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Grinding for hours...

Discussion in 'Shop Talk - BladeSmith Questions and Answers' started by Stromberg Knives, May 6, 2017.

How long does it take you to grind a typical 4 inch blade?

  1. 0-1 hour

    84.3%
  2. 2-3 hours

    7.8%
  3. 4-5 hours

    2.0%
  4. I'm still grinding...

    5.9%
  1. Busto

    Busto KnifeMaker / Craftsman / Service Provider Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider

    Jul 26, 2011
    I've done quite a bit with the Bohler N690 pre and post HT grinding. It's pretty easy on belts falls in line with CPM 154 and some 440C. I think it finishes better than 440C.
     
    Stromberg Knives likes this.
  2. Tom Lewis

    Tom Lewis

    Feb 24, 2000
    With CPM 154 I don't grind post heat treat. I go from 36 grit, 60 grit, 120 grit, 220 grit, 400 grit, 220 norax. Then hand sand at 400 grit. Send off to Pau Bos heat treating. When I get the blades back I hand sand with 400 grit up to 1200 grit. It goes fast.
    I would say a 4" drop point blade would take less than ten minutes to put the primary bevels in with a ceramic 36 grit belt. Maybe more like five minutes.

    Now, many years ago David Boyle used to advertise some kind of cobalt blade. I remember there were advertisements of him using a blade of that material to cut 1" hemp rope. He had a whole pickup truck full of cut pieces and was still cutting. A customer got one of those blanks for me to grind a knife out of. It was 1/8" thick. I couldn't believe how long it took to grind the bevels. Sharp belts just didn't want to cut it. I wouldn't have believed it if I hadn't tried it. That was the one and only blade I ever made out of that material. Sounds like you are using a similar steel.

    Are you using a round contact wheel or the flat platen? A round wheel will cut faster.
     
    Stromberg Knives likes this.
  3. Stromberg Knives

    Stromberg Knives KnifeMaker / Craftsman / Service Provider Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider

    748
    Jan 3, 2015
    Thanks for your response!

    For my FFG (as in this case) I use a flat platen (made out of 15mm AS-quenched O1). I profile my blanks with a contact wheel, to save the flat platen and for a more efficient material removal. Actually I was getting suspicious of the Niolox already at the profiling stage, it was noticeably harder to cut.
     
    Last edited: May 6, 2017
  4. Josh Rider

    Josh Rider KnifeMaker / Craftsman / Service Provider Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider

    Sep 2, 2014
    How many times do you stop and look at the progress as you're grinding? That may be a lot of your time, fixing things that would have otherwise fixed themselves.
     
  5. Natlek

    Natlek

    Jun 9, 2015
    That must be Talonite or Stellite . . . :) They say that if tool steel stays sharp for 6 - 8 hours then Talonite ® will retain an edge for 12 - 14 days :eek:
     
  6. Horsewright

    Horsewright KnifeMaker / Craftsman / Service Provider Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider

    Oct 4, 2011
    Join the AEB-L bandwagon.Ya won't look back. I run it at 62 for kitchen knives and small slicer edcs. They cut and cut and cut and well ya know.... I run it at 63 for my leather working knives and holy cow......
     
    Busto and Stromberg Knives like this.
  7. Stromberg Knives

    Stromberg Knives KnifeMaker / Craftsman / Service Provider Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider

    748
    Jan 3, 2015
    Not as many times now, as when I was just starting out. I'm pretty familiar with O1, so grinding it doesn't take a lot of checking. But I bet I checked my progress at least twice as often when grinding the Niolox. Since I couldn't believe my eyes how little progress, leaning into a 36 grit belt on my 3 hp grinder, I made.
     
