Getting S30V Razor Sharp

S

Skeptic

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Aug 25, 2012
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I'm new here, so if the answer to my questions have already been posted, I'd appreciate a link because I couldn't find them when searching.

I've got a few S30V Spyderco's (paramilitary 2 and Sage) that I just can't seem to get as sharp as my Benchmade 585 w/ 154 cm. I use a Spyderco Sharpmaker with the coarse and fine stones (the ones that come standard with it). I use the same technique and amount of time on both steels, but the S30V just never quite gets where I'd like it.

I've read here that S30V can be more difficult to sharpen. Does that mean I need to spend more time on the Sharpmaker with it, or do I need to use a different angle? Currently I do the recommended 20 stroke method at 40 degrees that the manual suggests and end with about 2 minutes of cardboard stropping. Are the ultrafine stones a good idea, or do they not really make much of a difference?

Any advice would be appreciated. Love the forum. I've learned a lot from lurking for the past few weeks.
 
First things first, stop counting strokes. There is absolutely no way a predetermined number of strokes is going to get you where you want to be. Instead of making alternating passes, just concentrate on one side until you've formed a burr and then do the same on the other side. Then switch to alternating strokes with an extremely light touch to cut off the burr. Switch to your finer stones and repeat the same process. And yes, S30V will take longer to sharpen than 154cm. In reality sharpening is easy if you understand what you are actually doing. You are grinding the edge to a perfect apex and then refining it. The easiest way to ensure you are doing it right is to form burrs on both sides and then hone off the burr. Also, try the sharpie trick to make sure you are actually reaching the edge. Mark the edge with sharpie and make a few passes, if the sharpie is removed from the very edge you know you are good to go at that angle and you can then proceed in forming a burr, if the sharpie is removed only from the shoulder of the edge bevel you know you need to either increase your angle to reach the edge, or spend some time on the 30° setting on your sharpmaker to knock down the shoulder allowing your 40° setting to reach the edge effectively. Good luck and practice, practice, practice.
 
mkjellgren said:
First things first, stop counting strokes. There is absolutely no way a predetermined number of strokes is going to get you where you want to be. Instead of making alternating passes, just concentrate on one side until you've formed a burr and then do the same on the other side. Then switch to alternating strokes with an extremely light touch to cut off the burr. Switch to your finer stones and repeat the same process. And yes, S30V will take longer to sharpen than 154cm. In reality sharpening is easy if you understand what you are actually doing. You are grinding the edge to a perfect apex and then refining it. The easiest way to ensure you are doing it right is to form burrs on both sides and then hone off the burr. Also, try the sharpie trick to make sure you are actually reaching the edge. Mark the edge with sharpie and make a few passes, if the sharpie is removed from the very edge you know you are good to go at that angle and you can then proceed in forming a burr, if the sharpie is removed only from the shoulder of the edge bevel you know you need to either increase your angle to reach the edge, or spend some time on the 30° setting on your sharpmaker to knock down the shoulder allowing your 40° setting to reach the edge effectively. Good luck and practice, practice, practice.
Click to expand...

+1

Eventually you'll get the feel of it. I love my Sharpmaker. Want to get pair of diamond stones next.
 
It just takes a tad longer. I can get my sage 2 just as sharp or sharper than my persistence or delica using the sharpmaker and ultra fine stones.
 
I'd say that you might need something coarser. A reprofiling/rebeveling is probably in order. I don't find S30V to really be any different than most commonly used steels. Pretty much all steels can be brought to the same level of sharpness, but not all of them will stay there for very long.

Though maybe I learned to sharpen on more wear resistant steels. I remember that I tried sharpening a friend's SAK and it felt like I was utterly failing, even though I could/can get hair whittling results with S30V. Ended up I just needed to cut the number of strokes by a factor of 5 or so, and with very light pressure.
 
A sharpmaker system is incomplete without the diamond and ultrafine rods. It should come with them, but it doesn't. They'll cost about $60 all told for a set of both, but they are worth it.
 
lots of spyderco knives come with somewhat thick blades going right into the sharpening bevel. twas like that with the zdp endura and s30v ti millie. the only one with a blade thin enough to continue with the factory edge was the ffg delica. i reprofiled the zdp endura to 10 degrees per side. the military, 9 degrees with a micro of 15 degrees (not good enough at convexing.)

which brings me to one question: which is better, micro beveling or convexing?
 
