fiberglass resin

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Mar 10, 2013
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Does anyone know any brand of fiberglass resin that dries clear? I've been trying to make burlap micarta and the resin I'm using dries to an amber color. It's working nice butI want the true color of the burlap to show. I've also tried epoxy resin but after three or four attempts I can't get it to set right.
 
Haven't made any homemade micarta yet, but in my searching for clear resin (I did't like the yellow tint I was seeing on some people's homemade stuff), I found the following possible options::

EasyCast - available at Michael's
AeroMarine Clear Epoxy Resin for Bar Tops
Envirotex Lite - Environmental Technology 32-Ounce Kit Lite Pour-On, High Gloss Finish
Parks (Rust-oleum) Super Glaze Ultra Crystal Pour On Epoxy Finish Kit, Clear Gloss
Fiberglass Coatings, Inc Epoxy Table Top Resin, 1:1, 1 Gallon Kit, Cyrstal Clear, Self Leveling, UV Resistant, Parts A & B Included

Reviews on the products are mixed. Either people like the one they used or hated it. Lots of caveats about mixing the 2 parts EXACTLY 50:50, or else.
The envirotex product is reported to set very fast by a couple of reviewers.

Some reviews indicate a slight yellowish cast, but others claim its clear. I guess we'll just have to try them as see how they work for micarta making. Still researching to try to decide what to use.
 
I tried the epoxy coatings for bar tops and when pouring this thick it took like three days to cure at room temp. Then it was still tacky to touch and never lost that. I watched some youtube videos and they were using marine fiberglass resin so I went to the hardware and auto part store and got Bondo brand and Advanced auto's house brand and both set perfectly but discolored the burlap. When I look at some of the knives Fiddleback Forge is making(my inspiration) he has a very true burlap color. Andy gave me the name of the guy that makes his blanks but they were very expensive, so I thought I'd spend a bunch of money to try to save a buck... Anyway I'm sure someone here has the answer. I am happy with the darker colors I'm doing now, but Andy uses a light sage green color and mine came out more of an OD green.

Also to note I tried more than one brand of the thick set epoxy, one was the Pour on brand, and one was Sherwin Williams brand. Both did the same thing. The guy at Sherwin Williams said those products were meant to be layered gradually to achieve their thickness.
 
Am I the only one out there that has to find their own way to do everything? I've spent close to $200 to avoid spending $30 on premade scales. This must be a sickness.
 
Take a look at West System G/Flex epoxy. I too have had good results with the bondo brand, but noticed the discoloration. I have heard this is what the pros use. It's not cheap, though.
 
Am I the only one out there that has to find their own way to do everything? I've spent close to $200 to avoid spending $30 on premade scales. This must be a sickness.

Nope. I haven't spent as much on this as you, but I've made a few different blocks over the last few days.

I also don't care for the color of the resin, although it looks reasonable with the yellow burlap.

I've found Evercoat epoxy resin pigments to work quite well. I've got green, yellow, red and white. They all but totally get rid of the ugly color. As long as you can find a color pigment that you like, I recommend them.

Here's some burlap with green pigment, and some without.

HoiazH0.jpg


I did some with red pigment a little while ago and it came out a nice brick red. I used red shop towels. I'll try to remember to get a pic. I'm going to try the white later. That one has me curious.

Also made some burlap pin stock with uncolored resin to use with the green burlap. Should be a nice contrast.

xUWZzZN.jpg


Edit- btw, I have heard that bar top stays tacky, so I'm not surprised at your results. Is the West Systems the G-Flex? Thought it was something else. In any case, their product is one I plan to try.

Shadetree (what Fiddleback uses) is indeed very expensive for what you get, or that's how it seems. I too thought I could match it for less. I'm beginning to think that I was wrong. His product looks to have no bubbles or voids, can't imagine he'd sell much if it did. The thing about burlap, from what I've seen anyway, is that the large areas with no fabric are very effective at trapping air. Pressure alone doesn't seem to fix this (big surprise), so I'd guess he's using vacuum in some way. I'll figure it out in time (unless I get bored), but in the meantime, for my own purposes, finishing the scales with a topcoat of CA or a little resin should fix it. CA is probably a better candidate because it's so thin. The resin may be just thick enough that it won't fill the pits. Anyway, while Shadetree Custom Laminates is expensive, he's gotta cover materials and whatever he spent on R&D.

