Help with Case XX pattern number and green bone

L

lithicus

Joined
Feb 24, 2022
Messages
782
I recently acquired this case knife and it is one that I'm hoping some here might be able to better educate me on! Of particular interest to me is identifying the bone and pattern, but all information is welcome.

From the research I've done, I believe this Case knife dates between 1940 and 1949. It has the CASE over XX stamping. So, 1940-1964. But, it does not include a pattern number. I understand that all case knives had a stamped pattern number starting sometime in 1949. It also has a closed 'C' shield, which I understand is often associated with the Tested era of case knives. So, I believe this lends credence to the fact that this was likely a very early production in the XX era.

Being relatively new to collecting, this is my first time seeing in person what may be true green bone from case. If it is green bone, this would seem to align with the early XX era hints mentioned above. I'm curious if the experts here believe it is green bone or not. I tried my best to capture, in various lighting conditions, the color of the bone in the pictures below. I did not apply any filters, but my phone seems to like auto-adjusting contrast/brightness/exposure/etc.

Lastly, the knife is 3 3/8" in length when closed with a clip and pen blade. For these reasons, I believe this to be a capped 6235 1/2 swell-end jack with a shield. But again, I do not know if I've identified this pattern correctly. Hoping someone here can confirm this for me!

If any additional pictures or information is needed, just let me know!

Thanks again all! This community has taught me so much already and I'm hoping to continue learning from you guys in the future!

2zg26dK.jpg

Qx3j8Q1.jpg

bpZ0qID.jpg

uP5XBIC.jpg
 
Based on the following attributes you described, and as seen in your pics...

(1) closed length @ 3-3/8",
(2) blade config (clip & pen),
(3) location & type of nail nick on clip blade and swedging on clip blade,
(4) relative length & shape of square-end bolster & round end cap,

...it looks an awful lot like a 6214 pattern or maybe 6214-1/2 (the "1/2" indicates a different blade from the standard - not sure whether that would be a clip or a spear). That pattern apparently was produced in both green bone and simply 'bone', as well as in other handle materials. Hard to say which yours would be.

In the book I refer to, the 6235-1/2 swell end is listed a bit smaller @ 3-1/4" closed length.

Below is a pic of the page I'm looking at in the guide book* I'm referring to, for the 6214 pattern. It's listed as a 3-3/8" Jack.
khPs98z.jpg


* - "Official Price Guide to Collector Knives", Fourteenth Edition, by C. Houston Price (2004)
 
Obsessed with Edges said:
Based on the following attributes you described, and as seen in your pics...

(1) closed length @ 3-3/8",
(2) blade config (clip & pen),
(3) location & type of nail nick on clip blade and swedging on clip blade,
(4) relative length & shape of square-end bolster & round end cap,

...it looks an awful lot like a 6214 pattern or maybe 6214-1/2 (the "1/2" indicates a different blade from the standard - not sure whether that would be a clip or a spear). That pattern apparently was produced in both green bone and simply 'bone', as well as in other handle materials. Hard to say which yours would be.

In the book I refer to, the 6235-1/2 swell end is listed a bit smaller @ 3-1/4" closed length.

Below is a pic of the page I'm looking at in the guide book* I'm referring to, for the 6214 pattern. It's listed as a 3-3/8" Jack.
khPs98z.jpg


* - "Official Price Guide to Collector Knives", Fourteenth Edition, by C. Houston Price (2004)
Click to expand...
Interesting!! I had not come across the 14 pattern yet! And, I don't know where I thought I had seen the 35 pattern was 3 3/8" closed as opposed to 3 1/4".

I can take another picture here in a sec, but for what it's worth the frame on this knife is almost identical to the 62009 1/2 barlow I have from the 1970. One end is definitely bigger than the other which is I guess why I was searching for "swell-end" jacks. I could get my calipers out and measure both ends just to provide some further information as camera perspectives can sometimes be wonky.
 
Tried to keep the knife as "straight" as possible so I wasn't measure on an angle. But, overall length closed came out to ~3.359". More than 3 1/4 but not quite 3 3/8. Definitely closer to 3 3/8 though than 3 1/4. I didn't use the caliper on the ends, but the knife seems to "swell" (for lack of a better term) from a little over 1/2" (not quite 5/8) to 3/4".

