Is it legal to carry handcuff keys concealed?

[Wesp666]

In florida?

Seems like a good idea to me, could save you a lot of trouble in certain situations...

 

[Ken C.]

Once again I am moving another thread.

This off to the Knife Laws Forum. Seems like a logical place given the question at hand.

 

[ACMarina]

The only way I could see it saving any trouble is if you'd happen to be "playing" with your signifigant other and happen to lose the main key. I don't know what exactly you're referring to, but here in Ohio if you're handcuffed you're probably arrested, and if you managed to somehow escape the restraints you'd be in a lot more trouble.

Let's just start with that - what would you want to do it for anyway? It is late, and maybe I'm just not thinking clearly enough to come up with something logical here. It definately wouldn't be the first time, either, but at 1.12 in the AM there's only one reason why you'd need a concealed handcuff key, and it's not smart or legal. .

 

[loki88]

The only time i used concealed handcuff keys is during training excercises as a LEO trainer for new cops. I also find this a strange question to ask, in that i don't see any legitimed reason for that question? Remember that LEO REALLY dislike these types of action, because it will make us REALLY nervous! Those handcuffs are not there to mess with u, but as a means of transportion a potential dangerous individual. If u get caught in the posession with these keys it will defenitely be an act of "criminal" intent. It might not be illegal, but it will give the LEO a good reason to give u a VERY thorough investigation. Don't try to play the innocent victim afterwards because the possesion of these keys can only have the intent to escape from the law.

 

[drunken tiger]

Come to think of it, I have a handcuffs key on my keychain, I had forgotten all about it... for the reason ACMarina suggested

Maybe I should take it off, I'd rather not have explain that to a LEO

 

[tallpaul]

I also find this a strange question to ask, in that i don't see any legitimed reason for that question? Remember that LEO REALLY dislike these types of action, because it will make us REALLY nervous!

Typical LEO attitude... I actually needed one for the time a trained officer put one side of the cuff on me at church "goofing around" and realized he left his key at home. I wore that bracelet for quite a while that day for no one had thiers on them that day. Here in the US we do not have to prove "need" for alot of things that officers take upon themselves to judge us for and its BULL. I also am sorry that officers feel the need to cuff someone for thier protection or because they are nervous- maybe they should find a different line of work if they act out of fear... they have that option,We citizens don't have the option of ignoring them. I really don't like the they are above everybody attitude. We just had an officer wear his gun into the church when it is posted no weapons- no one said anything but me- #1 he was out of his juristiction #2 if my carry permit does not allow carrying in the church due to it being posted he should have no more rights than me. I called him on it and he got a little miffed. I am sorry but LEO is no more special than the rest of us and they really should not be able to pull off half the crap they do...

 

[Wesp666]

I never said I would use them if I was lawfully arrested, but if I was unlawfully arrested (like by a rent-a-cop for something I didn't do). In a mass-arrest situation (barfight, riot, etc.) and I was innocent I could unlock them and walk off in the confusion. This may be a little paranoid, but what if you were bound up in handcuffs by terrorists, bank robbers, etc and were left alone because they thought you were tied up...


Also, see this post.

 

[IronKnuckles]

I seem to remember reading in a little florida statute book that it is illegal to have a handcuff key on you. You should probably try looking it up for yourself though.

 

[ACMarina]

I'd personally rather have a good knife than a handcuff key in most situations. Really, a quality pair of cuffs are expensive, and in most cases of mass detainment or something like that you're more likely to see zipties or rope or something. Quite a few LEOs that I've seen carry ziptie style restraints anyway, so they don't have to worry about biological contamination on their good metal cuffs.

Of course, I've talked to many an officer who's been called out at odd hours of the night to let somebody "borrow" the key to unlock their parter after a wild night of passion leads to a missing key. .

 

[Grover_Cephas]

I carry a handcuff key on my keychain, but I have a "good reason". See, I'm on the tech crew of my local Rocky Horror show. And every once in a while, the little gothlets brinig handcuffs along with 'em, and pretend to be dedicated perverts. More than once in our area, Rocky casts have had minor incidents involving keyless handcuffs, so I carry a key in case we have a similar problem. Better to be prepared, right? I've had lock-picking equipment sent to me under the same premise. Turns out most mail-order businesses have a broad definition for the word "locksmith".

