Is this real damascus?

U

user24

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Nov 10, 2006
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Hi

I have this knife and it's marketed as damascus and I'm very pleased with it (the stag handle is certainly genuine and the construction quality is good) but I'm just a little suspicious of the blade; it looks very nice but I just keep wondering if it's the real deal.

The pictures I've seen of damascus steel sometimes look as though you should be able to feel a difference between the darker and lighter parts of the blade with your nail, whereas my blade is very smooth.

Also, when looking at the back of the blade (as in, where the other edge would be if it was double-edged), it looks like there's a line of darker metal sandwiched between two silver slices rather than a damascus pattern running right through; is this my imagination or might that be indicative of 'fake' damascus (is there even such a thing? I'm thinking about laser etched, or knives that would be non-damascus were it not for acid-etching (I know acid is used to produce true damascus, but could it not also be used to produce cheap fakes?))

How could I tell if I'd been cheated? (though for the price, it's hardly a cheat)

thanks,
-h.

PS: no, I can't find a better picture, sorry :grumpy:

EDIT: yes I can - try these pics instead
 
By the time the Damascus is folded, hammered, ground and polished, you won't feel a difference. As for what you see... maybe just a result of the folding.
 
I can't tell from the photo. Some knives are "fake" damascus, the damascus-type lines are merely etches, not actual layers of steel. And some damascus knives are made with a solid core. And some (most?) damascus is acid-etched to show the layers better.

-Bob
 
The new link says that it is high carbon stainless steel with a damascus finish. Since there really isnt stainless damascus I would say no it is not.
 
Given the price I would be suprised if it was real damascus. It looks like a process called "Damascene" which layers are inlaid or etched onto the steel to give the apearence of damascus or pattern welding.
 
FlaMtnBkr said:
The new link says that it is high carbon stainless steel with a damascus finish. Since there really isnt stainless damascus I would say no it is not.
Click to expand...

interesting, I hadn't spotted that - thanks! (I'm trying to write an essay for university at the moment, so my attention is divided)

so... what the hell would "damascus finish" mean then?

Bors said:
Given the price I would be suprised if it was real damascus. It looks like a process called "Damascene" which layers are inlaid or etched onto the steel to give the apearence of damascus or pattern welding.
Click to expand...
... and thankyou for answering that!
 
You may sand out pattern and etch it back - if it is real damascus. However with this price tag it looks like Rolex for $10 each. Less expensive damascus pattern is on Japanese Suminogashi knoves - like Kanetsune or Mcasta but they all ower $100.

Thanks, Vassili.
 
There is such a thing as stainless damascus. It looks like it's Japanese factory made san-mai damascus.
 
There are many stainless damascus. There is PM damascus - Damasteel etc. And Japanese produce a lot of stainless Suminogashi, like Mcusta or Fallkinven (the one with CovryX core and stainless layered sides). Buck custom had some stainless damascus, Boker etc...

BTW - "San Mai" is term invented by Cold Steel marketing, same way as they invent Tanto pont etc. - who knows why. The right term is laminated blades which is regular solution in Japan for most knives as well as very popular in Scandinavia. In Japan they call it Warikomi, in English they call it clai, but never San Mai.

Thanks, Vassili.
 
Real damascus may or may not have a texture that allows you to feel the laminates. That depends upon the depth of the etch.
IF this is real 'damascus,' you should expect to be able to see the darker rib on the spine since it is actually a sandwich in this case (Mostly a monosteel blade with damascus veneer on both sides).
This would be a pretty inexpensive variation, if it's real, but still, I also find the term "Damascus Finish" distressing. Very suspicious.
 
Sorry if I was wrong about there not being stainless damascus. The only thing I was aware of that was close was a laminated 'san mai' blade which is usually only 3 layers. Guess I need to catch up if they are making damascus with many folds out of stainless that is then etched to reveal a pattern.
 
If I dip the blade in lemon juice (light acid) should I expect to see the pattern more prominently afterwards? Would this be a nice simple test or does it just not work like that? My reasoning is that a 'real' damascus blade will be acid etched to bring out the pattern, so dipping in lemon juice should make the pattern clearer, whereas a fake damascus won't change after a light citrus bath.
 
There is a stainless damascus. There are some Americans producing it. like Devin Thomas. A damascus finsih, however, is not damascus. You can take a carbon steel blade, put a damascus pattern on it with a magic marker, etch it in ferric chloride, and you have a damascus finish. The magic marker acts as a resist to the etch. Looks cool when done right, but isn't damascus.

Gene
 
Gene Martin said:
You can take a carbon steel blade, put a damascus pattern on it with a magic marker, etch it in ferric chloride, and you have a damascus finish. The magic marker acts as a resist to the etch. Looks cool when done right, but isn't damascus.
Click to expand...

Could you please share the exact "recipe" ? I mean things like what concentration to use, how long should the blade be immersed, etc. Thanks! :) I have plenty of FeCl3 (and HCL and similar stuff) here so I'd like to give it a try on one of my Opinels :D
 
If I dip the blade in lemon juice (light acid) should I expect to see the pattern more prominently afterwards? Would this be a nice simple test or does it just not work like that? My reasoning is that a 'real' damascus blade will be acid etched to bring out the pattern, so dipping in lemon juice should make the pattern clearer, whereas a fake damascus won't change after a light citrus bath.
Click to expand...
If a real damascus blade has already been acid-dipped, the lemon probably won't affect it any further.

-Bob
 
Bob W said:
If a real damascus blade has already been acid-dipped, the lemon probably won't affect it any further.
Click to expand...

huh. that's a shame, well, thanks for letting me know before I went and got my knives all sticky! :D
 
JCaswell said:
Real damascus may or may not have a texture that allows you to feel the laminates. That depends upon the depth of the etch.
Click to expand...

Yep, you'll find it anywhere from perfectly smooth, to "snakeskin", to "Holy cow my knife is all covered in ridges".

Mike
 
That certainly looks like real damascus to me. The blade has a core of solid steel (probably something cheap in this case) sandwiched between two separate pieces made of alternating layers. When you look down at the spine, you can see how the three slabs have been pressed together.

You could try re-etching the blade, but there's really no need. You would also have to refinish it (and remove the blade from the handle first to make it look right).

I don't know if anyone has tried to use laser engraving to replicate the appearance of damascus. I have seen some blades that were acid etched with patterns that were supposed to look like damascus, but they were pretty obviously not the real deal.

One thing I noticed is that the knives pictured on the two different websites linked to in this thread have different damascus patterns on their blades. If a cheap etching process or some other method was used to give a damascus-like finish, I think the pattern would probably be identical from knife to knife.
 
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