How Fallkniven's laminated steel breaks

You should send Fallkniven a pic and what happened in an email. They will answer pretty quickly most times I've sent them an email. I'd be curious as to what they have to say about this. Maybe a bad heat treat I don't know, they may want to test it. I know the Japanese that make these knives are pretty good at what they do, so....curious.
 
d762nato said:
You should send Fallkniven a pic and what happened in an email. They will answer pretty quickly most times I've sent them an email. I'd be curious as to what they have to say about this. Maybe a bad heat treat I don't know, they may want to test it. I know the Japanese that make these knives are pretty good at what they do, so....curious.
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This knife seemed like it was perfectly fine and well made. It should perform at a high level when used as intended. I didn't want this thread to be an anti-Fallkniven thread. It's a great knife company.

And Fallkniven has published studies that it funded that show their laminated blade is tougher than a blade made of pure VG 10.

I was just interested in seeing how the laminated blade broke when subjected to strong lateral forces, mostly because it seemed counterintuitive to me that the laminated blade would add any toughness. I still feel that way.

I like Fallkniven knives and have several, but I would not use a Fallkniven laminated blade where I might need to abuse the knife, say with prying in a survival situation.
 
Interesting.
From what I know, if you laminate sheets of the same material you will have a stronger product in the end. It's how carbon fiber bows are made, for instance, and I think that has a lot to do why Damascus steel is stronger. But since you're using sheets of materials with different ductile characteristics I'm not sure if the principle applies the same way.
 
Twindog said:
I think I now feel the same way. I'd rather have a solid blade of VG 10.

It looks to me as though the inner VG 10 core breaks first, which triggers one side of the laminated steel to break, which triggers the other side of the laminated blade to break, but farther down the blade.

I thought that the softer 420 cladding would hold up better, but it is quite thin.

I also thought that the blade would bend more before breaking, but it breaks after minimal bending.
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It should have been like this, ie bend quite a lot without breaking, that is my experience with san mai type blade construction, if done correctly and for many more layers def bend like no tomorrow and regain original shape. Certainly you showed some great brittle fracture surfaces as you noted. Thanks for being totally honest about your "experiment" It's a pity many perform similar "tests" under the guise of reviews but are totally unscientific in their approach and or reporting. Such is the case for simple "rope cutting edge retention tests" of which there is a plethora of "reviews" out there. I'm yet to see one where the knife or knives in question are held in a device and a constant pressure and movement are applied to the object. Using one's hands is about as nonscientific as one can get LOL.
 
I have an S1 in CoS laminated. I can chop wood with and do lots of awfull things to the poor thing. If i had seen this before owning a laminated steel blade, I probably would have never bought 1. I'm kinda surprised it doesn't just split part from heavy use but it doesn't. Lol
 
Irishgreenman said:
I have an S1 in CoS laminated. I can chop wood with and do lots of awfull things to the poor thing. If i had seen this before owning a laminated steel blade, I probably would have never bought 1. I'm kinda surprised it doesn't just split part from heavy use but it doesn't. Lol
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If it's been welded properly, it shouldn't split apart.
 
Interesting thread, thanks for the effort! Now I wonder about cold steel’s San Mai with VG-1 core. In a cold steel video testing the San Mai Trailmaster, it bent in a vise about 55 degrees without breaking. Made in the same factory as falkniven, but with a VG-1 core instead of VG-10.
 
If you look up Noss's post on the A1 destruction test. I believe it's a four part series, and it looked pretty tough to me. Noss himself said this is one tough Sob as he was testing to destruction.
 
d762nato said:
If you look up Noss's post on the A1 destruction test. I believe it's a four part series, and it looked pretty tough to me. Noss himself said this is one tough Sob as he was testing to destruction.
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There's alot of such data on the VG 10 blades. I want to see more on the cos steel. I know that some of the VG 10 knives I've had in the past....chiped when they were new but stopped after a couple of sharpening. I haven't seen that to be present with the S1X in cos. But I've also seen it mentioned that the cos is hard to sharpen and I haven't seen that to be the case.

I haven't had an elmax knife of my own or any of the other popular steels that i have really used like this. So I can't say where the cos stands in comparison from my own experience. But I can say that this is the toughest knife I've ever owned and used for things like, chopping wood, chiseling and things of the like. I don't purposely try to break them. But i do use them for their intended use.

My S1X does everything my Esee 5 did but better. I did destroy the Esee 5 on purpose but only after there was an incident. I was welding and it was near by leaning up against a piece of channel. I had a very intermittent ground for a few seconds and didn't realize why until I seen my Esee 5. Well....um.....yea. oops. . It was grounding out and not only took a chunk out.....but welded itself on both sides. Pryed it off and proceeded to see what it was made of. Lol.

