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I disagree - for me - and think D1ce's post is fair and accurate.
Is the Sebenza that great?
- Thread starter JoepReinen
- Start date
I disagree - for me - and think D1ce's post is fair and accurate.
What's wrong with my Omega you bast'd??
haha!I had the pleasure of a regular Sebbie and now a Sebenza25. Chris Reeve was the pioneer in engineering the titanium frame lock way back when manufacturers only dabbled in steel liner locks. There's a reason spyderco licenses the RIL in their titanium frame locks. Fit and finish is second to none, INCLUDING customs. CPM worked with him to create the S30V, the first steel engineered for knife blades. Sure, his knives might not be the flashiest with the latest this, or the latest that. Sure there may be prettier knives out there. But from the utilitarian point of view, the design is damn near perfect. There's a reason it holds it's value.
marthinus
Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider
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Well...I have not posted this in a while so guess its time again. Posted this last year.
Well, here is some food for thought, or just some good reading material regarding tight tolerances, that CRK is renowned for, locks and high dollar knives that Sal Glesser, owner of Spyderco has mentioned through the years on the forums (ps, search is your friend).
Another thing to remember is that the Manufacturing Quality award that CRK has won so many times are not chosen by a panel, it is voted for by fellow knife makers. Even Bob Dozier, a very established maker in his own right has CRK pocket knives and I love his motto of : if it feels like climbing through a barbed wire fence, there is something wrong. Slim, sleek and simple knives.
[video=youtube;nI_73zvGx5Y]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nI_73zvGx5Y[/video]
At the same time there are many people that feel the knife is not worth it, I did until I read Sal Glesser's comments and bought one myself after 3 years of saving (the knife was later taken in a mugging) and I was UTTERLY UNDERWHELMED when I bought it, even though I handled it before hand I just felt like owning something of true quality for the first time in my life (like a good quality car/suite/watch/camera). Until I used it non stop, on the farm etc and everything just started "flowing" and making sence. I replaced the stolen knife with an Insingo. I will always have a CRK and they retail for around $625 here. They are, for me at least, worth it and my personal connection, what the Sebenza has meant in my life, makes it special for me.
I have rambled a bit, but I hope some of what I have said has helped you to form your own opinion on the matter.
Well, here is some food for thought, or just some good reading material regarding tight tolerances, that CRK is renowned for, locks and high dollar knives that Sal Glesser, owner of Spyderco has mentioned through the years on the forums (ps, search is your friend).
Another thing to remember is that the Manufacturing Quality award that CRK has won so many times are not chosen by a panel, it is voted for by fellow knife makers. Even Bob Dozier, a very established maker in his own right has CRK pocket knives and I love his motto of : if it feels like climbing through a barbed wire fence, there is something wrong. Slim, sleek and simple knives.
[video=youtube;nI_73zvGx5Y]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nI_73zvGx5Y[/video]
A few weeks back, in this thread, someone asked if there was a Spyderco which could compete with the Sebenza. Sal eventually chimed in. His post was primarily a response to someone's skepticism regarding the origins of the framelock. He noted that he had, in his personal collection, a Chris Reeve knife with an earlier lock of Chris' called the "Lock 45". He further noted that it dated back to the 1970's and was the predecessor of the Reeve Integral Lock. That lead to someone asking what it looked like, at which point he suggested sending it to me to be photographed. He also noted in a later post that it was a small knife. It arrived a couple days ago and he wasn't kidding about its size. For the benefit of those who like "dimensional data" it weighs 1.375 ounces (40 grams) has a closed length of 2 13/16" (71 mm), a blade length of 2 7/32" (57mm) with a 2 1/16" (52mm) cutting edge, and is 5/16" (8mm) thick. For those who find photographic comparisons easier to visualize, the first photo below shows it with a Kiwi and my LH Mnandi.
Beyond that, it's an intriguing design. The action is glassy smooth and the lock up is rock solid despite the fact that the blade is only supported from one side. The small thumb stud and smooth handle, thin on the off side, make it difficult to open, but might be less of a problem for someone right handed and with better motor skills. No clip, that was probably not even a gleam in Sal's eye yet. I'm assuming the handle is titanium anodized to a bronze hue but that, and any other questions regarding it would best be answered by Sal, or someone intimately familiar with Chris Reeve's early knives.
Closed, lock side:
close up, to show one of the two ball bearings:
The balls do not serve as detents, just to smooth the action. Only friction holds the blade closed.
Another close up, note the angled locking surfaces on the blade...
Lock side view, half open. You can almost see the lower ball bearing:
Top view, almost fully open:
Fully open, lock side:
Finally, the design does have one peculiarity, you can fold the blade in the wrong direction, at least until the thumb stud makes contact with the frame...
Paul
My Personal Website - - - - - - A Beginners Guide to Spyderco Collecting - - - - - - Kiwimania
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Nice video.
High dollar knives are high dollar because they cost more to make. It might be materials (Titanium, unubtanium, etc.), it might be tolerances (Chris' has lotsa zeros after the decimal before hitting numbers), it might be labor (carving, engraving, etc.).
Sometmes those differences are difficult if not impossible for even the trained eye to detenct, generally impossible for a new student.
