Frenzy Discontinued? Question for CS..

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insta9ves

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Apr 3, 2007
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Saw on the parking lot sales YT video where Lynn Thompson(gonna just call him LCT going forward) mentioned that Frenzy is being closed out because it hasn't been doing as well in the market.

Usually knife companies discontinue stuff based on the lack of demand, but they seldom share WHY? So my question to @coldsteelknives is if you guys have any kind process to do market research/post-mortem when a product has been discontinued due to lack of demand to understand why so that you can better predict market demand on any new product?

I do product management for a large company and we usually have a process to prevent a flop and if a product flops we wanna get to the bottom of it. This involves gathering data & feedbacks from partner/wholesaler/customers and also look at competitors and industry trends. Maybe you guys are doing these constantly, would love to get some insight if you are able to share. For example - Is the Frenzy not selling well because it's too large and people wanted a more edc-friendly length of folder? Is the color combination not popular in the industry?
 
That’s a freakin bummer. The frenzy is in my top two favorite CS blades ever. I didn’t care for it in pics but when I got my hands on it I realized what a genius design it is. A big but slim and light 5.5” wharncliffe blade with awesome steel and handles. More people should have given this one a chance.
 
The Frenzy is probably my favorite XL folder. The only thing I would change is the grind. The flat saber is very robust but sacrifices cutting performance. A hollow grind would transform the knife into a slicing machine!
 
insta9ves said:
Saw on the parking lot sales YT video where Lynn Thompson(gonna just call him LCT going forward) mentioned that Frenzy is being closed out because it hasn't been doing as well in the market.

Usually knife companies discontinue stuff based on the lack of demand, but they seldom share WHY? So my question to @coldsteelknives is if you guys have any kind process to do market research/post-mortem when a product has been discontinued due to lack of demand to understand why so that you can better predict market demand on any new product?

I do product management for a large company and we usually have a process to prevent a flop and if a product flops we wanna get to the bottom of it. This involves gathering data & feedbacks from partner/wholesaler/customers and also look at competitors and industry trends. Maybe you guys are doing these constantly, would love to get some insight if you are able to share. For example - Is the Frenzy not selling well because it's too large and people wanted a more edc-friendly length of folder? Is the color combination not popular in the industry?
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Not willing to go that far into our inner workings, very sorry. We only discontinue products due to poor performance, as any business model entails. Yes, even the Talwar, Mini Recon, etc were poor performers despite what's said today. Cannot go into enough detail to discuss why specific things don't do well.

oxman198 said:
That’s a freakin bummer. The frenzy is in my top two favorite CS blades ever. I didn’t care for it in pics but when I got my hands on it I realized what a genius design it is. A big but slim and light 5.5” wharncliffe blade with awesome steel and handles. More people should have given this one a chance.
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Agreed.

johnnywizzo said:
I should pick one up while they are still available.
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They'll probably be around for a while but, we do have them on sale right now during our Holiday Sale if you're feeling worried.

AF said:
The Frenzy is probably my favorite XL folder. The only thing I would change is the grind. The flat saber is very robust but sacrifices cutting performance. A hollow grind would transform the knife into a slicing machine!
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Changing the grind won't save it's sales numbers, I promise :p
 
Cold Steel Knives said:
Not willing to go that far into our inner workings, very sorry. We only discontinue products due to poor performance, as any business model entails. Yes, even the Talwar, Mini Recon, etc were poor performers despite what's said today. Cannot go into enough detail to discuss why specific things don't do well.
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That's understandable. I don't think most company share those details anyway. IMO as long as makers have a process it'll hopefully help increase the number of hits and reduce the misses.
It's odd about the Talwar and the Mini Recon 1, it's almost as if the model need to be discontinued in order to gain the cult following. There's also the matter of timing i guess, perhaps these kinda knives are only more widely accepted. I know that there's a trend towards smaller knives that's similar to Para 3 so the Mini Recon 1 could really compete well there. I personally think Mini Recon 1 being offered only in black blade contributed to its demise.
I think knife makers could gather these kinda data from their retailer. For example, perhaps they could reach out to large retailer like Knifecenter or BladeHQ and ask them for a relative sales number, e.g. what's the ration of the sales between Spyderco Para 3 with Satin blade vs Spyderco Para 3 with DLC blade. If the answer is for example, 3 satin blade for 1 DLC blade, then perhaps it could correlate how well the Mini Recon 1 in Satin would do since it's in the same target market.
Anyway, just rambling. Thanks for responding and engaging with us.
 