(A Pennsylvania cast once had a problem with a pair of hinged cuffs, too--the idiot snapped both cuffs onto one wrist as a "bracelet"... keyholes together. The key was available, but the keyways weren't accessable. Evidently, nobody knew how to shim a cuff. I don't carry around a handcuff shim, but I _do_ have a pull-back-and-go toy car in my tech bag for just that purpose. The mainspring makes a perfect shim. I've managed to open Peerless, Hiatts, and Clejuso cuffs that way. Never tried it with Smith & Wesson.)

 

[ACMarina]

Rocky!

 

[Merek]

... but if I was unlawfully arrested (like by a rent-a-cop for something I didn't do). In a mass-arrest situation (barfight, riot, etc.) and I was innocent.... This may be a little paranoid, but what if you were bound up in handcuffs by terrorists, bank robbers, etc and were left alone because they thought you were tied up....

I carried a 3.5" antique skeleton key on my keychain for years in case I got locked in a haunted house. Never needed it.
I think AC hit it right. A mass arrest situation will involve zip-ties. Robbers and terrorists aren't going to go buy a case of handcuffs either. A nice little Spyder or minimulti is better.
Perhaps you can hide it where the sun don't shine so it will be handy when the situation actually occurs.
Being prepared is not paranoid, but your reasons are pushing the limits. Don't watch so much TV.

 

[beachside39]

I don't see the purpose in making a key illegal; but then, law doesn't have to fit my perception of reasonableness. I understand that it's also illegal in some places to wear body armor too.

I've owned handcuffs since I was 10 years old and still keep a key on my keychain in case I need to take them off from someone else. I have cuffs in my truck, just in case they're needed. My thought is that I could restrain a felon pending arrival of police rather than killing him. Perhaps that would be illegal while killing him in self defense would be OK. That woudn't surprise me. It's like the laws making possession of a switchblade knife illegal while licensed to carry handguns.

With a little practice, I could open the cuffs with a paper clip anyway. I think that paper clips are still legal.

 

[Daniel Koster]

if the perp wants to get away bad enough....your cuffs will not stop him. you have no authority to arrest - which makes for some good incentive to take off.

The only times I have personally ever heard of, or witnessed, citizen arrests usually involved a very large man practically sitting on the guy....and lots of threatening verbage/behavior.

If you have the guts to do that....you don't need no stinkin' handcuffs.....

Just a good grip.....headlock....half/full nelson....barrel hold....or big gut....that'll do the trick.

 

[Wesp666]

Hey Merek, I don't watch T.V.

Don't want to turn into a zombie, like many sad, overweight young children, that watch more than 2 hours of TV a Day.

 

[Dysentery Bob]

Interesting post which brings out many opinions.
From my knowledge, its not illegal in Georgia to have a hand cuff key on your person. With that in mind, if you are hand cuffed and searched, it may or may not be found. If it is, I'll just toss it out if your going to jail, your in hand cuffs for a reason. If I don't find and you get out of the cuffs, and attempt to walk away, Ill also charge you with everything I legally can to make your life hell. Once back in custody, I'll shackle you and place hinge handcuffs and standard cuffs on you to prevent you from doing this again. But again, I do not know of any law in Georgia making it illegal to posses handcuff keys.

Remember, police officers have been killed in the line of duty by arrested suspects who had these hidden keys on them, so I am very suspicious of persons with these items when they are in the opposite occupation as mine. The LOD incident involved the two Flordi detectives who unknownly had custody of a murder. He killed both of the detectives, a child and then took his own life. That dead suspect girlfriend knew he lied about his identity and now she is being charged for the deaths, I hope she burns.

In response to TallPaul's statements, in any line of work, you always have idiots/*******s. The statement "...Typical LEO attitude..." is out of place. Unless you know every LEO in the USA, you can't make a generalized statement like this. That is like saying all white Southerners are rednecks that live in trailor parks. It's wrong to assume.

To continue on, not all contacts on the street are cuffed for our safety. Thats only utilized when have reason to do so. If I am dealing with a suspect or multiple suspects that give me clue / signs that they are deceptive or that they furtive in movements, then I will take all precautions to safe guard others as well as myself. If that means everyone goes into handcuffs until I complete my investigation, so be it.

