First Tactical Tomahawk? Which RMJ for Hurricane Survival kit?

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dfsutton

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All,

I've been doing a bit of research on tactical tomahawks. From everything I've read it seems that RMJ tactical tomahawks are considered to be among the top of the line if not the top of the line among tactical tomahawks. I appreciate the designs of the RMJ line but do not feel comfortable spending $400 on a tomahawk in order to test if i like one or not. However, the money I spend I would prefer to be a good investment and not a waste of money. After looking around, I have found two hawks that seem to approximate the design (one is a Johnson design) of the RMJs and also are a quality piece. One is the CRKT Kangee and the other is the Benchmade 172 Forged Hawk. I was wondering if you all had experience with both these hawks. Which would you recommend if any? Why would you recommend one or the other? And finally, would I be better off just saving for an RMJ?
 
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The Kangee isn't bad. My biggest grip would be the extended pommel, vibration forces transfer right into my hand there. The handle is also fatter than my Jenny Wren, just so you know, I prefer the JW's handle thickness. I also prefer the straight shaft of the JW, makes using either end feel the same.

I don't own the Benchmade, but it's a breaching hawk, the edge is too thick for chopping wood. I have used my Kangee a bit on wood, I wouldn't take it camping, but I'm sure it would be better than the Benchmade for that purpose.
 
foxx said:
The Kangee isn't bad. My biggest grip would be the extended pommel, vibration forces transfer right into my hand there. The handle is also fatter than my Jenny Wren, just so you know, I prefer the JW's handle thickness. I also prefer the straight shaft of the JW, makes using either end feel the same.

I don't own the Benchmade, but it's a breaching hawk, the edge is too thick for chopping wood. I have used my Kangee a bit on wood, I wouldn't take it camping, but I'm sure it would be better than the Benchmade for that purpose.
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Ok. Thanks for the info. I'm not looking for a breaching only tomahawk.

I guess I'm really looking for a utilitarian style hawk. I live in New Orleans and was looking for one that could be used in the aftermath of a hurricane. I could see myself needing to use it to breach doors or possibly a roof, to chop wood or branches, or to use it in defense if necessary. Given that, would would you guys recommend?
 
RMJ's are a much better hawk than the CRKT. It's not just asthetics, it's performance, cutting edges, steel, differential HT, nicer kydex. If I had to have a hawk during an emergency, I'd want my RMJ Jenny Wren or my Winkler Camp Axe. I'd trust either one with my life.
With the Kangee, you get what looks like cutting edges under the spike and the beard, yet they are fake, not even false edges, just ground so they they look like it in a photo. Maybe my example is just not ground well, I hope that others are better, just don't know.
OTOH, if I'm going into the back yard to mess around, I take my SOG Fasthawk, the Kangee, or my GG&G Battlehawk. Each of those have held up to throwing, cutting through a steel chair, and beating up some old fence posts. Of those three, the Kangee cuts into wood the best, but not real well. Again, the Kangee is not a bad hawk, especially for just over $100.
 
foxx said:
RMJ's are a much better hawk than the CRKT. It's not just asthetics, it's performance, cutting edges, steel, differential HT, nicer kydex. If I had to have a hawk during an emergency, I'd want my RMJ Jenny Wren or my Winkler Camp Axe. I'd trust either one with my life.
With the Kangee, you get what looks like cutting edges under the spike and the beard, yet they are fake, not even false edges, just ground so they they look like it in a photo. Maybe my example is just not ground well, I hope that others are better, just don't know.
OTOH, if I'm going into the back yard to mess around, I take my SOG Fasthawk, the Kangee, or my GG&G Battlehawk. Each of those have held up to throwing, cutting through a steel chair, and beating up some old fence posts. Of those three, the Kangee cuts into wood the best, but not real well. Again, the Kangee is not a bad hawk, especially for just over $100.
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Think you may have gotten a bad example, Foxx. Mine has a sharpened beard, just not knife sharp. And let's be honest, I don't think anything is going to break the GG&G hawk. That thing is a BEAST!
 
I have both hawks, and the Kangee is the better overall hawk. Foxx is right about the Benchmade being a breacher, pure and simple. I thinned the edge on mine to process wood, but it was slow going so as not to screw up the temper. Mine is made from 1095, the newest 172 is made from 4140, same as RMJ is using. Should hold up better than the original model. I wouldn't carry it around camping, too heavy. But it'll make a great hawk for breaking out of any building you may be trapped in.
 
After looking at everything, I'm definitely not going to be buying the Benchmade hawk because I'm looking for one that is a bit more multipurpose and not just a breacher. At this point, I'm seriously considering buying an RMJ Hawk. The Shrike seems to be great at breaching but also fairly good for chopping and defense. I am also considering other models, but I don't know enough to make a good decision yet. The Kangee is still on the table, and I might just end up buying it along with an RMJ Hawk.
 
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dfsutton,

I also live in New Orleans, and was here during Katrina.

I own the Kangee, and it is a very nice hawk for the money. It could fill all the roles you mentioned. However, if you are looking for an ax to use to chop through a rooftop to escape rising water, I would get an Estwing 26 inch camper ax. If you need to get through a roof, you will probably need to get through quickly. It is only 40 bucks, so you could get both the Kangee and the Estwing and cover all your bases. Though honestly, that Estwing could fill the defensive roll pretty darn well also. That ax feels very light and nimble in the hand.
 
