How to sharpen the tips of knives? having trouble

Bladenoobie1

Bladenoobie1

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Jul 20, 2012
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I'm able to get a great edge with the sharpmaker and a strop on my PM2, but I seem to have trouble on the tip. The tip is still relatively pointy, but no longer the uniform shape it was when I first got my knife. Any advice on how to sharpen tips well?

Thanks,
Bladenoobie
 
Disclaimer: I'm a novice sharpener. I get good tips on the edge pro, that's about it. When using the sharpmaker I used to tilt the handle up, so the edge at the tip is more or less horizontal and then rub it against the stones, or freehand just the tip. And not sharpen all the way out to the tip when doing the rest of the edge. On the strop, I do just the tip portion at the end if I haven't hit it properly when doing the rest of the edge.
 
same problem here also. what i do is tilt the handle of the knife away from the rod when the tip is about to reach the flat surface of the rod. doing this helps contact the edge of the tip and the rod. it helps a little but it doesn't get as sharp as i want it to be. any tips from the expert?
 
Also not an expert here but...

I'm not sure if everyone here is referring to tip sharpness as:

A. Having the edge of the blade be the same sharpness all the way to the very end.
B. Having the tip be sharp for piercing tasks. As in "needle sharp".

If it's A then working just the tip on the stone or sharpmaker can help a lot. I usually devote extra time to the last inch or maybe 1/2 inch when sharpening any blade. I've noticed that most people use the last inch or two of almost any blade more than any other part, so it's almost always more dull than the rest of the blade. Thus it requires more grinding in order to make the edge sharp again. It was a revelation for me when I realized that you can sharpen individual sections of a blade that require more or less attention. This is simple, but it was a big deal to me when I realized it.

If you're after B (needle sharp tip) then your tip probably needs to be reshaped. I find that some of mine end up rounded off when observed with magnification. There are two ways to correct it and you may have to use both. Surprisingly, grinding the *spine* of the knife, angled a bit towards the tip, can remove a lot of roundness and give you a very sharp tip again. To get it super pointy, you need to grind off enough of the spine to make it meet the edge at a flat spot.

If your blade is rounded off on the edge side, then you may have to grind this away also. Either by sharpening this area a lot until it is flat again (grinding away the excess that is round), or deliberately blunting the blade edge and grinding until it has a flat profile again, *then* resharpening this flat profiled edge until it is sharp.

I've had good success with grinding the spine a bit on some of my blades. It works surprisingly quickly. It can't fix everything on the tip, but it's a good start. Fixing the roundness on the edge side takes a lot more work, and I have very little experience with it.

Brian.
 
Usually once I feel I'm about done with the edge on a particular stone, I have to come back and spend a little time on the heel and tip.

I don't own a sharpmaker but I think the narrow-ness of the rods would make it a bit challenging. You don't want the tip to slide off of the rod, so you have a small lane you need to keep it in. But basically just make a few passes that begin maybe 1/2" from the tip, up to the tip. Use a sharpie to make sure you're actually getting to the tip each time.

For heavier reprofiling I like to use small circular motions around the belly and tip. You can more easily focus on a part of the blade versus a straight forward sweeping stroke. But I don't think the angle control is quite as good, so I will do the actual sharpening with the sweeping strokes.
 
No expert here, but do you have pics of the tip? Having trouble visualizing what you mean when you say, "no longer the uniform shape it was when I first got my knife." Do you mean it's not a fine point anymore? The sharpmaker (or any stone) will round the tip if you "swipe" the tip off of the surface. The trick is to stop your stroke dead with the tip still on the stone. That sharpens up to the point without rounding it off. If you need to reprofile the tip, that's easy: for a pointier tip, just remove more metal from below the edge. For more belly near the tip, sharpen around the tip more (but always sharpening *up to the tip* without taking the tip off the stone). Dunno if that helps. :D
 
I'll see if I can get some pics later, and I don't pull my knife off the stones to prevent rounding the tip off. I end my stroke with the tip on the stone.
 
Try using a sharpie to see if your sharpening all the way to the tip. If your trying not to let it slip off the stone, you might be over correcting and not reaching the tip.
 
I do use the sharpie trick on my edge, but I'll be sure to focus specifically on the tip today and see if I'm hitting it properly. Thanks for the advice everyone
 
Murray Carter has a trick that has worked for me, although I'm not sure why (and he admits in his video that he's not really sure why, either; he learned it from a Japanese master). When you are aiming to sharpen the tip and make it a nice "tack" point, consciously sharpen up to the tip, but don't sharpen the very point. It works.
 
Bladenoobie1 said:
Do you mean leave the very tip alone? I'm slightly confused by your statement.
Click to expand...

Haha I think that's kinda the point (pun intended) if it came from a Japanese sharpening master. The way I understand it is it's basically a mind game you're playing on yourself. By focusing directly on sharpening the tip, it's easy to inadvertently use too much pressure or increase your angle which will not yield the absolute sharpest of tips. By focusing on sharpening the edge just up to the tip you are probably making a cleaner more consistent stroke and most likely actually bringing the edge with the proper pressure and angle right up to the tip without grinding the tip down. I would also assume this philosophy is most effective at keeping an already sharp tip very sharp, but less effective at bringing back a blunted tip to needle sharpness. I don't know, that's just how I interpret a Japanese sharpening master's words.
 
sharpen and angle the handle up when your close to the tip. dont run the tip off of the stone. stop short before your tip slides off of the stone (thats how you round it off)
 
To accommodate a belly, the blade must be convex in shape when viewing it from above the spine. Take a look for yourself.

When you run the blade through the Sharpmaker on the flats of the stones, you have to very slightly steer the knife as you reach the tip or chance the tip not making contact.

EDIT: on second thought, what I just wrote has to be nonsense, as long as you are still properly tilting the knife on the downstroke, so that the contacting portion of the edge is horizontal.
 
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I've been using the Sharpmaker for some time and really like it, but I've had the same problem. I've tried, as recommended above, to leave the tip on the stones, but I find that somewhat challenging. What I generally do, with decent results, is really lighten up at the end of the stroke in an attempt to come straight off the stone (almost sounds like what the Japanese master recommended above). My tips aren't super pointy, but they're pretty good, and I console myself by thinking they're slightly stronger for it.

As for losing contact with the edge due to curvature of the blade and the changing angle, you can "steer" the stroke to keep the angle constant (as recommended above), but I tend to just reprofile a little at the end so as not to have to bother--resulting in a somewhat sharper bevel.
 
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