Stropping is the Key! A high quality strop and Green compound or that diamond spray will push your blade in to the silly sharp realm. Once you have a nice bevel set all you will need to do is light stropping to maintain the edge. Just use the marker method on your blade before you strop until you get a hang of what angle to hold the knife at. Im a big fan of the Stropman strops they are nice handmade strops or the kangaroo strops are the best due to the grain of the hide but kinda hard to find. One thing to remember is that the finer the edge you reproflie the blade to the faster it will dull. I find for EDC use a 38 to 40 degree inclusive is a good and you can get 40 degrees to hair popping sharp but it will not dull if you cut any thing more then a piece of paper. Sounds like you have the sharping bug it bit me years ago now its a way I unwind and relax some times.
 
You need to use harder abrasives, like silicon carbide or diamond.

Spyderco makes diamond stones for the Sharpmaker, and Congress Tools makes their Moldmaster silicon carbide stones in a size that will fit the Sharpmaker as well. The Moldmaster stones are very inexpensive, as well.
 
gomipile said:
You need to use harder abrasives, like silicon carbide or diamond.

Spyderco makes diamond stones for the Sharpmaker, and Congress Tools makes their Moldmaster silicon carbide stones in a size that will fit the Sharpmaker as well. The Moldmaster stones are very inexpensive, as well.
Click to expand...
Are the Moldmaster stones available in a more aggressive grit than the Sharpmaker diamond stones?

Thanks
 
gomipile said:
You need to use harder abrasives, like silicon carbide or diamond.
Spyderco makes diamond stones for the Sharpmaker, and Congress Tools makes their Moldmaster silicon carbide stones in a size that will fit the Sharpmaker as well. The Moldmaster stones are very inexpensive, as well.
Click to expand...

+1 on this information. DM
 
It has nothing to do with abrasive hardness, ceramic is very hard.
 
hank_rearden said:
lots of spyderco knives come with somewhat thick blades going right into the sharpening bevel. twas like that with the zdp endura and s30v ti millie. the only one with a blade thin enough to continue with the factory edge was the ffg delica. i reprofiled the zdp endura to 10 degrees per side. the military, 9 degrees with a micro of 15 degrees (not good enough at convexing.)

which brings me to one question: which is better, micro beveling or convexing?
Click to expand...

I, personally like micro beveling. This is not completely subjective but others will certainly disagree. What I do is reprofile everything I have to about 25 degrees inclusive on diamond stones. Then, depending on the intended use, I put either a 30 or 40 microbevel on each. What that does is index your knife's edge with the Sharpmaker and it's easy to touch up. I find that on most scandinavian grinds, I just go right to the 30 micro bevel. Now do be sure that a micro bevel is actually micro. You should have to hold it up to the light just right to see that micro bevel.

Follow with stropping on balsa with green compound.
 
After owning an s30v Leek for a couple of weeks, I finally got the edge I wanted. It just took a lot of time on each EP stone, especially the courser grits. I have a little 45X microscope that I use to check on the scratch pattern and I finally figured out what to look for. Then I was able to stay with each stone long enough. It takes much more time on each stone than any other knife I own.

I went through the standard EP stones, then chosera 5K & 10K, then stropped on leather with the green compound.

Right off of the green compound strop, it will "tree top" the stray hairs in my beard, but it doesn't seem to want to stay that sharp. Fortunately, a minute or so freehand on a balsa strop with the green compound brings it back.

For me, the key was a huge number of light strokes with each stone in the progression.

Allen
 
MadMullet: Sounds interesting. What kind of strop do you use? I'm unfamiliar with the sharpie method; any links or vids I can look at? Yes, I've definitely got the bug! Thanks for the info.

mjkellgren: Thanks for the tips. I figured there wasn't a magic number, but just starting, its hard to determine how long is long enough. I've spent about 10 minutes on each of the two stone sets with a lightly used Paramilitary 2 and it got sharp, but not hair-popping.

I'll keep working on it.
 
gomipile said:
You need to use harder abrasives, like silicon carbide or diamond.

Spyderco makes diamond stones for the Sharpmaker, and Congress Tools makes their Moldmaster silicon carbide stones in a size that will fit the Sharpmaker as well. The Moldmaster stones are very inexpensive, as well.
Click to expand...


Where does one acquire such stones :)
 
The "Sharpie technique" is actually any marker that you can use to color the edge and bevel. It's used so that you can easily see exactly where your stone or strop is contacting the blade.

Allen
 
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