Last of all is the fact that this officer carried his off-duty weapon into church. Even if its out of his jurisdiction, does that mean criminals don't travel or go to church? What happens to this officer and his family while on the way to or from church when he bumps into a person who is carring a grudge against him. If he follows your train of though and goes unarmed, both he and his family may be killed. Remember the phrase, "...a dead witness is a good witness..."

Tell you what, this may make you mad, but I'll carry my weapon(both guns and knives) anywhere I can, even outside of my jurisdiction. Now I will not carry in a foreign nation, then again I live in the beautiful USA, so I have many places to visit here so I don't have to leave our borders. If I am with my family, you can bet I am armed, if you don't like it, tough for you. The City of Savannah pays me to police my city and county for less than $20.00 per hour. That does not mean that I am going to sacrifice my safety, the safety of my fellow officer or my families for anybody.
Also here is a little clue for you, officers in a Court of law are held at a higher standards that your average non-LEO. We are even held at a higher standard that corrupt lawyers, go figure. That means we face higher penalties and sentences.

Remember that you ask these people to put their lives on the line to protect and serve for peanuts for salaries, then slap them in the face for every thing you have a gripe about. You never take into account that the families of officers are also at risk since they are always soft targets for retribution. I could continue, but I will not. It would serve no purpose to do so, I expect you to respond that maybe I should leave my job if I am concerned about my family. So I'll tell you this, I am a cop to the core, I'll live my life to the standards expected of me by both the department and my family. I have accepted the risks as well as the benefits given to police officers. So if you a problem with police officers, the next time you need one, don't call and solve your own problem. You will then find our true value.

To others on this post, sorry for the rant, long day and tired of cop bashing people who have no clue.

Opps, again, as for as I know, its still not illegal to carry a hand cuff key here. If you have one, just tell the officer that you other half is kind of kinky and you like to have an escape plan in case they get too rough.

 

[T. Erdelyi]

I carry a handcuff key on my keychain, but I have a "good reason". See, I'm on the tech crew of my local Rocky Horror show. .... I've had lock-picking equipment sent to me under the same premise. Turns out most mail-order businesses have a broad definition for the word "locksmith".

I used to go to New Brunswick in Jersey to the Rocky Horror Midnight showing back in the late 70's early 80's, lots of wackos lining the street, what a blast, where are there shows playing now, I live just over the Delaware in PA 1/2 hour from Flemington, I'd like to take my kid to a show.

I always carry a key, I used to use S&W handcuffs to lock the forks to the frame of my motorcycle, a cheap solution for a fork lock.

Most places use the Websters Dictionary definition of a locksmith "A worker who makes or repairs locks."

 

[Grover_Cephas]

I used to go to New Brunswick in Jersey to the Rocky Horror Midnight showing back in the late 70's early 80's, lots of wackos lining the street, what a blast, where are there shows playing now, I live just over the Delaware in PA 1/2 hour from Flemington, I'd like to take my kid to a show.

There used to be an outstanding cast in Mt Ephraim, NJ (right across the river from Philadelphia), but unfortunately, their theater went out of business and they disappeared.

In NJ, you're left with the Edison (Woodbridge) show, which is pretty lackluster, and ours, in Upper Montclair, which is the best show on this side of the country (sure, I'm biased, but it's also true ). Bit of a trek, but I think it's worth it (hell, I do it once a week--either it's worth it, or I'm nuts).

We perform every Saturday night at midnight (yeah, yeah; it's technically Sunday morning...), but we have three shows for Halloween this weekend, Friday and Saturday nights at midnight, and Sunday night at 9:30. Our shows usually run at least a half hour late, but you're best off showing up a bit early on Halloween--it's our biggest show of the year, and we tend to sell out the theater. Hence the three shows.

See our website at http://www.homeofhappiness.com/

Hope you can make it sometime. If you do, ask for Mike of the Kids. That's the way they know me there. And why don't you bring one of those ring-knives of yours, while you're at it?

Most places use the Websters Dictionary definition of a locksmith "A worker who makes or repairs locks."

I must've hit a lenient dealer, then. He considered janitors, maintenance, and tech crews eligible because "they're likely to be called on to open locks in their line of work".

 

[peter nap]

To give you a serious answer instead of the typical LEO gibberish. It depends on your state. In Virginia the answer us yes can carry them any way you wish, and many people do carry them. To be honest, I don't know of any state that has laws against them.

