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fixed blade for ems/fire?
- Thread starter fdchase
- Start date
- Joined
- Feb 7, 2005
- Messages
- 2,892
I've worked in a SAR team and in relief operations (floods, fires, etc.) for a few years now, and I can tell you that I ALWAYS prefer a fixed blade over a a folder. They are faster to deploy, safer (there isn't a lock to fail) and stronger. Besides, a good quality fixed blade is usually cheaper than a comparable folder.
I work mostly outdoors, so my needs might be different from a guy who works mostly in the city. I've found a stout 4"-5" full tang drop point to be the best tool for my job. I've used smaller blades (like a BRK&T Mountaineer) and some guys in my team like bigger blades, I guess it depends on what you're used to. It's more important to have a knife you're really used to than having the best possible knife, IMHO.
If you're looking for a knife designed just for rescue, Spyderco makes some nice ones with good window punches (folders ARE safer to break windows with, using them closed, of course). I usually carry one clipped to my pocket in addition to the fixed blade which takes care of most of the chores.
Sometimes you can't carry everything you'll need (that's specially true when you're the first responder out of sheer bad luck or you're doing a long foot search), and the knives have to do things that they aren't really designed to do, that's why I like a good fixed blade that can take a beating but be compact enough to be out of the way.
Whatever kind of knife is used, visibility is a big plus. Orange G-10 is your friend! So are bright lanyards.
I work mostly outdoors, so my needs might be different from a guy who works mostly in the city. I've found a stout 4"-5" full tang drop point to be the best tool for my job. I've used smaller blades (like a BRK&T Mountaineer) and some guys in my team like bigger blades, I guess it depends on what you're used to. It's more important to have a knife you're really used to than having the best possible knife, IMHO.
If you're looking for a knife designed just for rescue, Spyderco makes some nice ones with good window punches (folders ARE safer to break windows with, using them closed, of course). I usually carry one clipped to my pocket in addition to the fixed blade which takes care of most of the chores.
Sometimes you can't carry everything you'll need (that's specially true when you're the first responder out of sheer bad luck or you're doing a long foot search), and the knives have to do things that they aren't really designed to do, that's why I like a good fixed blade that can take a beating but be compact enough to be out of the way.
Whatever kind of knife is used, visibility is a big plus. Orange G-10 is your friend! So are bright lanyards.
- Joined
- Dec 3, 2000
- Messages
- 2,998
Carrying fixed blades in EMS? In my experience....yes...it's safe, and yes it's practical.
the up points are that it's a much sturdier more foolproof blade that's easier to manipulate and clean gunk offa. (not necessarily from decontamination activities, but more like cutting food and such) On top of that, as long as a glass breakers not being used on it, there's also zero chance of a knife folding on your precious fingers.
As far as disadvantages, there's only a couple that come to mind.
first is comfort...fixed blades are just not nearly as comfortable as a folding knife under most circumstances. when I spent most of my days walking it was hard to find one that would ride okay with the suspender pack or O2 kit on my shoulder. If I was sitting most of the day, they wanted to find places to dig into then also. add the problem that it's often a REALLY good idea to conceal a fixed blade when you carry one on duty and the problem becomes more difficult. I know there's alot of really greath sheath makers, and knife designers out there, but as a rule...they're less comfortable.
Secondly is PERCEPTION PERCEPTION PERCEPTION. Believe it or not, EMT's are very much in the CARE and COMFORT business. and the fact is most of your patients aren't going to be knife people, or even if they are they are used to seeing knives, they may not be used to fixed blades on duty belts, it has a tendency to make them less comfortable. Also among your peers, alot of them will tend to not be knife knuts, and therefore will quickly brand you as a jackass "Rescue Ricky" type. the ER Department and Hospital Securiy wouldn't be a big fan of it either for the most part. I know these issues are silly, insipid, and basically kinda chickensh!t, but...they do exist. Best way around both of these issues is to conceal a fixed blade really, really well if that's what yer gonna carry.
Third issue is basically...the realities of the job. If it falls or gets knocked out of the sheath, that's an automatically sharp edge falling down, possibly towards a patient. Granted once again, a proper sheath helps eliminate these things, but sometimes things just snag... coats, straps, doorways, gurneys, etc. If you snag a knife handle on something wrong, it's just plain gonna come out, no matter how good the sheath is made.
It would be a VERY rare set of circumstances for me to choose a fixed blade personally, but...to each thier own. People in more specialized or unique areasa such as a Military Medic, SWAT Medic, Dive Rescue, etc. may very well have different needs, perceptions, and circumstances than those that I'm familliar with. Hell, I used to know a guy with Dive Rescue that kept a Beretta 92 with three extra mags in his dive bag. What for? I'll never know....
the up points are that it's a much sturdier more foolproof blade that's easier to manipulate and clean gunk offa. (not necessarily from decontamination activities, but more like cutting food and such) On top of that, as long as a glass breakers not being used on it, there's also zero chance of a knife folding on your precious fingers.