MmOFSYV.jpg

jbmbs5S.jpg

NrHKbiB.jpg
 
I think you have the knife correctly identified as a 6235 1/2. The 1/2 indicates a clip main blade, the lack of the 1/2 indicates a spear main blade. I think it is green bone, on the darker side. OH
 
Old Hunter said:
I think you have the knife correctly identified as a 6235 1/2. The 1/2 indicates a clip main blade, the lack of the 1/2 indicates a spear main blade. I think it is green bone, on the darker side. OH
Click to expand...
It is interesting! I can see why the 14 pattern was suggested due to the length. I do feel it has a definitely "swell end jack" look to it though, despite it being longer than 3 1/4. The 14 pattern looks a little slim to me. Like both ends are roughly the same size. And, definitely agree about the "1/2" part of the pattern. Whether it is a 14 or a 35, it would be a 6214 1/2 or 1 6235 1/2 due to that clip/pen combo.

And my eye says it's green bone to me as well, but on the darker/browner side. This is just based off of photos I've seen though as I've never seen one in person before. This might be the most subjective part of my question and I'm not sure anyone could say for certain without seeing it in person. I did see some pictures that were posted here by waynorth waynorth where the green bone is quite dark/brownish. And I think if mine is green bone, it might fall into that camp. I thought about posting in that thread, but opted to create a new one as I was also curious about the pattern number.

https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/what-is-case-greenbone.1606140/post-21575427
 
I kind of take the examples shown in the guide book with a grain of salt sometimes. I've noticed some variations in actual length as compared to the guide's published length info, even as compared to knives clearly ID'd with pattern stamps. With Case's older knives, it's long been known they've been kind of ambiguous over their history in clearly documenting the very old patterns - not to mention, the variations that likely followed with small design tweaks in a pattern that spans the various 'eras' in their history ('Tested', 'XX', etc.).

Another pic below, of the book's illustration for the 6235 Swell End (this pic shows the 'EO' Easy open pattern variation, with the spear blade).
RtWadm0.jpg
 
Last edited:
Obsessed with Edges said:
I kind of take the examples shown in the guide book with a grain of salt sometimes. I've noticed some variations in actual length as compared to the guide's published length info, even as compared to knives clearly ID'd with pattern stamps. With Case's older knives, it's long been known they've been kind of ambiguous over their history in clearly documenting the very old patterns - not to mention, the variations that likely followed with small design tweaks in a pattern that spans the various 'eras' in their history ('Tested', 'XX', etc.).

Another pic below, of the book's illustration for the 6235 Swell End (this pic shows the 'EO' Easy open pattern variation, with the spear blade).
RtWadm0.jpg
Click to expand...
This is a good point as well. Many changes occur without getting documented. I'm still very happy you mentioned the 14 pattern as I wasn't aware of it and it is at least one I can think about, research, and take into consideration. I definitely need to try to find some more photos of XX-era 14 patterns online and see how it compares.

I knew buying this knife was going to be interesting 😂 No pattern number and the seemingly always asked "is this green/red bone" question. The pattern is obviously less subjective than bone color, but as you've pointed out it can be hard to even determine a pattern accurately when you take into consideration the slight variations over many decades.

Definitely appreciate your help and knowledge!
 
The 'green bone' vs. 'red' vs. 'brown' thing has always been interesting to me.

Depending on the ambient light under which each is viewed, the apparent bone color can shift dramatically. I used to fret over how some of my bone-covered knives looked in the house I used to live in - almost everything seemed kind of an ugly shade of green. Under varying combinations of the artificial light in the room (incandescent vs. fluorescent), and even depending on how that light is reflected, diffused or further 'colored' by the tones of the walls, carpet, furniture, etc., the color of the bone can vary all over the place as viewed by the naked eye. That always made me wonder how these old knives' handles were originally 'labeled' by Case and others, as to their color. Seems all to be in the eye of the beholder, and even in the beholder's particular setting at the time.

And then, there's the known change in color that can occur as the pigments in the bone age and change over time. Whatever looks 'brown' in a knife today might've actually been more 'green' a few decades ago. Same for some of the old 'red' bone - which can shift to something more brown-looking over time.
 
Obsessed with Edges said:
The 'green bone' vs. 'red' vs. 'brown' thing has always been interesting to me.

Depending on the ambient light under which each is viewed, the apparent bone color can shift dramatically. I used to fret over how some of my bone-covered knives looked in the house I used to live in - almost everything seemed kind of an ugly shade of green. Under varying combinations of the artificial light in the room (incandescent vs. fluorescent), and even depending on how that light is reflected, diffused or further 'colored' by the tones of the walls, carpet, furniture, etc., the color of the bone can vary all over the place as viewed by the naked eye. That always made me wonder how these old knives' handles were originally 'labeled' by Case and others, as to their color. Seems all to be in the eye of the beholder, and even in the beholder's particular setting at the time.

