HI Scramsax/Seax/Saex Design Thread

Originally posted by Ferrous Wheel
Sure can. I know that you, Yvsa, and Sarge expressed an innterest in such. If not engraving, I can do a deep etch of the runes just as easily, and less chance of messing up (engraving can be tricky, what with whirring skittering bits...)

If the engravings will go in the fuller, the fuller might be made a bit wider. Otherwise, it is quite traditional to put the runes just below the small fuller.

Also, I think each seax should have the tiw rune (upward pointing arrow). The use of the Tiw rune consecrates the blade for justice and victory in battle, as Tiw (Zio, Tiwas, Tyr, Saxnot -- depending on the time and region) is the proto sword god. Odin replaced this ancient god at the head of the norse pantheon, as a more dynamic and flashy god was needed to head up the Migration Age (viking expansion and conquest begins). Tyr is also the patron god of the Thing, the "Great Council" of the Norse.

Coincidentally (not!) the Sword of Shiva on khuks acts as the Tiw rune on knives and swords of the North.

The tiw rune could either be struck in the steel like the kamis do with the HI logo and their signatures, or etched on later, or carved into the handle.

P.S. I don't own a recent khuk with the big "L.B." signatures (for Bura, for example), just ones with the smiths makers' mark. but I would have reservations having a seax with these S.N. or L.B. letters on it. once you add the runes for period effect, you'll still have these modern english letters anachronistically glaring from the steel. No big issue, just a cosmetic one.

keith

So the question is: do we put runes on the wood model itself to be sent to the kamis, or not?

Adding the runes to the model for the kamis would present two potential problems that I see: (1) how the kamis decide to reproduce them & (2) additional time & labour, and thus cost (for those who aren't really interested in having runes).

The other question is, in addition to the Tyr rune, what would the row of runes be? Something like BURA ME FECIT? ;)
 
Beo brings up a good point. It will keep the cost down if the runes are an after market thing. otherwise, this thing will cost as much as Audrey!;) Also, I'm hoping to have enuf etching work to get me one of those seaxes.

As far as runes go, it would be most traditional for the Elder Futhark of runes to be used, for that was the "Alpabet" in use up thru the migration age. From then on, the Futhark morphed into the Younger futhark, in Scandinavia, and the Anglo Saxon Futhark in England and parts of cental and western Europe.

Commonly runic inscriptions contain the following info, one on each side, or on one side only:

1. Owner's mark (sigebrecht owns me -- sigerecht meah)
2. Makers mark or name
3. Seax's name (commmon even today to name weaponns and tools, like Audrey!)
4. Commemerative slogan or poem
5. Entire Futhark (Back then, letters and the written word was magic!)
6. the Tiw rune, or other runes of signifigance to bearer.


Pen's rune line design is nice, and he elected to cut and paste a runeline together that would represent the entire Futhark. Yes, I can offer up the runic alphabet with modern letter correlations, for use on seaxes. just shoot me an email if you want it. ksauers@indy.rr.com
Thanks!
 
I am way over my head.

The sax is pretty much done but don't be looking at me for doing inscriptions in elder futhark.

I thought I pretty much did it with the sheath.

Y'all can inscribe it yourself.

Jesus.


-Dave
 
we've spooked Dave K, yall. If the runes are after market etching, he can realax...

..Another benefit of adding runes later is each seax can be personalized, and thus unique. And those who want no runes don't hafta worry.

I'll do the rune etching fer cheep.
 
I'd prefer it if the runes were aftermarket.

Since the runes have no meaning to the kamis, they may not reproduce them exactly - to the disappointment of those who understand them.

In my case, I just don't like them.

S.
 
Pen--thassrite: cheep! I'm thinking from my experiences with etching that the runes would run in the 1 dollar per rune for the first one to ten, then 4bux for 5 runes after that. That don't leave much fer shipping, so I'll hafta talk to the folks who want runes and figure something out. It's all good, all negotiable.

The price is per rune, not letter. Certain runes are combinations of letters in the modern english alphabet, like the Th rune and the Ng rune. So the english word "Thing" is only three runnes.

