Going to Make a Folding Knife - Questions

M

magicpanther

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Oct 4, 2016
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I was on the path of making my first knife, it was intended to be a fixed blade but i had a limited amount of steel and made the handle to small. I was thinking about how i could salvage my build and i decided to cut the handle portion off and make a folder. I have some questions.






-Do you guys have a recommended locking system? If i recall correctly most locking systems need springs, where do you get these or how do you make them?



-I am planning on selling my knife/knives, for future reference are there anythings such as lockups that are patented and not usable?



-Do folding knives have/need bearings on the pivot area? Again, where do you get these?


Thanks!
 
Just finish this out as a small fixed blade with a small handle, call it a neck knife or a three finger knife.

Its impossible to half assed your way into a working locking folder.
There has to be a real plan.



RE the sketch
I suppose that sketching like that is "artistic" but when you have a dozen lines speed out like that to define a feature, then you haven't really defined that shape very well.

It's easier to work it out on the paper than it is to work out in the steel.

Try drawings that look right, then make the knife look like the drawing.


Read the standard reply
There is a list of books to do folders
 
12345678910 said:
Just finish this out as a small fixed blade with a small handle, call it a neck knife or a three finger knife.

Its impossible to half assed your way into a working locking folder.
There has to be a real plan.



RE the sketch
I suppose that sketching like that is "artistic" but when you have a dozen lines speed out like that to define a feature, then you haven't really defined that shape very well.

It's easier to work it out on the paper than it is to work out in the steel.

Try drawings that look right, then make the knife look like the drawing.


Read the standard reply
There is a list of books to do folders
Click to expand...

That drawing was made in 30 seconds, just there so i had a basic shape if the expo marker washed off my steel. I think just grinding with a rough idea in mind gives a more organic knife. Besides that was for my fixed blade not my folder. Thanks for you input though.
 
If your knife is still in the pictured condition, I think you still have plenty to work with if you'd like to finish it as a necker, or a pocket fixed blade. As for turning into a locking knife, I'm not sure I'd recommend it. I'm not saying it can't be done, but there's a lot of things to factor into making a folding knife work, especially if you want it to lock/unlock properly.

That said, there are a number of decent tutorials and WIPs floating around on liner locks, and even frame locks. Both involve relatively the same methods of construction and fine tuning. If you can find a copy of Bob Terzuola's book "The Tactical Folder", its considered by many to be one of the best resources out there for getting started on liner/frame locks.

As for the pivot, you can use bearings, or just some nylon or phosphor bronze bushings/washers.

Regarding locks and patents and trademarks and such, you should be pretty safe sticking with a liner lock, frame lock, back lock, or even a button lock.
 
Finish the one you started set it aside review your design and what went wrong. Before you try to build a folder or attempt to salvage a failed creation by changing its design know what you need to do to correct the problem. Folders are precise tolerance fit blade to liners you can't just cobble together a bad cut up blade with other parts and expect it to work.

Drew gave you a good resource for folders "Bob Terzoula's" book I have it and although I have made many folders I still refer to it.
 
Finish the fixed blade. Folders require precision drawings, planning, mock-ups, set geometrical relationships and precision processes. As some above, you can't just wing it. However, there is a lot to be learned from failure and if you think it through and plan many moves ahead the experience will help you down the road.
 
Okay i will just stop my build for now and start a new one purpose built to be a folder. I was looking at a lot of custom folders yesterday and almost all were liner or frame lock. Are these the only ones that are not patented?
 
I would not suggest you hop from project to project. I suggest you finish this project as 12345678910 said and take it as a learning experience. You will learn the nuances of making knives, you'll know what to expect when you get to a piece of steel you care (more) about, and you will have practice finishing the blade. You can't go wrong finishing this knife. Having this experience with you when you're working on your folder will only make it better. I am super guilty of hopping from project to project and all I can say is it takes longer to improve. This is just my $.02.
Good luck, I look forward to seeing the finished knife.
Tanner
 
I respect your opinions but keep in mind the knife shown is over a 1/4" thick and is not annealed. Cutting it with a power saw took so long the metal turned bright orange, so it's not easy stuff to work with. I think i should buy some annealed metal in a much thinner gauge to make a knife with, and come back to this project when i have better skills and tools.

But for future reference does anyone have answer's to my questions? Also what belt sander do you recommend?
 
magicpanther said:
I was on the path of making my first knife, it was intended to be a fixed blade but i had a limited amount of steel and made the handle to small. I was thinking about how i could salvage my build and i decided to cut the handle portion off and make a folder. I have some questions.






-Do you guys have a recommended locking system? If i recall correctly most locking systems need springs, where do you get these or how do you make them?



-I am planning on selling my knife/knives, for future reference are there anythings such as lockups that are patented and not usable?



-Do folding knives have/need bearings on the pivot area? Again, where do you get these?


Thanks!
Click to expand...

Liner locks or frame locks are popular and I've never heard of a patent issue from making either.
There are many wips on here as well as build alongs on YouTube.
Folders require lots of precision as the others have stated. What kind of equipment do you have available and where are you from?

The others mentioned Bob Terzuola's book.
Its a great book with tons of info, but copies go for $150 and up. Do some searching and you can find a pdf. Mike Gavco has a DVD showing how he makes frame locks so that may be something to look into.

No, liner locks don't NEED bearings, but flippers open a lot faster with them.
Alpha knife supply has bearings, pivots, stop pins, blade materials, screws, almost everything you need to get started. They're also great people to deal with.