If you're only going to buy once, and you want the do-it-all 'hawk, I'd look very closely at the RMJ range. If you're only paying it once, might as well commit a little.

You'll be waiting awhile for it anyway, so it'll give you time to save up.
 
darkangel55555 said:
If you're only going to buy once, and you want the do-it-all 'hawk, I'd look very closely at the RMJ range. If you're only paying it once, might as well commit a little.

You'll be waiting awhile for it anyway, so it'll give you time to save up.
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The problem I'm having is not that I can't afford to buy an RMJ, but that I can't afford to buy the wrong RMJ for the cost.

The RMJ website is pretty lacking in information at this current point, so I can't even get good info on the exact specifics of each model. This combined with my total lack of experience and knowledge base its making this a difficult decision for me.
 
dfsutton said:
The problem I'm having is not that I can't afford to buy an RMJ, but that I can't afford to buy the wrong RMJ for the cost.

The RMJ website is pretty lacking in information at this current point, so I can't even get good info on the exact specifics of each model. This combined with my total lack of experience and knowledge base its making this a difficult decision for me.
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Here's what I know (and found for ya):

Jenny Wren
A light and fast hawk
Length: 11.5 inches
Weight: 18 oz.

Kestrel Feather
Same size as Kestrel, 2/3 thickness
Weight - 17.5 oz

Kestrel
A new Kestrel with 8 in. scales on the handle
Length: 13 inches
Weight: 25 oz.

S13 Shrike
A smaller, lighter Shrike for HSOs and pilots
Length: 13.5 inches
Weight: 21 oz.

Loggerhead
A Loggerhead hammer-poll hawk
Length: 15.5 inches
Weight: 27 oz.

Shrike
RMJ's first hammer-forged tomahawk
Length: 15.5 inches
Weight: 27 oz.

Eagle Talon
All-steel integral design with DuraCoat® finish
Length: 18 inches
Weight: 29 oz.

That's all from the site.

The Kestrels and the Eagle are in the same category, being a full-tang spike hawk with Duracoat handles on the sides only. The Shrikes and Loggerhead have rubber molded handles, which insulate the user from the steel, which is of value when cutting into potentially live cables or equipment.

This thread has some good photos of the newer RMJs. The Berserker and Storm Crow have not yet made it to the website. Both are slightly less breaching-oriented, which could be said for the Jenny Wren as well with its head sharpened on all edges.

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/997995-What-RMJ-hawk-fits-YOU-best

If you are getting a 'hawk as a contingency against post-disaster urban environments, I would not recommend anything heavier than 20-25oz. I have a 2lb hawk from Hardcore Hardware and chopping branches (or any other prolonged repetitive motion) will really do a number on your wrist. You may find yourself crawling/swimming/climbing, and the less weight you have the more likely you are to survive these activities intact. If you expect to need insulation, the S13 would probably work for you. Of course, shrink wrapping the handles would work just as well, as would wearing gloves. The Jenny Wren is easy to carry everywhere, and if that means you are more likely to have it on you in the event of an emergency, then so be it.

Personally, I favour spike hawks over hammer polls or chisel blades such as on the Loggerhead and Berserker respectively. If I need a hammer, I use the pommel, or I use the top of the 'hawk (not as feasible with the Jenny Wren). Results may vary.

The CRKT Kangee and Chogan are quite well-designed and solidly constructed, should budget be a major constraint. They are admittedly quite heavy.

In terms of alternatives to RMJ, the Benchmade 172 (design eerily reminiscent of the K5) is more breaching-oriented, at the expense of weight and cutting ability. The reverse is true for Daniel Winkler's 'hawks, which value cutting over smashing. In the same price range, Omnivore Bladeworks make a very nice range of outdoors-oriented 'hawks, with many sharp edges and an excellent sheath design, though potentially at the expense of rock-crushing ability.

Hope this helps!
 
Ryan Johnson said he let some Marines test out some hawks. Most of them said they would choose the Jenny Wren. The size and weight are better for carrying, yet it can still do many of the same tasks.
There's never going to be a "perfect" hawk for all chores. I have a JW because I can carry it. I wore mine under a button down shirt, while bowling. None of my friends even noticed that I had it on me.

If you carry it everyday, and end up using it for a few minutes, or not at all, then the weight is nice. If you are going to breach doors everyday, maybe a more stout hawk would be better?

The JW is short, I'm use to swinging a 13" hawk like the GG&G, the SOG Fasthawk, and the Winkler Sayoc and Camp Axe. When I swing the JW, I find I'm swing a couple of inches short of my intended spot. I need more practice time with it, even though I carry it reguarly.
 
Does anyone know the differences in head geometry between the Shrike, Eagle talon, and Kestrel and how that affects the function of the hawk?
 
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The lessons learned from natural disasters. I put a fire axe / pry bar in my attic after Katrina... even though it would take a 40 foot tide to reach that level lol.
I would think about a simple carpenters hatchet with a sheath. All steel like estwing or vintage with a wood handle.
The advantages are- cost/ very usefull and won't draw much attention. You could buy and build four bug out kits with the money you save.
JMO
 
I placed my order yesterday. Thanks for the info that everyone posted. Now the waiting game begins.
 
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