Another side note. A lot of people say that the fiberglass resin laminate isn't very durable. I disagree. Maybe not as durable as micarta, but I have some home made (canvas) from several years ago and it's held up to time, water and wd40 very well. I use it to make sanding blocks and have seen zero degradation. I can't make too many claims about it's strength as I haven't really tested it to destruction, but I've used canvas micarta from the knife supply places and, while different, the home made stuff seems to be a good product on its own merit. I believe that there are going to be crappy examples, and excellent examples of non-phenolic laminates as that is just the nature of home made anything. Get it right though and it is good stuff.

Edit2-

Here's the brick red "shop towel" stuff.

zROhVFe.jpg


You can see the resin color on the edges in the pic. I haven't ground down the excess yet. It pretty much matches the cloth, although I've noticed these towels bleed red so that may have further colored the resin. I think this will be a very durable chunk. It takes some effort to saw! There's still wax on the surface in the pic too so that'll have to be thoroughly cleaned. Acetone works well for this. Of course that's only an issue if your contouring leaves any surface area. I (figure 8) sand the block on sandpaper over granite to get it dead flat.
 
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I think a lot of folks use west System 105 resin and 207 hardener. Slow cure, hard when cured, crystal clear.
 
thanks Strigamort, that was very informative. I defiantly have some useable blacks and haven't had any trouble with voids. I'm just placing mine between two boards and clamping all sides. Generally making about a 6" x 12" slab. I really like the shop towels you did. I set up some corn and pine cones last night and they turned out okay. I'm still worried the corn will come loose though. Those did have some voids, but I expected that as I wasn't able to add pressure inside of the container I let them set in. I'll look for that product.

Thanks to everyone else as well.

I didn't contact Shadetree directly and am not complaining about his prices, I saw an auction of his on the bay and was expecting the burlap to be closer in price to regular g10. Also the size he was selling didn't suit my project, so between those two I decided to make this experiment. Besides, once I get it down I will save money in the long run.
 
It's important you get the ratio exactly right and mix very thoroughly. Like 4X more mixing than you'd think is really necessary because you're trying to get this stuff mixed up down to the molecular level. Otherwise some component of the epoxy won't fully react and will remain sticky.

You can get rid of a lot of the bubbles by using a slow set low viscosity resin (this lets the bubble rise to the top) and capping your mixing container and hitting it with a vaccum real quick a few times to pop the bubbles caused by mixing before using the epoxy.
 
doke,

+1 for Fiberglass Coatings Inc. You might not have one in your area, but you can always call the one here 727-327-8117. These guys have helped me on all kinds of projects over the years and I know the have clear resins like you are looking for. Make sure you tell the person you talk to what it is you are trying to do and what your equipment is.(some resins work better with/without vaccum, temp and humidity can also have an effect on cure time)

Good luck in your quest.

Jeff
 
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I too plan on trying the West Systems epoxies in the future.

I have however had decent results with the fiberglass resins. Here is some paper based that I just used to handle some paring knives for my wife.
w3QvDkn.jpg


Chris
 
Does anyone know any brand of fiberglass resin that dries clear? I've been trying to make burlap micarta and the resin I'm using dries to an amber color. It's working nice butI want the true color of the burlap to show. I've also tried epoxy resin but after three or four attempts I can't get it to set right.

I do not know of a fiberglass resin that can compete with epoxy resins. . .except in terms of cost.

Fiberglass with the MEK hardener is very economical but can be difficult and unforgiving to work with, and a well ventilated or outdoors work area is needed.

We use resins very similar to West Systems (two part aero-marine water clear and almost the viscosity of water) It is expensive but is necessary for a quality product in my experience.
 
Am I the only one out there that has to find their own way to do everything? I've spent close to $200 to avoid spending $30 on premade scales. This must be a sickness.

I think, almost by definition, you must be a bit ill to mess with this stuff. . .:thumbup:



. . .

Shadetree (what Fiddleback uses) is indeed very expensive for what you get, or that's how it seems. I too thought I could match it for less. I'm beginning to think that I was wrong. . .

. . .

We get that a lot. :D:thumbup:

It's important you get the ratio exactly right and mix very thoroughly. Like 4X more mixing than you'd think is really necessary because you're trying to get this stuff mixed up down to the molecular level. Otherwise some component of the epoxy won't fully react and will remain sticky.

I cannot agree with Nathan more. It is essential to measure and mix correctly and consistently. You will need two mixing containers, so you can mix-dump-scrape at least 3-4 times.
 
Thanks for the info fod, I didn't expect you to share that. Proprietary information and all that. :thumbup:

Definitely going to have to try the WS stuff.

Nathan, good point about mixing. I use 3 containers.

One for the resin and pigment

One for the MEK

And a black plastic ramen noodle tray to act as a bath

The resin cup gets a thorough mixing with the color of choice, then gets set aside.