As far as disadvantages, there's only a couple that come to mind.
first is comfort...fixed blades are just not nearly as comfortable as a folding knife under most circumstances. when I spent most of my days walking it was hard to find one that would ride okay with the suspender pack or O2 kit on my shoulder. If I was sitting most of the day, they wanted to find places to dig into then also. add the problem that it's often a REALLY good idea to conceal a fixed blade when you carry one on duty and the problem becomes more difficult. I know there's alot of really greath sheath makers, and knife designers out there, but as a rule...they're less comfortable.
Secondly is PERCEPTION PERCEPTION PERCEPTION. Believe it or not, EMT's are very much in the CARE and COMFORT business. and the fact is most of your patients aren't going to be knife people, or even if they are they are used to seeing knives, they may not be used to fixed blades on duty belts, it has a tendency to make them less comfortable. Also among your peers, alot of them will tend to not be knife knuts, and therefore will quickly brand you as a jackass "Rescue Ricky" type. the ER Department and Hospital Securiy wouldn't be a big fan of it either for the most part. I know these issues are silly, insipid, and basically kinda chickensh!t, but...they do exist. Best way around both of these issues is to conceal a fixed blade really, really well if that's what yer gonna carry.
Third issue is basically...the realities of the job. If it falls or gets knocked out of the sheath, that's an automatically sharp edge falling down, possibly towards a patient. Granted once again, a proper sheath helps eliminate these things, but sometimes things just snag... coats, straps, doorways, gurneys, etc. If you snag a knife handle on something wrong, it's just plain gonna come out, no matter how good the sheath is made.
It would be a VERY rare set of circumstances for me to choose a fixed blade personally, but...to each thier own. People in more specialized or unique areasa such as a Military Medic, SWAT Medic, Dive Rescue, etc. may very well have different needs, perceptions, and circumstances than those that I'm familliar with. Hell, I used to know a guy with Dive Rescue that kept a Beretta 92 with three extra mags in his dive bag. What for? I'll never know....
- Joined
- Mar 2, 2000
- Messages
- 1,526
I often carry a Hobbits Fang fb hanging from my turnouts. Good for fires, as folders are hard to grab and hell to open with thick stiff ff gloves on.
Bad for ems. Not good to be leaning over one of our "customers" who has just been shot, stabbed, beat etc.
ymmv.
Bad for ems. Not good to be leaning over one of our "customers" who has just been shot, stabbed, beat etc.
ymmv.
thanks for the responses. i agree, perception is a big part. i have a hard time picturing an emt with a fixed blade showing. conceal completely, fanny pack, how would one carry it without drawing attention? obviously the bigger the less public friendly it will be.
for fire, where would one keep it in regards to turnout gear?
I have several good folders that i would consider reliable for these purposes but am just curious about how a fixed blade can fit into the fire/ems equation.
i appreciate the input so far. some good thoughts and insight.
for fire, where would one keep it in regards to turnout gear?
I have several good folders that i would consider reliable for these purposes but am just curious about how a fixed blade can fit into the fire/ems equation.
i appreciate the input so far. some good thoughts and insight.
- Joined
- Mar 2, 2000
- Messages
- 1,526
Mine hangs from the snap clip on my coat.
- Joined
- Dec 3, 2000
- Messages
- 2,998
As far as I was concerned in EMS, it wasn't so much finding anything EMS specific with a fixed blade as much carrying a decent knife as a simple EDC. Between trauma shears, cheap but effective plastic seatbelt cutters, and later on the BM Rescue hook I quickly found that I personally really had very little need for the...rescue specific style knives.
As far as how I carried them myself...I tried all sortsa things, with cargo pockets/pockets on my pants legs doing really well with most of them. I also used to have a pouch for shears, and gloves that my Lightfoot Mini Pit fit in the back of really well- Kept it easily accessible, reasonably concealed, and comfortable. (didn't like the knife though) I had an MOD Scorpion and a Hobbit Fang that fit in my Cargo pocket real well, and a Bud Nealy that I carried IWB a few times. Boot carry sucked, and neck carry was disagreeable for me. I really never carried anything with more than a 3.5 inch blade.
Also, I should probably be up front in stating there was never a true percieved "need" for the fixed blade, I just liked my knives, and liked to tinker around with different carry modes.
Once I got a little more serious, I left the fixed blades at home, just cause of the PITA factor.
As far as how I carried them myself...I tried all sortsa things, with cargo pockets/pockets on my pants legs doing really well with most of them. I also used to have a pouch for shears, and gloves that my Lightfoot Mini Pit fit in the back of really well- Kept it easily accessible, reasonably concealed, and comfortable. (didn't like the knife though) I had an MOD Scorpion and a Hobbit Fang that fit in my Cargo pocket real well, and a Bud Nealy that I carried IWB a few times. Boot carry sucked, and neck carry was disagreeable for me. I really never carried anything with more than a 3.5 inch blade.
Also, I should probably be up front in stating there was never a true percieved "need" for the fixed blade, I just liked my knives, and liked to tinker around with different carry modes.
Once I got a little more serious, I left the fixed blades at home, just cause of the PITA factor.
- Joined
- Jan 6, 2001
- Messages
- 4,399
fdchase said:
Here's a rescue tool made by our knifemaker friend, James McGowan (he's a firefighter). He makes them as shown for firefighters, and in black for LEO and EMS. A lot of thought and personal experience went into designing this tool. I have one in my collection. (photo by Murray White)
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