Handcuffs are not hard to pick or slip. You should learn to do that also if you are concerned. As far as a serious interview with a LEO who has found them on you. Know your rights, exercise your rights and know a good attorney if your rights are violated.

 

[tallpaul]

"In response to TallPaul's statements, in any line of work, you always have idiots/*******s. The statement "...Typical LEO attitude..." is out of place. Unless you know every LEO in the USA, you can't make a generalized statement like this. That is like saying all white Southerners are rednecks that live in trailor parks. It's wrong to assume. "

Actually this statement is no different than what you are saying here Bob only in reverse, LEO do not approch people as innocent even though most are... not everyone you encounter in your work is a criminal and for the most part LEO's look at everybody as though they are ... untill proven innocent at least till they judge them to be so ....

"To continue on, not all contacts on the street are cuffed for our safety. Thats only utilized when have reason to do so. If I am dealing with a suspect or multiple suspects that give me clue / signs that they are deceptive or that they furtive in movements, then I will take all precautions to safe guard others as well as myself. If that means everyone goes into handcuffs until I complete my investigation, so be it. "

That is somewhat reasonable though I don't beleieve that if I am innocent I need to pay for you to be safe... or to prove to you that I am not a threat

"Last of all is the fact that this officer carried his off-duty weapon into church. Even if its out of his jurisdiction, does that mean criminals don't travel or go to church? What happens to this officer and his family while on the way to or from church when he bumps into a person who is carring a grudge against him. If he follows your train of though and goes unarmed, both he and his family may be killed. Remember the phrase, "...a dead witness is a good witness..."

AS I said what makes LEO more important than me or mine? THATS where the attitude is... and you have some of it at least more that likely more of it than you think ,realize or admit too. YOU are not anymore important than me or anyone else just because you happen to be LEO. YOU are NOT LESS IMPORTANT just not more important or deserving,but most LEO don't see it that way, at least not in my experience... do you even understand what I am saying or is your ability to see it clouded because you are LEO?

Tell you what, this may make you mad, but I'll carry my weapon(both guns and knives) anywhere I can, even outside of my jurisdiction. Now I will not carry in a foreign nation, then again I live in the beautiful USA, so I have many places to visit here so I don't have to leave our borders. If I am with my family, you can bet I am armed, if you don't like it, tough for you. The City of Savannah pays me to police my city and county for less than $20.00 per hour. That does not mean that I am going to sacrifice my safety, the safety of my fellow officer or my families for anybody.
Also here is a little clue for you, officers in a Court of law are held at a higher standards that your average non-LEO. We are even held at a higher standard that corrupt lawyers, go figure. That means we face higher penalties and sentences. "

They you go again- you can break the law and it is ok-you'll do what you want, but what about a guy in your juristiction carrying for protection but not "LEGAL" to do so- will you cuff and stuff him? why do you feel that you and yours are worthy and us "peeons" are not? As far as held accountable to higher levels.. oh sure only if it would cause a political problem for your bosses then you are disposable, read the Brass Wall... only time LEO is held responsible to a higher level is for publicity...

"Remember that you ask these people to put their lives on the line to protect and serve for peanuts for salaries, then slap them in the face for every thing you have a gripe about. You never take into account that the families of officers are also at risk since they are always soft targets for retribution. I could continue, but I will not. It would serve no purpose to do so, I expect you to respond that maybe I should leave my job if I am concerned about my family. So I'll tell you this, I am a cop to the core, I'll live my life to the standards expected of me by both the department and my family. I have accepted the risks as well as the benefits given to police officers. So if you a problem with police officers, the next time you need one, don't call and solve your own problem. You will then find our true value."

More of the ME AND MY FAMILY ARE MORE WORTHY BLAH BLAH...BLAH :yawn: ...btw IF I wait for LEO when I need them more than likely all they can do is secure a scene or fill out the report. How often do they actively stop or end something? Not too often. Now the presence helps quite a bit, the job is important But I have stopped whats needed stoppin and have helped others ,firefighters and LEO many times over the years and contrary to what you may think from this post I don't have a problem other than the superior attitude crap that even YOU are supporting by your response here.




May GOD BLESS You and keep you safe Bob- and I do mean that...