How sharp is 1000 grit sharp?

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Aug 13, 2016
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Hey guys, I'm just learning how to freehand sharpen my knives and its coming okay. I just started to use the method where you put Sharpie on your edge to know if you're removing material at the heel or tip (is that the correct lingo?) anyway, it seems to be helping a lot. I only have up to 1000 grit stones right now as I'm just learning. My question is: how sharp should my knife be at 1000# if I'm doing it right? Should I be able to cut paper with ease? Because it just tears the paper right now. Is this normal at this grit or should I be taking more metal off the edge to get it paper-cutting-sharp? I'm pretty sure I'm taking material off at the right places because of the Sharpie ink.
What do you guys think?

Thanks for your help guys,

BO-DACIOUS
 
You should be able to push cut phone book paper no problem... depending on the edge angles and thickness =) What angles are you using and what stones?
 
I'm using approx 22 degree angles for some folder knives is that right? I think the Sharpie might be gumming up my stone suddenly....... I cannot cuT paper well. How much time should I be spending on 1000 grit? I also might not be removing my burr properly. I'm just doing a couple strokes per side in a stropping motion to remove my burr. Is that right? What else would work? I've heard hard felt and soft wood like balsa is that right?
 
Jason B. I'm using a $9 6"x3/4" water whetstone. I'm worried I'm doing something wrong it's not nearly sharp enough...
What do you think?
 
Did you raise a burr on both sides on your coarse stone b4 moving up to the 1k? Sounds like you haven't apexed the edge completely...go back to your coarse stone and do even passes on both sides until you've raised a burr along the entire edge on both sides...then move up to your finer stones.

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Jason B. I'm using a $9 6"x3/4" water whetstone. I'm worried I'm doing something wrong it's not nearly sharp enough...
What do you think?

Im not a fan of cheap tools so my first suggestion would be to buy a better stone. Skill trumps the tools but starting with cheap tools while learning is not making anything easier on you.

Next, most sharpening problems can be solved by looking closer. Get the blade closer to your eyes and really inspect the scratch pattern, check for uniformity, check for burrs and anything that looks out of place. By watching your scratch pattern every few strokes you can adjust your sharpening stroke for consistency which will lead to a sharper edge. You can also use a bright lamp to inspect the edge for small burrs, the light will reflect brightly off even the smallest burr.

I would also reduce the sharpening angle, 15 degrees per side is ideal.
 
Hey guys, I'm just learning how to freehand sharpen my knives and its coming okay. I just started to use the method where you put Sharpie on your edge to know if you're removing material at the heel or tip (is that the correct lingo?) anyway, it seems to be helping a lot. I only have up to 1000 grit stones right now as I'm just learning. My question is: how sharp should my knife be at 1000# if I'm doing it right? Should I be able to cut paper with ease? Because it just tears the paper right now. Is this normal at this grit or should I be taking more metal off the edge to get it paper-cutting-sharp? I'm pretty sure I'm taking material off at the right places because of the Sharpie ink.
What do you guys think?

Thanks for your help guys,

BO-DACIOUS

As others have said, you should be able to cut paper after a 1K stone... many here stop at that level. Angle really isn't a huge issue (although it does matter)... even a pretty high angle will slice paper.

Keep in mind that the "Sharpie Method" doesn't work as well sharpening freehand, as it does on a guided system. On a guided system, you can easily see where metal is being removed consistently... with freehand, one stroke could remove the Sharpie, while all your other strokes could be hitting somewhere else. As Jason said, looking at your work, under magnification if needed, will give you a better idea of where you're hitting... and whether or not you're actually reaching the edge, or maybe taking some strokes too high, which will pretty much erase all your other work.

I'm using approx 22 degree angles for some folder knives is that right? I think the Sharpie might be gumming up my stone suddenly....... I cannot cuT paper well. How much time should I be spending on 1000 grit? I also might not be removing my burr properly. I'm just doing a couple strokes per side in a stropping motion to remove my burr. Is that right? What else would work? I've heard hard felt and soft wood like balsa is that right?

Assuming that you're actually apexing the edge and raising a burr, I also think your burr removal method may be lacking (and may be the actual problem). Doing a couple of light / alternating / edge leading / higher angle strokes on the stone is a better method IMO. "Steel Drake" has done some sharpening videos recently, in a couple he demonstrates this... might be worth a look.