You're going to want some taps, reamers, and some endmills depending on the tools that are available to you.

A surface grinder makes things easier, but I've heard of people doing it without one.

There are lots of extremely helpful people on this website who make amazing knives and are eager to help new people so take some pics, draw up some ideas, and post them on here.

Use the BladeForums custom search engine as well and you'll probably find that any questions you may have, have probably already been asked and answered.
I'm only on my 3rd folder. I'm still learning and trying to soak up every bit of info available to me. As the others have stated, lots and lots of planning.

If you're looking into grinders, there are quite a few that are available. What's your budget?
 
magicpanther said:
I respect your opinions but keep in mind the knife shown is over a 1/4" thick and is not annealed. Cutting it with a power saw took so long the metal turned bright orange, so it's not easy stuff to work with. I think i should buy some annealed metal in a much thinner gauge to make a knife with, and come back to this project when i have better skills and tools.

But for future reference does anyone have answer's to my questions? Also what belt sander do you recommend?
Click to expand...

I would suggest seriously considering the advice being given. You will learn a lot more about what you need to know to actually successfully make a knife if you finish this one first. Saying that it is difficult to do this since you didn't use appropriate materials and you don't have the tools to do the job doesn't mean that the answers you are getting are wrong.

You are getting good advice. Try taking it.

The knife shape that you have looks nice. There are lots of things you could do with it. And if you don't want a necker you can still make a partial tang knife. There are lots of options open to you.
 
Here's a link to a pretty good liner lock tutorial: http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/1028982-Build-a-linerlock

Bob Terzuola's book will fill in any questions on geometry and whatnot. As mentioned, there is a pdf floating around somewhere.

If you don't have a surface grinder, I'd recommend starting with precision ground stock. Anything else can be lapped flat on a surface block with a piece of sandpaper taped to it, or if you don't have that, any relatively flat piece of tile or glass.

Keep in mind, for a folder to work well, you'll be dealing with tolerances of .001" or better. Flat, square, and parallel are very important. Use reamers where you can, especially around the pivot area, and keep the first design simple. The tutorial above used dovetailed bolsters IIRC... probably not necessary for a first design. Make cardboard mock-ups and make sure everything will fit how you need it to before you waste the material.

Good luck.
 
magicpanther said:
I respect your opinions but keep in mind the knife shown is over a 1/4" thick and is not annealed. Cutting it with a power saw took so long the metal turned bright orange, so it's not easy stuff to work with. I think i should buy some annealed metal in a much thinner gauge
Click to expand...

Absolutely, chuck it.
Start with thin new knife steel that's annealed.

You didn't tell us any of that ahead of time.

Finish a few fixed blades first.

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/s...You-Want-In-One-Place?p=12016587#post12016587
 
If you are looking to start pocket knives a friction folder is a good place to start as well. It'll give you the basics of pocket knife construction. Pocket knives are tricky. The Count has great advice, a few fixed blades will give you so much more experience and confidence that is really irreplaceable. But more power to you if you want to start with pocket knives!
 
I have a new question/idea, since i got bit by the folder making bug do you think it would be a smart thing to buy 3 or 4 cheap folding knives of different types and take them apart and examine how they work, then "pimp" them. Any of you done this? And recommendations on some to buy? And when i say cheap i mean like $5-$10.

Reason i'm saying this is because i only have 1 folder, a Spyderco Pacific Salt. I was kind of disappointing with that buy which is one of the things that spurred me into wanting to make knives.
 
magicpanther said:
I have a new question/idea, since i got bit by the folder making bug do you think it would be a smart thing to buy 3 or 4 cheap folding knives of different types and take them apart and examine how they work, then "pimp" them. Any of you done this? And recommendations on some to buy? And when i say cheap i mean like $5-$10.

Reason i'm saying this is because i only have 1 folder, a Spyderco Pacific Salt. I was kind of disappointing with that buy which is one of the things that spurred me into wanting to make knives.
Click to expand...

Pick one knife you like and the reason you like it... pick it apart and figure out what you don't like as you stated above then think of what you could possibly do to make it better without reinventing the wheel so to speak.... most of the folders on the market are there because they work well for most consumers without blowing the bank roll to own. FYI you can't build that Pac Salt for what you paid so if you think you can make it better cheaper that's probably not going to happen. Pimpin' is Cool as long as you can keep it reasonable but if you spend to much to make it TOO COOL it could turn out to be overpriced for what it REALLY started out as....But if you like it then it becomes a keeper.
 
Have you gone to that recommended site as a guide?Itwould certainly get you started. You will end up needing a $100 worth of taps and drills, etc. Why not try a kit? Knife kits, and USA knifemakers supply have them.
Frank
 
What...........they make kits..........shut the front door.....Good Suggestion there Mr.Frank...:thumbup:
 
Frank Niro said:
Have you gone to that recommended site as a guide?Itwould certainly get you started. You will end up needing a $100 worth of taps and drills, etc. Why not try a kit? Knife kits, and USA knifemakers supply have them.
Frank
Click to expand...

Which site are you talking about? I went a looked at those kits, i like some but they seem overpriced considering they're basically unfinished disassembled knives when you can just get a finished one and take it apart for less than $8. I would be interested in one if if was very rough and needed me to do the precise fitting, that'd be a good practice. I'll think about this one for the future. http://usaknifemaker.com/knife-blad...pture-satin-finish-folder-kit-440c-32822.html
 
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