Just because you can't see the difference, doesn't mean it isn't there, sometimes it just means you can't see it.
sal
At the same time there are many people that feel the knife is not worth it, I did until I read Sal Glesser's comments and bought one myself after 3 years of saving (the knife was later taken in a mugging) and I was UTTERLY UNDERWHELMED when I bought it, even though I handled it before hand I just felt like owning something of true quality for the first time in my life (like a good quality car/suite/watch/camera). Until I used it non stop, on the farm etc and everything just started "flowing" and making sence. I replaced the stolen knife with an Insingo. I will always have a CRK and they retail for around $625 here. They are, for me at least, worth it and my personal connection, what the Sebenza has meant in my life, makes it special for me.
I have rambled a bit, but I hope some of what I have said has helped you to form your own opinion on the matter.
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Well then, that settles it! Next time I need to make a few hundred cuts through rope heating up my blade and then slice phone book paper I will reach for something else.
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Owned a "few" of them and just sold the last one I had ~~ can get a Para2 & a Delica ZDP189 & a Endura for about the same price as a "Seb." and have change left over.!* {Sal & Co. make some good knives.!**}
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A great product from top-notch people
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I'll get in trouble for saying this, but in answer to the question, "Is the Sebenza that great?", I say "no". IMO the popularity and success of this product is mostly a matter of marketing hype and Internet forums. Not to mention they're downright ugly. Now there I've said it ;-) Just my opinion. Of course you are entitled to your own.
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Internet forum cannot make the success of anything.
The popularity and success of sebenzas is matter of well enginered product, well done knife, realibility, easy of use and sharpness.
Not bad also to have a knife that manteining all above can be also a nice "object" thanks to all the customization available
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Does that mean Al Gore can indirectly take credit for the Sebenza's success???
Al Gore for prezzz!!!
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CRK must have been in a special "zone" when they made my S30V Large 21 "Enigma"--because it is just about perfect in every conceivable way. The only downside I have ever experienced is that after the knife dulls a bit, it is difficult for an amateur like me to get a good edge back on it. But then, after using the Lansky system for a while, and sort of "re-profiling" it, the knife is back to its original glory.
Nothing is "wasted" on the Sebenza. There is almost as much wonder in what is omitted, as in what is included.
Nothing is "wasted" on the Sebenza. There is almost as much wonder in what is omitted, as in what is included.
Insipid Moniker
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This is the only Sebenza I have ever felt any desire to own.
wjswiger
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I've owned the Seb and found it to be a wonderfully built knife....top quality material and great finish!! However, the knife wasn't fit to my hand....this isn't a knock on CRK......it simply wasn't built for my paws!! I still love the look, the function and the quality but for my hand other knives fit me better.
If you want to laugh hard listen to Al Gore reading his global warming poem.
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Stripped screws really tick me off. I love the deep hex head screws on my Sebenza...it would be incredibly difficult to strip those things out. Is this what makes the Sebenza worth it to me? No, not by itself - but it certainly helps complete the package.
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I get confused when I see people say it's marketing hype. I guess I've been under a rock because I haven't seen all this marketing.
To say the price is all due to hype is kinda silly unless the person saying this is Chris' accountant. I have a hard time when people give hard and fast information as if they have all the info. I'm not saying that it's worth it to everybody. I carry my Seb most of the time but I also have other knives I like to carry as well. As many people have said it's very subjective. It's worth it to me but might not to you. If you feel that you can spend that much on a knife and feel comfortable with the purchase then give it a try. If not get something else. I rest assured that I will always have my Seb and I will be able to pass it down to my kids or grand kids.
To say the price is all due to hype is kinda silly unless the person saying this is Chris' accountant. I have a hard time when people give hard and fast information as if they have all the info. I'm not saying that it's worth it to everybody. I carry my Seb most of the time but I also have other knives I like to carry as well. As many people have said it's very subjective. It's worth it to me but might not to you. If you feel that you can spend that much on a knife and feel comfortable with the purchase then give it a try. If not get something else. I rest assured that I will always have my Seb and I will be able to pass it down to my kids or grand kids.
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Marketing hype is a bs term people throw around when they cant appreciate the details that are not tangible. If they cant see it, hold it or notice it then it must not be there. CRK actually does much less "marketing" than the majority of all knife companies. Many custom makers self promote much more than CRK ever has. Now the general term "hype" without the marketing part could still be considered. But I usually define hype as positive reinforcement of which their is no basis or credible supporting evidence to a products performance. This would apply to flavor of the week knife makers who are popular today and forgotten tomorrow. Their products havent stood the test of time and many praise them without even owning one. The real unicorns of the knife world. To me the sebenza is the anti hype knife. If the product was all hype it would not have remained as popular as is has without falling to the wayside. Products that are hyped fade quickly. I often dont understand why when certain people dont care for a product for whatever reason then they have to create these negative connotations about the product to justify their opinion as if they have to convince themselves that they are right. Isnt it just good enough to not like something? Why do people have to cry "hype" just because a popular product doesnt appeal to them? Seems like the whole chevy vs ford argument. Its not good enough that you like one truck over the other. The one you dont drive must just suck because you didnt choose it.