Did you raise a burr on both sides on your coarse stone b4 moving up to the 1k? Sounds like you haven't apexed the edge completely...go back to your coarse stone and do even passes on both sides until you've raised a burr along the entire edge on both sides...then move up to your finer stones.

This also applies, although you don't necessarily need to go to a more coarse stone... a 1K stone is plenty coarse enough to set a bevel and raise a burr. But if you're bevels have become a 'mess' (which can happen when learning freehand), then setting it on a coarse stone as stated here is a good idea.

Also, as Jason said, you might look into a better stone. It's possible to get a sharp edge off a cheap stone, but first you need to know how to make a knife sharp, then you will know how to adjust to make a knife sharp on other material, that may require special techniques.
 
Its not so much the grit but the technique. After a medium grit stone with good technique you should be able to slice paper. Beyond the medium grit the finer you go the smoother the edge.
 
I use a 800 grit king stone for profiling an edge, then I use my 1,000 grit King stone to refine the edge a little, I make sure to strop the edge to remove the burr while sharpening too. I don't sharpen to a specific angle I go off of what feels comfortable and what looks like a solid angle, not too steep, not too shallow (this could be bad but I'm more comfortable with my edges this way). Then I do a slow and even pushing motion (like your scrubbing the floor) with the blade focusing only on what my hands feel so that I don't mess up whatever angle I may be holding the blade at. When I get to a curve/belly of a blade I just slightly drag the knive to the right or left along the edge, making sure to pay close attention to what I'm doing to keep an even grind. 1,000 grit seems to be enough of a balance between a mirror finish and a rough finish to me. I used to use a 3,000 grit stone too but now it seems a little excessive.

This might not work for everyone but I've gotten used to it and like the way my blades preform, and 1,000 grit is perfect for an edge finish

Hope this helped.
 
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Oh I think this it! I think I need to go back and create burs on a more course stone.
Thanks!!

BO-DACIOUS
 
Ok a lamp is a great idea I will try all your suggestions. But do you mean go from a 22 or so degree angle to a 15? Won't I just be working the heel as I believe it's called(correct me if I'm wrong)!
 
Okay, I don't know if these replies are going to the specific person I'm replying to because they're just piling up at the bottom but to cbwx34, thank you for all your suggestions I will take it all into consideration. I'm going to stop replying to individual people because it looks like my replies are just going to the bottom of the page and not being sent to anybody.
Thanks again guys

BO-DACIOUS
 
Getting a set of degree wedges to help in maintaining the angle of approach will advance your progress by leaps and bounds. Making each pass at the same angle as the previous pass will put you on the road to success. The human hand does no do well at guessing angles. Once your hand knows where 15 degrees is, it doesn't have a hard time in reproducing it, with a little help from a degree wedge. Using wedges makes the sharpening go much faster. Each pass is correct which makes the work go faster.

Sharpening an edge is all about maintaining proper angle with each pass if you want to accomplish this quickly and evenly.


Regards, Fred
 
This is definitely a technique issue. Some of my favorite high carbide steels work great stopping at 4 to 600 grit stones and believe me, they will quietly zip through paper.
Don't take my word for it, read Ankersons many threads.
Russ
 
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Ok thanks guys. I'll work on my technique and get a set of wedges. How do I know what degree wedge to use? I read that chef knives are around 18 or so give or take and outdoor knives are more like 22-23 is that true? What about pocket knives and any other type of knife?

Thanks again,

BO-DACIOUS
 
Ok thanks guys. I'll work on my technique and get a set of wedges. How do I know what degree wedge to use? I read that chef knives are around 18 or so give or take and outdoor knives are more like 22-23 is that true? What about pocket knives and any other type of knife?

Thanks again,

BO-DACIOUS


Generally speaking 30° inclusive or 15 per side is good for general work. Any more broad and the added edge durability also decreases cutting efficiency.

For dedicated kitchen knives and some woodworking knives you might go as low as 24° inclusive. Some of the "super steels" can be pushed even lower but in general, going thinner than mid to upper 20s will make the edge very weak when exposed to lateral stress.

Edit to add:
How "sharp" a 1000 grit JIS finish can be will depend on a bunch of factors like the stone in question and what sort of steel you're working on. Generally it should be capable of slicing paper and shaving some arm hair - with care and extra time spent it can push cut newsprint and cleanly shave arm hair or even dryshave some facial stubble.

You would be better off moving to a finer stone than trying to eke out the most the stone can produce, unless its all you have.
 
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