The second cup gets 10 drops per once of resin. 9oz for burlap = 90 drops.

Then the MEK gets poured into the resin cup. To be on the safe side I pour some of resin back into the MEK cup, mix, then re-dump back into the second cup.

I mix the whole mess for a quick minute making certain that it's done well. Then the results are poured into the bath/tray.

With burlap the first strip gets soaked, then run between two fingers to remove the excess. Every other strip gets layed on dry.

Even with dry strips there is a lot of squeeze out, but not as bad as my old method of soaking every strip.

I haven't tried any form of vacuum yet, but that's a good idea. May have to rig up a mason jar with the brake bleeder.

Lastly, I wear two pairs of latex gloves. The top pair I strip off after lay up. Makes for a much cleaner process.
 
doke, I hope you don't mind me posting this in your thread.

I mentioned doing a block in white. The goal was for it to be something like ivory micarta. I used Evercoat white with waterproof fg resin. I wasn't sure if I should use white cloth, or off white. Didn't want a bright white end product. So far all of the pigments have colored the resin without much darkening, but white being white I decided to go with bright white cloth.

I'm undecided on the end color, but I'm pretty sure it'll be good. I'll need to see how it looks with the cloth layers ground. I'm hoping to see a little layering, but not too much if that makes sense.

Anyway, here's what it looks like. (don't mind all of the crap in the background)

NlBPucD.jpg


I think with a clear resin you'd get a really bright color which might be cool. I'm saving the rest of the white pigment for when I get a clear epoxy.
 
I'm a painter by trade and I have my Sherwin Williams rep looking into the products you have all mentioned. If he can get them that should mean they will be easily available to any of us as Sherwin has a pretty good coverage area. I don't mind others posting at all, it helps us all get better. I'll post when I have info from my buddy.
 
I was going to suggest that folks ask West which hardener will work best.. it is the hardener that colors the mix. The raw resin is generally the same, no matter what.
I think a lot of folks use west System 105 resin and 207 hardener. Slow cure, hard when cured, crystal clear.
 
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As for someone saying that "fiberglass" is not as strong as micarta, that is incomplete info. Epoxy based GRP and epoxy in general are VERY strong and very durable as long as they are used properly. I like to use the example of custom boat builders like Rybovich down herein Florida. THey still build boats from wood, but it is multi layer laminated wood stuff together with epoxy. They switched over to epoxy in the late 50's. I have heard stories that when they cut into an old 40-50 year old hull that has been properly maintained , the wood, epoxy etc looks like it was just laid up. That is after decades of pounding in the deep blue sea. Strength in laminates comes not only from the materials chosen but also from how well they are put together. This may sound counterintuitive, but the laminate with too much resin will be weaker than one with the proper lower ratio. The one problem that epoxy does have that you don't; really see with say vinyl ester or polyester resins is that it is sensitive to UZ light. Those super expensive custom "cold molded" wood boats I was talking about all have to be painted with crazy expensive boat paint like Awlgrip/Awlcraft to protect the resin.
 
Yeah the poly resin that I use is 100% waterproof, but I wasn't sure about UV, and chemicals. My knives see very little sunlight. As I mentioned, it seems very resistant to mineral oil (wd40).

Ratio of resin and material is a tough one. I've gotten pretty good at minimizing squeeze out and usually run out of material before resin, but I do that by design.

I haven't cut or ground into the white block yet so I don't know for sure how saturation went, but I'd guess from experience that it's good. One thing I noticed, and I'm not sure if you can tell in the pic, is that there are some single ply pieces around the edges. I waited 24 hours and messed with those single layers just for fun, and because I was curious. Those layers are tough! Seems to be a great combination of strength and toughness. Sort of like stretching silly putty, if you bend it really fast you can get it to break, but do it more slowly and it bends. It's quite stiff for being so thin. With the 20 (or so) layers I can't flex it, and it clacks (for lack of a better term) when struck against something hard. If it was softer I imagine it would have a more muted sound. 10 drops of hardener (as prescribed by the instructions) seems to be right.

It's worth mentioning that I use 3 or 4 of those trigger clamps that you get at HF. I use the small ones and squeeze the trigger about 3 times after it contacts the press. Before doing that, I give the press a firm pressing just using my hands, wait a few minutes, then clamp em up. I used to use a vise, but that was too difficult to measure clamping force. At times it would be too much pressure and I'd get dry spots.

I'll post a pic of what I use.

Clamped up (be sure to measure each corner to insure that you are getting an even press)

SdaRc8m.jpg


Tools

yVLsIfW.jpg
 
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