to sleep so the furnace inside me stays lit all night.

I would like to own one of the new sleep systems or maybe the Dutch version. I don't use the moderate bag if rain is at all possible since it takes days to dry out.
 
The Army is switching out sleep systems (again) so there are a lot of the "old" versions hitting the streets now (2 bags in a woodland camo bivy sac). Good bags and it's nice to be able to use only one bag for certain temps, adds a lot of flexibility and can reduce weight when needed.

I've seen them locally for as low as $70 now. Worth checking around some.

It's like the one on this auction (I have nothing to do with the auction but he has some good info posted).

http://cgi.ebay.com/Military-Surplu...ryZ74712QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
 
Doc,

It was just an elongated hole in the snow down to bare earth. I think I covered it with a GI poncho, but it did little or nothing to hold in heat. It just kept any new snow fall off. The ECWCS bag is pretty versitile as discussed above. It had two sleeping bags that fit inside eachother, an insulated sleeping hat, insulated booties, and a gortex bivy bag. You can tailor it to just about any temperature from extreme cold to summer. I've seen some folks just use the bivy sack if the weather is fairly warm and they just want rain protection while sleeping out. $70 for one is a super deal. My CO lost his (stolen by some guy in another unit we thought). We got him another one real quick, but it cost him $135 in the form of a statement of charges. I hate thieves. That was back in 1995 when they just came out.
 
I have not read all of the posts. I can however vouch for the older style army mummy bag. It does work well. Some tips to follow however, Get a good ground pad. Also sleep in bag with minimal clothes on. Additionally a sleeping bag liner would be a great help as well, even if its just a ponch liner with zipper. The new army system as mentioned does work even better, but if your camping from a vehicle and weight is no issue stick with the old one, just follow those tips.
 
madborderman07 said:
. Also sleep in bag with minimal clothes on. .
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I have heard this my entire military career and have never understood it. I have slept in an old style intermediate bag in weather down to the teens. I was in my boxers and t shirt, woke up in the middle of the night freezing my butt off put on my PTs, socks and a stocking cap got back in my bag and slept warm as toast till morning. So how exactly does sleeping naked keep you warmer? Chris
 
Sleepinig naked or minimally clothed is good because your body sweats when u sleep, if you were cold in your bag then by all means ading clothes would get you warmer, yes. However, if you slept in your clothes and then got up in the morning u would have nothing else to put on, therfore being cold in the morning. From my days of tromping around the woods and building hooches to sleep in. Once in my fartsack I would drop my pants to my ankles and use my BDU top as a pillow an dhit the sack. Wearing a pt type cap is an excellent call as well since most of your body heat leaves thru your head anyhow. Maybe i did not explain my case very well, bottomline take it from experience its better to sleep with minimal clothes on if that allows you to stay warm.
 
madborderman07 said:
Sleepinig naked or minimally clothed is good because your body sweats when u sleep, if you were cold in your bag then by all means ading clothes would get you warmer, yes. However, if you slept in your clothes and then got up in the morning u would have nothing else to put on, therfore being cold in the morning. From my days of tromping around the woods and building hooches to sleep in. Once in my fartsack I would drop my pants to my ankles and use my BDU top as a pillow an dhit the sack. Wearing a pt type cap is an excellent call as well since most of your body heat leaves thru your head anyhow. Maybe i did not explain my case very well, bottomline take it from experience its better to sleep with minimal clothes on if that allows you to stay warm.
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Are you saying, if you get out from under your sleeping bag you will feel cold relative to how you feel while in your sleeping bag? If I understand you right, your saying by putting on extra layers when you get out of bed, it sort of nutralizes the fact that you dont have a sleeping bag around u anymore?
 
I'm in the sleep almost naked crowd and have done so in military bags below 0degrees F for weeks.

The old extreme cold weather bags were great. However, too hot for many people (me included) at any temp above freezing, not as versatile as the new systems, and bulkier than the new ones. Not sure, but the old ones are also probably heavier.
 
ohen cepel said:
I'm in the sleep almost naked crowd and have done so in military bags below 0degrees F for weeks.

.
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Me too, when I do get cold, my polypros, socks and a beanie sure make a huge difference how warm I am in my bag. Chris

EDIT:The new sleeping system is really nice but bulky and heavy. I have found that with a thermarest, polypros, or better yet the new issue fleece, socks and a PT cap you can stay warm down to some impressive temps with just the patrol bag and bivy and carry less weight to boot.
 
IMO the older bags worked better than the MSS. Maybe it's just me. I've got the old ICW, ECW and the complete MSS, and think the older bags are warmer. Last winter I slept out a few nights when it was in the low 20s to test the bags out. First I went in the old ICW -- and sweated my nuts off. All I had on was my drawers and still had to vent the bag several times. I figured it being rated for 15 degress would leave it warm, but dang!

Sleeping the next night in the Black MSS Intermediate bag had me comfy. Not hot, not cold.

I will say the MSS is lighter than the old bags. I think the entire MSS weighs less than the ICW bag, and it certainly packs smaller. However, there's more shoulder room in the older bags. In the old bags I can roll over inside the bag, with the MSS, the bag rolls with me (which I'm told is how mummy bags are supposed to be).

For comfort, I actually prefer the older bags. If I'm car/canoe camping, I bring them. If backpacking, then I prefer the lighter MSS.

ETA, the above poster is right, you can get away with a lot if you wear appropriate clothing with the patrol bag and bivy. Cover up your heat sinks -- wool cap on head, mittens on hands, drawers on, and wool socks on your feet.
 
runningboar said:
I have heard this my entire military career and have never understood it.
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The answer is that you want to create an "heat bubble".
Sure putting on clothing adds layers, but at some point it has drawbacks.

Example is: say you sleep with your jacket on, sleeve's insulation will prevent your torso from heating your arm, so your arm might be colder.

Keeping clothing on might create "compartments" that are individually colder than what you could achieve if kept together.
That's why mittens are warmer than gloves of same thickness.

Now at which point the "compartment" problems becomes more important than the benefit of additionnal layers is still debatable.
 
The coldest I've had my extreme cold bag in was -14F. I was in long johns, wool socks, and a knit cap. I stayed warm until I had to get up in the middle of the night to answer nature's call....
 
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