It seems like the Wharncliffe is a love hate thing and more seem to hate(in my experience anyway), I notice this with other knife makers also. The Frenzy and aluminum 6" TiLite are my EDC of choice much of the time.
 
insta9ves said:
That's understandable. I don't think most company share those details anyway. IMO as long as makers have a process it'll hopefully help increase the number of hits and reduce the misses.
It's odd about the Talwar and the Mini Recon 1, it's almost as if the model need to be discontinued in order to gain the cult following. There's also the matter of timing i guess, perhaps these kinda knives are only more widely accepted. I know that there's a trend towards smaller knives that's similar to Para 3 so the Mini Recon 1 could really compete well there. I personally think Mini Recon 1 being offered only in black blade contributed to its demise.
I think knife makers could gather these kinda data from their retailer. For example, perhaps they could reach out to large retailer like Knifecenter or BladeHQ and ask them for a relative sales number, e.g. what's the ration of the sales between Spyderco Para 3 with Satin blade vs Spyderco Para 3 with DLC blade. If the answer is for example, 3 satin blade for 1 DLC blade, then perhaps it could correlate how well the Mini Recon 1 in Satin would do since it's in the same target market.
Anyway, just rambling. Thanks for responding and engaging with us.
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Exactly this. It happens with every knife, demand drives popularity. The market is really bizarre sometimes.
 
I'm not an XL folder guy. Recon 1 is probably as big as I'll carry (for now, lol) so the Frenzy is a bit big for me. I think of wharnies as smaller utility blades. With that being said a Recon/Code 4 Wharnie might be cool.
 
BMCGear said:
I'm not an XL folder guy. Recon 1 is probably as big as I'll carry (for now, lol) so the Frenzy is a bit big for me. I think of wharnies as smaller utility blades. With that being said a Recon/Code 4 Wharnie might be cool.
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Same here, i own multiple of every cold steel folders 4” and under since 2010. Wished Cold Steel makes more folders in the 3-3.5” blade range.
 
I would have liked to have seen a 4" blade version of the frenzy with a drop point (or similar). I own at least 20 CS knives at this point. My one complaint is that most CS knives are very wide when closed. The Frenzy looked good in that regard, but way to big for me length wise. Maybe a future design Cold Steel? Hint Hint LOL.
 
Is it actually hard to understand why a 12" folder was not wildly popular? It's a niche product, at best. Many of us have larger knives that we like, but maybe don't carry often. This is a huge knife that I can't even imagine putting in my front pocket, let alone taking out in day to day life to use. Add to that it has a bright blue handle and "FRENZY" on the blade, and, well...
 
XL folders have a limited pool of buyers. They often don't stick around for long in the line up. I will say that the Frenzy carries better than any other knife of its size that I've experienced. It's completely unobtrusive in the the front pocket of my Levi's 505. It carries so well becuase it's narrow and lightweight. The G-10 is not rough, the clip is good and the knife slides easily in and out of pocket. I think it's the only knife I have a duplicate of. One is on display.
 
AF said:
XL folders have a limited pool of buyers. They often don't stick around for long in the line up. I will say that the Frenzy carries better than any other knife of its size that I've experienced. It's completely unobtrusive in the the front pocket of my Levi's 505. It carries so well becuase it's narrow and lightweight. The G-10 is not rough, the clip is good and the knife slides easily in and out of pocket. I think it's the only knife I have a duplicate of. One is on display.
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Many of the reviews I've seen say how easy it carries for such a large blade. Thats why I think a 4" blade version would have sold much better.
 
My favorite of all the CS mega folders.It's slender handle is comfortable to hold in any grip and every extended on the last few inches of the handle.As Lynn Thompson puts it to extend your reach.

Even better with a snaggle tooth wave installed

A quote from Cold Steel
"Designed by award-winning custom knife-maker Andrew Demko, the Cold Steel Frenzy takes its inspiration from ancient Japanese Kabutowari – with a thick spine, slender blade, needle-sharp piercing point and a long flat cutting edge."
 
jceckrosh said:
This is a huge knife that I can't even imagine putting in my front pocket, let alone taking out in day to day life to use.
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Yeah, that wouldn't fly with my day-to-day work activities. If I carried it I'd have to carry a second smaller blade to use in normal day-to-day life and reserve the frenzy for self defense I guess? I'm no knife fighter and don't generally carry more than one knife so...

I did like the blue handle however, I think a 3 inch version would be solid (so says the guy who's carrying a smaller locking wharncliffe right now).
 
I like the Frenzy a lot, but it's just too long to reasonably use around non-knife people. I think around 4, maybe 4.5 inches would be doable, and there is tremendous temptation to put mine on a diet. What I really need is for CS to discover an experimental patch of pink-scaled ones to put on super discount like what happened with the Broken Skull--gotta have a spare to satisfy the mod urge.
 
All of Cold Steel's XL folders [ with the possible exception of the Espada XL] are very easy to carry in a pant front pocket. I have 14 CS XL folders and although I have smaller folders I always wonder why I should carry a less capable knife when I don't have to. I have the green handle Frenzy and I like it although I wouldn't have minded a somewhat wider handle.
 
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