I'm not a fallkniven fan boy or anything. I'm just speaking to my own experience with it. I really don't think I would have it if I had seen the pictures here in this thread. It seems like it should've separated with how hard I've used it but there's no sign of any failure at all. It looks brand new at the moment. I coat everything with Norells Moly Resin when I come back in from an outing. Other than someone doing that.....there's no point in buying 1 of these with black coating. The Norrels is almost as tough as the tungsten carbide finish that comes on the black versions of the knife. I can say that the coating this came with is the hardest thing I've encountered. It's harder than Norrels or Cerekote.

I wonder how its done and where you get it. I have some firearms I'd love to put it on lol.
 
Do you have the S1XB with the black coated blade. I've got an A1X satin blade..regular model, haven't had a chance to use it though. I've heard the black coating is tough as nails also.
 
d762nato said:
Do you have the S1XB with the black coated blade. I've got an A1X satin blade..regular model, haven't had a chance to use it though. I've heard the black coating is tough as nails also.
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Yes. The coating is tougher than any coating I've seen previously. It's stronger than Cerekote or Norrels but not by a whole lot. It will wear off in no time when you start using unless you're just cutting rope with it or something. The first time you baton it through a log, you'll see some wear. I think it's pointless to buy the black 1 unless you plan on keeping it that way 1 way or the other. I have a habit of coating all my tools when I come back in. I'll soak my axe and other carbon steal tools that can corrode in oil and clean them with steal wool and then coat them to protect them until next time. So I'll allways buy something with a finish if its available.
 
M B said:
I wonder if one of the laminated CoS blades would react in any substantially different way than the laminated 3G blades?
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That's a good question, you have three different steels that Fallkniven has had laminated and made by the Japanese which are very stringent in the way they do things.
 
d762nato said:
That's a good question, you have three different steels that Fallkniven has had laminated and made by the Japanese which are very stringent in the way they do things.
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Yea. I know a Marine that was stationed in Japan. After he got out, him and his family went on vacation in Japan and they went to Seki and seen the sword museum. He said Seki was called knife city and that there were laws against making anything cheap there. Everything there was top quality. He watched production knives being hand ground 1 after another and all coming out to the same spec. That's amazing. He also watched a group of men making a hand made sword and they were all.standing around it taking turns beating while 1 moved it to where it needed to be.There was a quality standard that had to be followed to be allowed to manufacture there. They claim to make to make the best blades in the world there. At least it was like 12 years ago. Not sure about now.
 
I for one will be taking this result with a proverbial grain of salt. I have had a number of Fallknivens, including blades of VG10, Lam Cos, 3G, and their SGPS powder damascus. I have never had one of their blades chip or break. Of course, others occasionally have had those issues for whatever reason, but I won't let that keep me away from the brand...not by a long shot. Mine have always performed superbly.
 
Indeed, I'm confident with my a1pro and have been very pleased by their products generally.

Plus, the OP did point out that the scenario in which the knife was broken is entirely unrealistic as far as actual use goes.

I do find it interesting, intellectually and experimentally, but not worrying in the least.
 
on_the_edge said:
I for one will be taking this result with a proverbial grain of salt. I have had a number of Fallknivens, including blades of VG10, Lam Cos, 3G, and their SGPS powder damascus. I have never had one of their blades chip or break. Of course, others occasionally have had those issues for whatever reason, but I won't let that keep me away from the brand...not by a long shot. Mine have always performed superbly.
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on_the_edge said:
I for one will be taking this result with a proverbial grain of salt. I have had a number of Fallknivens, including blades of VG10, Lam Cos, 3G, and their SGPS powder damascus. I have never had one of their blades chip or break. Of course, others occasionally have had those issues for whatever reason, but I won't let that keep me away from the brand...not by a long shot. Mine have always performed superbly.
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I don't think the post was ment to say the knife is bad. Just to show how laminated steel knives break under tremendous pressure. Mine has been arguably the best knife I've ever carried and used hard. I'd buy another 1 in a second.
 
Irishgreenman said:
I don't think the post was ment to say the knife is bad. Just to show how laminated steel knives break under tremendous pressure. Mine has been arguably the best knife I've ever carried and used hard. I'd buy another 1 in a second.
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I do not disagree with you. However, at least one poster in this thread ( J JokersFaceLifter ) seems to feel like he made a big mistake even owning one to begin with. I just wanted readers to know that not everyone is as dissatisfied with owning and using Fallkniven knives.
 
on_the_edge said:
I do not disagree with you. However, at least one poster in this thread ( J JokersFaceLifter ) seems to feel like he made a big mistake even owning one to begin with. I just wanted readers to know that not everyone is as dissatisfied with owning and using Fallkniven knives.
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i have dropped the tip of my fallkniven knife on the spout of a glass sake bottle and the tip broke off, (my mistake) i have been able to resharpen a tip back on the knife, i sold it on eBay for a good price; that said:
I'm more than willing to see that as my bad luck, im aware of the positive reviews Fallkniven gets, so my instance of bad luck doesn't damn the company in my eyes, but i (myself) wont buy another knife from them because of the policies I've created for myself to ensure i get a knife that passes "my tests" Fallkniven is a great company, just not a company i will personally buy from --- that much i will admit
 
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