Does this price sound reasonable? I really only need to make enuf to purchase meself one of those seaxes, or to get me close. I'm currently unempoyed, so's i gots time to etch to at least help compensate me for my HIKV.

Keith

P.S.-- just finished masking the latest etch design onto an AK bowie. It's pretty nice, and the piece will ever after be known as "Steel Wing". Pix forthcoming, after I cut the mask and etch.
 
Originally posted by Ferrous Wheel
Does this price sound reasonable? I really only need to make enuf to purchase meself one of those seaxes, or to get me close. I'm currently unempoyed, so's i gots time to etch to at least help compensate me for my HIKV.

Sounds more than reasonable to me. I just hope I have a few simoleons left in my gig fund when the time is right.
 
Originally posted by Ferrous Wheel
...the runes would run in the 1 dollar per rune for the first one to ten, then 4bux for 5 runes after that.

Keith,

That sounds very reasonable to me. I won't put any runes on the wood model.

Perhaps if there are enough of us that want one with runes we could have Uncle Bill send ours directly to you (as a group) and then you could ship them out when you receive payment from us individually. I know Bill doesn't like to do that normally, but then again, he doesn't like special orders either...:p


Re: Fuller

The fuller stays - Dave go ahead and put a fuller on it just like the drawing above. Make it a straight cut 5/16" away from the top of the blade and send it all the way to the end. I think your Dremel idea with some type of jig to align it is a great idea.

Keep me posted.

Dan
 
Okay, hopefully I'll be getting it done tonight.

The blade is only 1/4" thick, so the fullers will have to be somewhere less than the 1/8" that I believe was originally requested.

I was also wondering, does anyone have pics of the Arrow Of Tiw thingie?

Sorry about last night's rant, BTW...:eek:

-Dave
 
Dave - it literally just looks like an arrow:

tyr.jpg


thanks again for your work :)
 
Originally posted by Dave K
Sorry about last night's rant, BTW...:eek:

-Dave

Uwinv Dawi don't worry about any rant. Anytime there's a design by committee everyone winds up frustrated.
This is maybe the cleanest and less frustrating design by committee I've ever seen here or anywhere else.:)
 
I came over here from my post about the Lutel dagger that I bought and would anyone mind if I made a couple or three of comments? I hope not.

1) In all of my research on seaxes, I have never, ever, seen or read of a flared hilt such as the one shown in the drawings. It may be more functional, but it would not appear to be historical. Now, let me hedge by saying that I will now predict that someone will produce an example of one that looks exactly like what I have said that I have never seen. That is how archaeology and history seem to work!

2) Please do not try to use the system used by many who make reproduction seaxes of riveting two scales to the tang. None of the seaxes found to date appear to have had hilts like that, all of them appear to have had hilts that were one piece of whatever drilled up the middle and the tang glued into it somehow. They have not found signs of rivets on any.

3) There is what is called a "Frankish Style" seax that is the type reproduced by Paul Chen for CASI. It has a psear point rather than the more traditional one that you all have illustrated. Actually, they have found seaxes with all kinds of blades, as the posts in this thread have already shown. Look at the "Charlemagne Seax".
 
Well, it's done, unless anyone wants me to try and put the arrow on it somewhere.

Now I just gotta pack it up and ship it out to Dan.

-Dave
 
Originally posted by Dave K
Well, it's done, unless anyone wants me to try and put the arrow on it somewhere.

Now I just gotta pack it up and ship it out to Dan.

-Dave

I think it's probably good as is.
 
I agree.

Let's get this thing made.

:eek: :eek: :eek:

Dan
 
Excellent. That model is ready to fly! Where do I sign up fer one? Here?

"never, ever, seen or read of a flared hilt" Well, FullerH, most seaxes are found sans handle anyway, so it it pretty hard to say what handle shapes were used. Most likely, all manner of shapes were used. Also, we are trying to have a bit of Nepalese Khuk flair to the piece. An assortment of handles and blades were voted on.

I agree with your assessment of tang vs riveted scales. It will be stick tang.

Keith
 
Does anyone have any idea of a price range for this guy? Should we be thinking about price decisions in the design, if there are any? I mean, I'm drooling over this already, and will very disappointed if it's way over my price range.
 
Back
Top