High Carbon & Tool Steels vs the newer stainless alloys, what are your preferences?

Which do you prefer for general use and or Bush Crafting?

  • 1095 and similar

    Votes: 1 50.0%

  • Tool Steels

    Votes: 1 50.0%

  • Modern alloys like S30V, M390, etc.

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Total voters
    2
Simple carbon/tool steels. For general use and bushcrafting (whatever that is).

Just now saw your poll above. If I had to pick one category, it would be easy for me. TOOL STEEL!!!!! W2 and O7
 
Just to be clear on your groups:

1) "Carbon Steels" = containing only iron, carbon, and small amounts of manganese, e.g. 1055, 1075, 1084, 1095.
2) "Tool Steels" = Carbon steel + alloys like vanadium, chromium, niobium, tungsten, molybdenum, more manganese, etc. but not in high enough percentages to present as "stainless", e.g. 52100, 5160, D2, L6, O1, W5, 3V, M4, 10V, K390, Rex121, etc.
3) "Stainless steels" = Tool Steels containing enough chromium to present significant corrosion resistance, e.g. 420HC, 440A, 440C, AEB-L, 12C27, 154CM, AUS-8, S30V, M390, S125V, etc.

"Newer alloys" refers to what year of invention? Some of the "super steels" (i.e. PM steels containing high volumes of vanadium) have been around since the 70s but not used in knives, and there are stainless and non-stainless varieties.

My question: What advantage do plain "carbon" steels present vs. alloyed tool steels and stainless steels?
 
chiral.grolim said:
Just to be clear on your groups:

1) "Carbon Steels" = containing only iron, carbon, and small amounts of manganese, e.g. 1055, 1075, 1084, 1095.
2) "Tool Steels" = Carbon steel + alloys like vanadium, chromium, niobium, tungsten, molybdenum, more manganese, etc. but not in high enough percentages to present as "stainless", e.g. 52100, 5160, D2, L6, O1, W5, 3V, M4, 10V, K390, Rex121, etc.
3) "Stainless steels" = Tool Steels containing enough chromium to present significant corrosion resistance, e.g. 420HC, 440A, 440C, AEB-L, 12C27, 154CM, AUS-8, S30V, M390, S125V, etc.

"Newer alloys" refers to what year of invention? Some of the "super steels" (i.e. PM steels containing high volumes of vanadium) have been around since the 70s but not used in knives, and there are stainless and non-stainless varieties.

My question: What advantage do plain "carbon" steels present vs. alloyed tool steels and stainless steels?
Click to expand...

Thanks for posting the details more clearly.

By newer, I meant when Crucible Powdered Metallurgy formulas started being used more commonly in knives.

The one main advantage I can think of for plain high carbon steel is it would be easier to sharpen over harder steel alloys with higher Rockwell ratings and more abrasion resistance.

I know that Tool Steel is harder and tougher in general because it is used to work regular steels.

Anyway, I wanted to know what you guys think about each category of steel and why. This is how I learn. Hopefully this thread will be beneficial to others as well. :)
 
I do use a SOG NW Ranger for "small" work sometimes but my BK14 holds pride of place.
And for the "large" work my billhook from a truck spring works or the Condor HB Camp knife.

I prefer the simpler steels even when it comes to alloys (AUS-8 or 12c27 or 8Cr13) and carbon steels primarily because my freehand and field sharpening skills are at novice level at best.
 
While I'll be the first to admit that I haven't tried all the newer steels with the exception of S30V which may not even be one of the newer. Doziers D2 has always been excellent for me. Living in coastal S Florida and hunting in South Carolina I've had no corrosion what so ever and edge retention has been all I could ask for.
 
rick melear said:
While I'll be the first to admit that I haven't tried all the newer steels with the exception of S30V which may not even be one of the newer. Doziers D2 has always been excellent for me. Living in coastal S Florida and hunting in South Carolina I've had no corrosion what so ever and edge retention has been all I could ask for.
Click to expand...
I like D2 as well, and have several knives made with it as well as S30V. I believe D2 is also considered a tool steel, albeit with a modicum of stainless properties.
Tool steel has now got my attention since I bought an L.T. Wright knife in 01. So many choices.
 
It depends what it will be used for and if it is fixed or folder. Not really something you can capture in a poll.....
 
craytab said:
It depends what it will be used for and if it is fixed or folder. Not really something you can capture in a poll.....
Click to expand...

In my mind I was thinking mostly fixed blade, but I failed to write that. I suppose I was thinking along the lines of the last knife you might ever need that will serve you well in any situation, including survival situations.
I figure you guys have used many different knives by now, and could say what steel/steels served you best.
Think of this poll as an accumulation of opinion.
 
Ballenxj said:
In my mind I was thinking mostly fixed blade, but I failed to write that. I suppose I was thinking along the lines of the last knife you might ever need that will serve you well in any situation, including survival situations.
I figure you guys have used many different knives by now, and could say what steel/steels served you best.
Think of this poll as an accumulation of opinion.
Click to expand...

Yes, but an accumulation of opinion on what? The question is far too broad to yield any real quantifiable data. Further, the poll is set up in such a way that one can answer all of the options at once, so that's what I did.

I use different steels for different tasks. For around town as a normal EDC, it is a modern stainless steel like S30v or Elmax or M390 but sometimes M4 like in my 810 or 710. For when I go into the woods I take 1095 & A2 in a fixed blade but I always have my PM2 in S30v clipped to my pocket.

The specifics of the question are what will give you a meaningful answer.
 
craytab said:
The specifics of the question are what will give you a meaningful answer.
Click to expand...
OK, You have a go bag in your closet, which knife do you have either in it, or strapped to it, what steel is it made in, and why?
That is about as simple and direct as I can be about the unknown.
 
Ballenxj said:
OK, You have a go bag in your closet, which knife do you have either in it, or strapped to it, what steel is it made in, and why?
That is about as simple and direct as I can be about the unknown.
Click to expand...

Knife is from a maker/manufacturer of good repute, made of whatever steel that model was available. More important than steel for such a knife is overall design - blade size, thickness, edge geometry, handle ergonomics, weight, sheath, etc. The knife in my bag is part of a Leatherman Charge with S30V blade, the knife in my trunk right now is a RatManDu with SR101, the knife in my pocket is a Buck Stockman 420HC.

Are you asking about what brands/makers are most popular? BRKT fans would have mostly A2, S!K fans mostly 3V, Bussekin fans INFI or SR101, Buck fans 420HC, Fallkniven fans VG10, ESEE and Becker fans 1095, and the list goes on.

My own opinion: alloy steels have those alloys in order to gain specific advantages over basic carbon steels, be it higher hardness for a given toughness or higher wear resistance or corrosion resistance. The only reason to use a basic carbon steel vs. an alloy is one of availability - the knife you want (for other reasons) is not available to you (at a price you'll pay) in a more advantageous alloy. *shrug*

By the way, this poll would get more 'hits' in the "General" section.
 
My name is Frank and I'm a steel junky. I like them all.

Seriously, all the alloys in the poll have their uses. Depends on the knife and its intended use. If I needed something which would cut lots of abrasive materials without sharpening, I'd likely choose one of the new PM alloys. If I were going to do some carving, I'd want something without carbides such as carbon steel or a simple stainless.

But I use my daily carry for general cutting as I'm doing chores. For this I usually prefer a stainless with carbides as I just want something which keeps cutting, even if it is not a razor edge. 440C or something like 154CM will do fine. PM alloys will work also. D2 is OK, but I prefer something more corrosion resistant.
 
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