Importing ivory and antique tortoise shell into US

[castor0troy]

Hi Guys
I have some custom knives with handles made of hippo ivory,stag and antique tortoise shell.

The problem is that the knives are outside the US and i would like to ship them to the US without the cites certificates.

Does anyone have a solution for this?
Anyone faced a similar situation with the US customs?

Thanks for helping.
Sam

 

[Mark Knapp]

You need to check with the USF&W office nearest you. The stag does not require a CITES permit, the the tortoise shell most certainly does. The hippo may only need a certification that it is hippo and not something else. If you tried to do this without the proper permits, they would most likely be confiscated. People are watching these thing closely now. What country would they be coming from?

 

[castor0troy]

Thank you for the reply Markk.
So ive been reading a lot online and it does appear that there is a ban on antique tortoise shell.
Im trying to import the knives from Asia.
is there anyway around this?

I have seen so many custom knives with tortoise shell for sale.
what happens to those knives if there is a ban on the knife material itself?

Also can someone check if Oosic(walrus penis bone) needs a cites certificate as well?

 

[Buckberg]

 

[AVigil]

is there anyway around this?

Prison

 

[Mark Knapp]

Thank you for the reply Markk.
So ive been reading a lot online and it does appear that there is a ban on antique tortoise shell.
Im trying to import the knives from Asia.
is there anyway around this?

I have seen so many custom knives with tortoise shell for sale.
what happens to those knives if there is a ban on the knife material itself?

Also can someone check if Oosic(walrus penis bone) needs a cites certificate as well?

There is no way around it. You must comply and there is a reason for it. Ultimately we need to take care of the worlds populations of endangered species and CITES is the way we do it.

Yes, walrus, any part of a walrus is covered under CITES.

I ship legal ivory overseas from time to time. A CITES permit is not that hard to get, generally it costs three to four hundred dollars per shipment, not per item, and takes about three months to get. It sounds as though your knife shipment may be large enough to make the investment of the permit worthwhile.

Unfortunately, parts of Asia are the trouble hot spots when it comes to illegal ivory. You can never be sure that what you are getting is not illegal. That's why we need CITES.

One more thing, you would have to be pretty naive to think that there is not someone in the USF&W service who monitors this site and others (like taxidermy sites) for discussions like the one we are having. They have computers that search for key words on chat sites like "import, walrus, sea turtle and ivory etc." There have been several people already prosecuted that have been and are frequent visitors to this site that have been doing illegal stuff.

Do the right thing, or walk away from the deal. It's people that try and get around the regulations that are making it harder for those that are willing to do it the right way. Nuf said?

 

[betzner]

One more thing, you would have to be pretty naive to think that there is not someone in the USF&W service who monitors this site and others (like taxidermy sites) for discussions like the one we are having. They have computers that search for key words on chat sites like "import, walrus, sea turtle and ivory etc." There have been several people already prosecuted that have been and are frequent visitors to this site that have been doing illegal stuff.

Do the right thing, or walk away from the deal. It's people that try and get around the regulations that are making it harder for those that are willing to do it the right way. Nuf said?

You should believe every word Mark has mentioned above. I happen to know for a fact that the information he is giving you is correct.

 

[Arthur Washburn]

Another thing to consider is state law. There are a few states that go further than the Fed and ban OUTRIGHT possesion of any ivory (including preban and mammoth), rayskin, tortise shell and many types of animal hides.

 

[ericdraven]

like said , you will get caught and fined out the ass. i got lucky years ago with a sperm wale tooth handled knife , the knife make never went thru proper channels and even got jail time , but i got my knife even thou i felt bad for him . i always ecpected a letter to return knife but never came

 

[betzner]

Another thing to consider is state law. There are a few states that go further than the Fed and ban OUTRIGHT possesion of any ivory (including preban and mammoth), rayskin, tortise shell and many types of animal hides.

Those few states you refer to do not ban possession but do ban possession with intent to sell, sale and all forms of transfer. But they do not ban possession. Two of four or five states in question are, for instance, California and New York, neither of which ban pure possession.

 

[Mark Knapp]

Those few states you refer to do not ban possession but do ban possession with intent to sell, sale and all forms of transfer. But they do not ban possession. Two of four or five states in question are, for instance, California and New York, neither of which ban pure possession.

That's right, New York, New Jersey, Hawaii, and California have banned the trade of ivory in the state but not possession. Recently a couple of new states banned it also Vermont I think was one of them. #Doug Ritter #Critter can you help us?

 

[Elgatodeacero]

i have been doing some research on turtle shell (shell from the hawksbill turtle and a few other species), and one thing I have been seeing is comments that listed turtle species shell, even if antique, cannot be changed in form.

for example, an antique hawksbill turtle shell hairbrush handle apparently cannot be cut up and made into knife handles. im not sure if this is accurate, and US FWS info is less than clear.

it is important to protect these endangered species, and it is sad that poverty causes many people in countries with listed animals to harvest beyond sustainability.

there are some interesting reports from conservation groups online about the junky trinkets like earrings and similar stuff, that the last remaining listed sea turtles are being turned into.

these studies also report that these items are selling for very low dollar value in open air markets.

i sometimes wonder of making all trade in a species illegal is a poor practice since it eliminates all economic value to locals for a species of wildlife. i believe locals would have more incentive to protect habitat and turtles if they could harvest a limited number and sell for big bucks to Americans and others.

 

[not2sharp]

....
it is important to protect these endangered species, and it is sad that poverty causes many people in countries with listed animals to harvest beyond sustainability.....

It is even more unfortunate that the very prohibition against legal hunting is what often leads to the poverty and over harvesting.

i sometimes wonder of making all trade in a species illegal is a poor practice since it eliminates all economic value to locals for a species of wildlife. i believe locals would have more incentive to protect habitat and turtles if they could harvest a limited number and sell for big bucks to Americans and others.

That's right. Also, keep in mind that some of these "endangered" animals are destructive and dangerous. They are not the kind of thing you would want running around near your back yard and you should appreciate that these people often feel the same.

n2s

 

[Mark Knapp]

That's right, New York, New Jersey, Hawaii, and California have banned the trade of ivory in the state but not possession. Recently a couple of new states banned it also Vermont I think was one of them. #Doug Ritter #Critter can you help us?

The newest states are Vermont and Illinois. Check your state regs to see how they pertain to you.