is black raven authentic?

R

Rick Holt

Joined
Feb 19, 2019
Messages
46
He guys , take a look at double bit black raven that just came on eBay for sale , $660 . Tell me if it looks authentic , test your axe knowledge!
 
The 3 weight stamp is kind of a distinctive font. Do any other black ravens have it?

I could definitely be wrong but my gut feeling says fake. I’ll be curious to hear what others think that have more knowledge then I do on the topic.
 
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Although I am generally of the opinion that there are not as many counterfeit axes out there as people fear, this one looks dubious to me.
Like that other fake one a few weeks ago, looks like it was made on the back of the axe.

The axe was blackened to look uniform but in general shows a lot of wear and use while the stamp looks perfect. It’s also the old, pre-1930 logo looking that good on a beat up axe.
My old logo BR is badly worn down, both bits and the embossing. It’s not like entropy spared the embossing while the arrow of time took its toll on the rest of the axe.

And it’s also suspect when they can’t pull off at least one good photo in the listing.
I wouldn’t touch it, even if is were real you could do way better than the $1000 Buy It Now price.

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I might be over analyzing it now, but I don’t even like that it is being displayed on express shipping packaging. I would want to see a piece like that coming out of someone’s collection.
 
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Looks authentic to me, I would need to check some old photographs of mine, but I believe I've had the weight stamp on either side of the axe, and the number 3 does not look like an unfamiliar font to me. What strikes me as funny is that the guy says its a 3.5 pound head, so the stamp should be Big 3 little 2 where the stamp here suggests it's a straight 3 pound head. Maybe just an error on his part reading the scale, or just assumed like most heads that it's at 3.5
There are a couple marks on the etch from tool strike, but overall seems to be in-line with the condition of the rest of the head.
He has other axes in his Ebay account, that show similar cleaning methods.
I would say that it is a legitimate Raven.
 
Blue Sasquatch said:
Looks authentic to me, I would need to check some old photographs of mine, but I believe I've had the weight stamp on either side of the axe, and the number 3 does not look like an unfamiliar font to me. What strikes me as funny is that the guy says its a 3.5 pound head, so the stamp should be Big 3 little 2 where the stamp here suggests it's a straight 3 pound head. Maybe just an error on his part reading the scale, or just assumed like most heads that it's at 3.5
There are a couple marks on the etch from tool strike, but overall seems to be in-line with the condition of the rest of the head.
He has other axes in his Ebay account, that show similar cleaning methods.
I would say that it is a legitimate Raven.
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This is well stated and I certainly have to yield to your knowledge and experience.
Still wouldn’t buy it but I am somewhat less skeptical of its authenticity now.
 
That axe doesn't look like the quality level of the black ravens I've seen. It resembles the older Woodslasher line's quality level judging by the pics. It appears to have lower quality hallmarks when it's supposedly pre-1930. All my pre 1930's axes are very beveled and very clean looking while this one isn't even at the same level of quality as my later Flint Edges. I'd say fake.
 
Another observation that I missed earlier. If the delineation of the tempered part is so obvious the difference between the soft steel and the overlaid bit should also be present. I know(as far as my axes and what I've read) that for at least a decade after AFH purchased Kelly they were still using overlaid bits. So that should be present on this one supposedly made before '30 and It clearly is not. Every time I've chemically cleaned an old axe you can easily see both the different steels and the tempered portion. I'm not saying that no mono steel ravens were made but that definitely none were made pre AFH(1930).
 
The reason I brought this question to the BladeForums , is last February l was the one who almost ended up buying the fake double bit raven with the eye ridges that was on a shadow bevel axe head with weight next to embossing . The seller was also from California, had no previous sales , had 2 other heads for sale and used similar phrases in his story ! Through PayPal I got my money back , also seller asked for reason I felt head was fake and I told him raven did not use eye ridges and they weren’t put on axe heads until 1960 , never on pre 1930 axe heads . I’m not saying it’s fake and that’s why I brought that question to you all ! All of you have decades of experience and you helped me from making a mistake on fake I almost bought last February.
 
Yankee Josh said:
Another observation that I missed earlier. If the delineation of the tempered part is so obvious the difference between the soft steel and the overlaid bit should also be present. I know(as far as my axes and what I've read) that for at least a decade after AFH purchased Kelly they were still using overlaid bits. So that should be present on this one supposedly made before '30 and It clearly is not. Every time I've chemically cleaned an old axe you can easily see both the different steels and the tempered portion. I'm not saying that no mono steel ravens were made but that definitely none were made pre AFH(1930).
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You are saying that this Raven may be fake, because you can't see any temper lines on it? Looks pretty clear in the photo. . .

ithinkverydeeply said:
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I would ask for more photographs, outside in the sun, if I were going to drop $600 plus on the axe, and further assess things, but as it stands I see no evidence of foul play.



Rick Holt said:
A follow up , lm not saying this individual is dishonest, I’m just saying that I’m gun shy now . I’ve bought several ravens that I feel we’re from reliable sellers and have quenched that craving , time to add something new to the herd .
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Blue Sasquatch said:
You are saying that this Raven may be fake, because you can't see any temper lines on it? Looks pretty clear in the photo. . .



I would ask for more photographs, outside in the sun, if I were going to drop $600 plus on the axe, and further assess things, but as it stands I see no evidence of foul play.
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Nah that's not what I said. Maybe I wasn't clear though I thought I was. The temper lines are obvious. And so, if it's a pre '30 axe, the line between the bit steel and soft steel should be easily seen as well.
 
Strange that the very uniform pitting skips around the stamp.

They'll correct that on the next one and we won't be able to tell. That's why I wouldn't go near an ebay Black Raven right now. Too many fakes and they've gotten very good at aging them.
 
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