And then, there's the known change in color that can occur as the pigments in the bone age and change over time. Whatever looks 'brown' in a knife today might've actually been more 'green' a few decades ago. Same for some of the old 'red' bone - which can shift to something more brown-looking over time.
Click to expand...
I respect this all too much 😂 While I've always enjoyed the outdoors, growing up hunting, fishing, snowboarding, canoeing, boating, cutting trails; my day job is as a software engineer. The software I work on is a rendering engine which simulates lighting for concerts and theatre. Most people don't think about how things like the carpet, furniture, wallpaper, etc effect how we see things. And, going beyond that, how light particles bounce around subsurface inside of an object like bone. You're comment couldn't ring more true! And, age certainly plays a factor. I think it is sometimes a futile effort to differentiate between green bone, pretty bone, pale bone, regular/brown bone, red bone, and chestnut bone. These are, at least, the ones I've heard collectors mention when discussing pre-1980 case knives. Nevertheless, it seems like we all keep trying to define these terms as collectors and like yourself it has always interested me!

Edit: Can't forget "early rogers" and "late rogers" bone! 😂
 
Last edited:
danno50 said:
I agree with Bruce.
Click to expand...
Much appreciated! Your guy's opinion means more to me than my own as I am still a young grasshopper when it comes to collecting knives 😅 I have my own opinions, but will almost always defer to those more experience than myself.
 
One thing to keep in mind concerning Case bone colors. Prior to the Appaloosa and Rose bones in the very late 1970’s and early 1980’s, Case didn’t market the knives with various bone colors in the manner that is their core marketing technique for the last 40 years. The bone was dyed and it took on a color - very often, as often as not, you will have one color on the front and another on the back (usually a light or dark variation) - matching wasn’t a consideration. Red, Green, Brown, Black “Pretty” etc., - they all just happened. Labeling by those colors, and the values those colors have, are modern constructs by collectors. The devil is always in the details and the colors on the margins are open to different collectors opinions. All part of the fun of discussion and collecting. OH
 
afishhunter said:
When did Case switch from patter number first two numbers to last two numbers?
Click to expand...
I believe the first two numbers are always the pattern number. 1/2 is considered an abbreviation, much like HP or HE (sHeepfoot and sPey, sHeepfoot and pEn). I'm not sure when they stopped making knives with the 1/2 abbreviation though. I own a 1980 A62009 1/2. So, at least as late as the 80s.

Edit: meant to say the LAST two (or sometimes three) digits are the pattern number.
 
Last edited:
Old Hunter said:
One thing to keep in mind concerning Case bone colors. Prior to the Appaloosa and Rose bones in the very late 1970’s and early 1980’s, Case didn’t market the knives with various bone colors in the manner that is their core marketing technique for the last 40 years. The bone was dyed and it took on a color - very often, as often as not, you will have one color on the front and another on the back (usually a light or dark variation) - matching wasn’t a consideration. Red, Green, Brown, Black “Pretty” etc., - they all just happened. Labeling by those colors, and the values those colors have, are modern constructs by collectors. The devil is always in the details and the colors on the margins are open to different collectors opinions. All part of the fun of discussion and collecting. OH
Click to expand...
Yea, I found it very interesting to learn that case just called everything "bone" until the Appaloosa and Rose variants you mention. I also read (on aapk) that while "red bone" is more an indication of color, "green bone" is more an indication of time or era as "green bone" was most common in the tested and very early xx eras before the dye changed. So, "green bone" was mostly desired as it indicated an older vintage knife than an equivalent "red bone" version.
 
lithicus said:
I believe the first two numbers are always the pattern number. 1/2 is considered an abbreviation, much like HP or HE (sHeepfoot and sPey, sHeepfoot and pEn). I'm not sure when they stopped making knives with the 1/2 abbreviation though. I own a 1980 A62009 1/2. So, at least as late as the 80s.
Click to expand...
I only have three Case, a 62131CV canoe, 2137 Sodbuster Jr, and a TB61027W DAM tear drop. I had a 11031SH single blade whaler/rope/ loom fixer. ("SH" for "Sheepsfoot")
I know from the Case number break-down, over at AAPK, the first number is the cover material; "1" is wood covers. "2" is synthetic, "6" Jigged bone. The second number of blades, the last 2 or 3 the pattern number. Agree that "1/2" (and "1/4") does indicate a blade other than the standard. ("1/4" was used when there were three blade options for the pattern.)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top