How tough CPM-3V really is?

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LostCause

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I love 3V. I never had issues with it. Stood up well even after hitting a bone. My personal experience with it is top notch. No complains from me.

And then I heard a guy complain about 3V Benchmade Leuku chipping upon probably hitting a pebble while he was chopping something in forest and he hit the dirt with a knife.

I head to Facebook - bit of digging and there's video of dude throwing Cold Steel Master Hunter into wooden chair, prying sideways to pull it out and - the tip snapping. That is very idiotic thing to do, but 3V is super hyped, and well...

Second video is guy using a hammer (metal hammer) to baton Cold Steel 3V SRK (also idiotic thing to do) and it broke within few hits.

I watched JoeX videos with several 3V knives from Cold Steel, Bark River, Bradford Guardian - and none of them were super impressive. In matter of fact, every single one of them has left me disappointed. Multiple knives in 1095, AUS8 and other "cheap steels" outperformed the 3V in way that not only they took more abuse, but they even had better edge stability upon impacting metal and brick.

Overall grind thicknesses, geometry and hardness are varying from these knives, but we keep coming back to the fact that knives in 3V might not be so ultra tough we imagined them to be. Which brings question of all these charts posting 3V up to the very top of tough steels when real world abuse tests show different data?

I know everything will fail given enough abuse, just 3V seems to be regularly failing from way less abuse than 1095.

3V is a way better steel in a way that it'll rust less and keep it's edge for longer than 1095 for example, but is it really that "super" as internet makes it to be? Every time when someone asks for reccomendation for tough knife - 3V is brought up. But real world abuse tests show different story.

What are your takes on it?
 
LostCause said:
What are your takes on it?
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Not particular to 3V, except at the end:

- I fail to understand the continued popularity of videos of people breaking things.

- If you work at it, you can break anything.

- People focus on the steel brand names too much.

- Heat treatment matters at least as much as the steel used. Probably more. I'd much prefer a well-done knife in 1095 than 3V with a crappy heat treat.

- If you want a good 3V heat treat, the name Carothers should be on your mind.
 
Once, Fredrik Haakonsen told me something like this: “if there where a pm steel tougher than A8mod (heat treated by him) or other clean cold work steel optimized for toughness, I would be using it”. Until today, he still uses A8mod in his survival/hard use knives. From that moment, I stopped looking at pm steels (I’m obsessed with toughness, don’t care for “wear resistance” or stainless).
 
From blog posts by Larrin Larrin :
high-alloy-toughness-7-20-22.png

low-alloy-steel-toughness-9-4-2022.png

stainless-toughness-10-19-21.jpg


At typical hardness levels, 3V falls in the 35-40lbft range. For the class of steels it falls into, that's toward the top end. But that's also comparable to 420HC and AEB-L...
 
OrangeBlueOrangeBlue said:
From blog posts by Larrin Larrin :
high-alloy-toughness-7-20-22.png

low-alloy-steel-toughness-9-4-2022.png

stainless-toughness-10-19-21.jpg


At typical hardness levels, 3V falls in the 35-40lbft range. For the class of steels it falls into, that's toward the top end. But that's also comparable to 420HC and AEB-L...
Click to expand...
So well heat treated AEB-L really might be one of the best steels for fixed blades.

Tough, stainless and easy to get sharp. Edge retention is nothing special, but it has plenty of other positive qualities to make up for it.
 
LostCause said:
Pretty lame
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Nope ...that describes the type of "testing " JoeX and similar performances designed for the clicks baiting . 😒

Not everything on YouTube is misleading crap , but you have to be more selective if you lack judgement .

Look for testers that are consistent , methodical and do relevant testing for how you might properly use a knife in extremis .
 
DeadboxHero said:
Obvious answer: thicken edge angle, problem solved.
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Not necessarily.

That's like saying that a scalpel that chipped should have had a more thickness behind the edge. I'm pretty sure the surgeon doesn't want a sharpened pry bar.

Some people want the thinnest grind possible (while not losing significant edge retention) for slicing. Yes, you have to be careful what you are slicing into (hidden dangers), but I would rarely if ever sacrifice slicing ability for more robust edge retention achieved by a more obtuse edge bevel ("survival" knives being the notable exception).

Yes, it's a compromise but some like their knives slicey and I would rather lose a point or two of HRC to gain some toughness in order to have a durable thin edge, rather than changing my edge geometry and compromise slicing ability.

YMMV.
 
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shane45-1911 said:
Not necessarily.

That's like saying that a scalpel that chipped should have had a more thickness behind the edge. I'm pretty sure the surgeon doesn't want a sharpened pry bar.

Some people want the thinnest grind possible (while not losing significant edge retention) for slicing. Yes, you have to be careful what you are slicing into (hidden dangers), but I would rarely if ever sacrifice slicing ability for more robust edge retention achieved by a more obtuse edge bevel ("survival" knives being the notable exception).

Yes, it's a compromise but some like their knives slicey and I would rather lose a point or two of HRC to gain some toughness in order to have a durable thin edge, rather than changing my edge geometry and compromise slicing ability.

YMMV.
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Dawson’s big bear is a perfect example of that. Not really a fan of hollow grinds, but they do it right.
 
Agree with the heat treat comments. My 3v experience has been with PHT and mainly with Carothers which have both been fantastic. D3V will never be out of style, I’ve put CPKs through the paces and it really shines in all things blade steel.
 
LostCause said:
So well heat treated AEB-L really might be one of the best steels for fixed blades.

Tough, stainless and easy to get sharp. Edge retention is nothing special, but it has plenty of other positive qualities to make up for it.
Click to expand...

Yes, but I'm pretty biased as it's the steel of choice for most of what I sell. It's uncommon, but it makes a swell machete blade too.

"One of the best" is a little misleading, but it is a great choice. It's very versatile.
 
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No experience with 3v, but as I amble through life I've learned to temper ( Everyone see what I did there?😛) my expectations of anything billed as super tough or unbreakable. A bit of care and common sense go a long way. The only way I've found to not break something is to not use it, and that's not why I have tools.
 
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