  8. Stromberg Knives

    Stromberg Knives KnifeMaker / Craftsman / Service Provider Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider

    748
    Jan 3, 2015
    This sounds like good advice. I've a read lot of good reviews of it. Unfortunately I haven't found a good supplier here in Sweden or Europe. Which is ironic since Uddeholm is a Swedish manufacturer. o_O

    But I can get 14C28N, which according to the link below is rather similar. With added Nitrogen.

    https://www.alphaknifesupply.com/zdata-bladesteelS-AEBL.htm

    https://www.alphaknifesupply.com/zdata-bladesteelS-14C28N.htm
     
    Last edited: May 6, 2017
  9. Hengelo_77

    Hengelo_77 Basic Member Basic Member

    Mar 2, 2006
    I only use Niolox steel and she's not the most easy steel to work with but makes a good knife.
    Stays sharp a long time and doesn't rust even when neglected in a moist kitchen.
    Sharpening goes well with DMT diamont sharpeners, never tried natural stones
    Just don't try and abrade post HT she'll be a b!tch and won't work with you.

    I had a blade finished to 2500 and got some minute scratches during HT. I had to use a 400 EMD stone to get a decent finish again and change the design to a 400 grit finish.

    I outsource HT for 8euro/blade inc deep cooling
     
    Stromberg Knives likes this.
  10. Stromberg Knives

    Stromberg Knives KnifeMaker / Craftsman / Service Provider Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider

    748
    Jan 3, 2015
    Since I learnt the hard way that Niolox should be nearly finished before heat treat and I didn't want to toss my Moby Dick. Instead, I did a quick finish on it and will give it away to a friend as a utility knife.

    Some blades just doesn't want to give up without a fight. Surely I managed to give it a scuff during WEPS sharpening also. Hahaha. I guess I'm allergic to Niolox and should keep away.:confused:

    I ordered a couple of bars of 14C28N, can't wait to try it out.

    http://smt.sandvik.com/en/products/...14c28n-piece-hardening-deep-freezing-70c-95f/

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  11. Frank Niro

    Frank Niro

    Sep 10, 2000
     
  12. Frank Niro

    Frank Niro

    Sep 10, 2000
    Your grinding looks great even with the effort you had to put into it! Frank
     
    Stromberg Knives likes this.
  13. Stromberg Knives

    Stromberg Knives KnifeMaker / Craftsman / Service Provider Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider

    748
    Jan 3, 2015
    Thank you very much. I appreciate it.

    This reminds me of when I just started out making knives. I wanted to try a nice steel bolster and (of course) choose 304. Damn, I had a pretty flimsy grinder back then and my Sisyphus incarnated bolster had no intent of giving me an easy victory. Haha, I ground that gummy stuff forever. That stuff is weird to both drill and grind.
     
  14. Don Hanson III

    Don Hanson III KnifeMaker / Craftsman / Service Provider Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider

    Oct 3, 2002
    Wow, i thought my son was slow. Kyle does one to 120 grit in less than an hour.
     
  15. Stromberg Knives

    Stromberg Knives KnifeMaker / Craftsman / Service Provider Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider

    748
    Jan 3, 2015
    Yeah, I believe I hold some sort of unofficial record with this. :D

    As the current record holder, may I offer a pro tip: never grind and hand sand Niolox after heat treat.
     
    Don Hanson III likes this.
  16. tim37a

    tim37a

    925
    May 18, 2010
    Take a look at Aldo's Nitro V. After talking to him, it sounds like a winner for Kitchen cutlery.
    Tim
     
    AZsmith and Stromberg Knives like this.
  17. Natlek

    Natlek

    Jun 9, 2015
    I would lower his wage . . . . ;)
     
    Don Hanson III likes this.
  18. teclis22

    teclis22

    318
    Jun 10, 2009
    @currenthill

    i dont want to highjack the threat but i cant figure out to do a private message. i saw your grinders in the posted pic. can you tell me the model /maker ? or are they home build ? they do look really down to earth functional and i would love trying to get my grubby mitts on them.
     
  19. Don Hanson III

    Don Hanson III KnifeMaker / Craftsman / Service Provider Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider

    Oct 3, 2002
    Now that's funny & a very good tip! :D
     
    Stromberg Knives likes this.
  20. Stromberg Knives

    Stromberg Knives KnifeMaker / Craftsman / Service Provider Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider

    748
    Jan 3, 2015
    They are built by a guy in Greece, Nick Argy. They're pretty popular in Europe. He does a good job of making grinders with a nice price/performance. They're not so refined, but very sturdy and will probably last a lifetime. He also makes contact wheels for it.

    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCfbZhrxlxmcwTBQZ3IHe4FQ
     

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